What do you wish a bf supporter in hospital had told you/done?

[FourArms]

I'm coming towards the end of my bf peer supporter course, and soon I'll be volunteering on the postnatal wards at our local hospital.

So... if a bf supporter had been available in your hospital, what would you have liked them to have done/told you/showed you?

I was v.lucky with DS1 and DS2. Although there were slight issues with both (c/s with DS1 and a spell in NICU for DS2) they were both v.easy to bf and it came very naturally to us all from feed one. We did have problems once we were home, so I have a lot of experience with these, but not much for problems in the early days.

Any thoughts will be gratefully received!

Things I would have found useful:

• ongoing support from the same person.

• midwives that don't say "if your baby doesn't put on weight soon I will have to refer you to a paedeatrician"(even though the baby is only a couple of days old and hasn't lost weight)

• less pressure to eat all the time "to make sure I'm generating full fat" which only made me feel fat full and bloated

• help with using a breast pump- to help boost milk supplies and/or enable my DH to feed while I sleep

• I was told my nipples were "too big"- what exactly to do about that?

• information about complementary treatments that may help (I found cranial osteopathy for the baby helped for two of my DC- don't know why but it did- and by that stage I was past caring why just desperate for some help!)

I was fortunate in that my M/W was patient and helped me get going. However, I overheard a poor lady in the next cubicle whom had just had a C/S asking the M/W to help her get baby latched on. The M/W just barked at her "I've shown you once already". I doubt that woman persevered which is such a shame.

So time and patience are required I think.

Do you mind if I'm really honest? What I wish is that someone had told me that it's ok not to bf, and that sometimes it's simply not worth the trauma. I had an absolutely terrible time feeding DS (having been totally confident that bf would 'work' for me). I could write you pages on my experience, but in a nutshell, at 5 weeks in I had:

1. Nipples so damaged that my breasts were basically open wounds and DS kept throwing up my blood.
2. My second infection - I think not caused by a blockage but by the fact that my nipples were so cracked - so that I had a temperature of 103 and just lay in bed shivering with fever.
3. A baby who screamed ALL the time. I'm not saying this was entirely caused by the feeding, but it certainly got a hell of a lot better as soon as I started FFing.

My life was just a living hell - my breasts were agony, my baby was permanently distressed, and I couldn't sleep even on the rare occasions that he slept because I was dreading the next feed so much.

It's not like I didn't have support - I saw three separate fully trained bf counsellors, who were all very nice and gave lots of advice of things to try (nipple shields, different positions/ways to latch, expressing etc etc), but none of it helped. It was quite obvious that I was falling apart at the seams, but at no point did anyone say 'If you want to stop, it's ok'. I know it's got to be the woman's decision, but I think you're so vulnerable at that time, that you just want a bit of reassurance from someone who knows what they're talking about that you've tried everything, that it's just not working for you, and that it's really ok if you give up. I finally did at 6 weeks, and spent days sobbing because I thought I'd ruined my child's life and was a total failure, and was crushed with guilt. It took me several months of having a perfectly happy, healthy baby to put it all in some sort of perspective and not beat myself up with it all the time.

I'm really not anti-bf - I'm due with my second in August and will definitely try to bf again, although I don't know how easy it will be given I've got a lot of scar tissue from last time - but I just think that someone telling you it's not the end of the world if you stop, would be so helpful sometimes. When I saw my HV a week after I'd stopped bf'ing, she said 'Thank god for that'. I could have screamed at her - why the hell didn't she say that before?? It made me fume that she obviously wasn't allowed to give me the advice she clearly thought was right.

Anyway, HTH. Sorry, I've waffled on for pages after all .

Just a word of support ElusiveMoose - I feel exactly the same due to similar experiences (not scarring, but no milk production, prob. due to hormone imbalance which causes other pregnancy problems). Your first paragraph summarises how I feel. Didn't tolerate the thought that I wouldn't be able to bf. I believed, before I had ds, that it always worked if done correctly, and that women who couldn't had just made some terrible mistake. Mainly because that was the advice our NCT leader had given us.

Felt humiliated and devastated when I couldn't get it working for me and ds, but 19 months down the line I have a happy, healthy boy. What a lot of tears and disappointment could have been saved if someone had said that it isn't the worst thing in the world if you can't do it. I know breastfed babies who are a lot less healthy than my son, but the way it was presented to me, I would have thought it was a scientific impossibility!

Just read your post properly CanariesFansMum - very funny in that if you live in the Canaries supporting region then you might have seen the same hv as me, who also told me that my nipples were too big! My reaction was the same [sceptical]. I wonder if it's just one hv going around Norwich entertaining herself by doing that to everyone. I have no idea if my nipples are actually big, I've never compared them...

I meant !

Similar to AKMD I had a very small DD 5lb4 and encountered problems of not being 'allowed' to bf her. She also failed blood sugar tests and had to be tube fed to a schedule. She vomited up most of the formula she was given and wound up nil by mouth on a drip at one point. No cause was found but on weaning her at 6 mo I found she was allergic to cows milk and I always wondered if that was the cause of her early problems. Certainly she seemed to turn a corner as soon as I could express enough to stop the formula top ups.

We were in hospital for 10 days (3 years ago) and the whole place was very orientated to pushing formula. They wrote in my notes that I was over emotional because I cried when they put a tube down DDs nose and gave her formula without my consent (I'd only gone to the loo, they said it was an emergency). There was only one electric breastpump between the whole ward and SCBU which was constantly in use. Midwives thought I was a masochist for getting up in the night to express for DD although I knew I had to if I wanted any kind of supply. When she came out of SCBU I was strongly encouraged to put her in the nursery for the night (to be bottlefed) so her crying wouldn't wake other mothers.

I also witnessed the poor support other mums got. The lady in the bed next to me had inverted nipples and was struggling to feed. One midwife recommended shields and she was overjoyed that this seemed to work but the next gave her a huge lecture on how evil shields were and took them away. Another lady didn't want her prem DS to have formula top ups and I saw her being badgered by a whole team of Drs and nurses at once about 5 standing over her in bed. I heard a young girl being told that if she wanted to be allowed home she should give her DS a bottle as they couldn't allow them home if the baby was not feeding properly.

So in summary as well as supporting individual women it would be great if you challenge practices that are anti-bf like taking babies to the nursery at night and inconsistent advice.

To put lanolin on my nipples before even trying the first time!

I'm still breast feeding after 6 months and spent the first 2 weeks in really terrible pain with them!

Stopped telling me he wasn't latched on propoerly when he was!

Allow bottle and breat combination, i did this and Sam (6 mo now) was fine! Some say it will put them off the breast but it didn't and if they are established at 6 weeks it can take a lot of the pressure off!

Exp Peer Supporter here and one of thoe most common things we pick u on is women panicking when their milk doesn't come in sraight away - often topping up in desperation when actually it's very normal not to have it for 3-4 days and topping up in between is damaging to milk production but no-one has thought to tell them before they left. Often the reason for poor milk supply later on.

Early discharge policies at hospital don't help

I have had two very different experiences. With my 1st born I had a horrendous birth ending in an emergency c-section. I was thoroughly traumatised and basically I never really got any milk. I persisted for 12 long weeks until my DDs weight fell to the 4th-centile and she was declared failure to thrive. I basically went mad and was so horrified that I couldn't give birth properly that the thought I couldn't actually feed my child was too much. It took a very kind consultant to give me a stark warning that my DD would starve to death if I didn't give her a bottle to get me to bottle feed. All other health professionals had insisted that if I just kept trying it would eventually work. The first time I gave her a bottle was the first time she smiled.

Second time around (and another C-section) I gave birth to a 5kg DS and breast feeding couldn't have been easier. I breast fed him exclusively till he was 12 months and then he went on to cows milk from a beaker.

My experience shows that not all women can breast feed all of the time and giving your baby a bottle should not be considered the worst thing in the world. My DD is now 5, 120cm tall and reading and writing so I don't think I have done her too much harm by giving her formula .

Like Knackeredmummy I had 2 very different experiences. DD1 was very premature and delivered by emergency CS and started off in SCBU with tube feeds. I was desperate to feed her but was too traumatised by the whole situation to be able to produce enough milk. She had to have donor milk from the milk bank then formula top ups, which made me feel a terrible failure. Everything I heard and read indicated that I just needed to keep trying, but even though I was obsessively pumping for up to 8 hours a day, there just wasn't enough.

With DD2 I had a really easy time BFing and it was only then that I realised that I'd never really felt any let-down reflex with DD1.

I think that the trauma of SCBU and the enormous pressure I put myself under just made my body shut down. I would have found it incredibly helpful if someone had reassured me that sometimes it really isn't possible to BF and it's not just lack of effort. It would really have helped DD as well because she failed to thrive and remained extremely underweight and unhappy until she started solids, because I was so worried about compromising my poor supply with formula.

It's good to hear your experiences knackeredmummy and shinyshoegirl. My birth was very long and quite traumatic, and perhaps that was linked to the no milk production. I lasted two weeks before topping up with formula, and over these weeks his weight kept plummetting, and I'm grateful that eventually my old midwife saw us and said that he really needs 'an easy meal'. After that feed he was contented and not looking desperate for the first time.

It's good to hear that the same might not happen with a future dc, so thanks for giving a little hope on that front.

I think the main thing will be to listen to the women you are aiming to support and find an empathetic approach.

I had a very bad experience with a BF support person (she was paid by the hospital I believe as part of a positive drive to improve the dire numbers attempting to BF in my area).

All I needed was some advice on comfortable positions and holds for post C/S feeding. What I got was a lengthy lecture on the benefits of breastfeeding after which she wanted my postcode for her records. It was not supportive or motivating in the slightest - she could not recognise that I was exhausted, had lost a lot of blood and just needed to get on with it. In the end my mum (who is reserve personified) told her to go away.

I would have liked to be warned about the end of the breastfeeding period. I went into a major hormonal shift/depression. All the breastfeeding booklets (LLL) talked about were the techniques etc. which is quite right, obviously, but I just wasn't prepared for the crisis that I am sure had to do with the weaning. It would not have put me off bf to expect it.

i feel the same as indigobarbie. emotional rollercoster. i tried it for first week or so was in tears over it. felt like such a failure, didn't realise it would be so difficult.

Different midwives telling you diffrent things. one midwife who was fine with me, on one occasion said maybe i was finding it difficult because i didn't have huge breasts. well i may have been first time mother but i soon put her right, i said actually i read in breastfeeding booklet breast size has nothing to do with it. everyone woman regardless of size can breastfeeed so long as she is producing milk, it's a fallacy. she was old school, that quietened her.

they say you cant mix feed. so is breastfeeding only for mothers who have time to leave all housework and cooking aside. also not for mothers who work? because im getting mixed messages. midwifes on one hand say its ok to bottle feed if wife is at work. then breastfeed when you get in. but for mothers who stay home its a different piece of advice.

i really want to stick with breastfeeding my next child for few months if possible, least 6 months, thats my hope. But does it take up all your time? because i have 2 other kids under age of 4 and a mother in law with dementia to care for. my husband is not the most patient of men he will help but i dont think he'd cope with domestics well alone.

My BF experiences were not all that recent but there was some help in the hospital. formula was available but not promoted! still had hidously cracked bleeding nipples but thank the lord for nipple shields. BF oldest dd for 11 months and youngest for 7 months, only stopped when they wouldnt feed anymore, neither ever had a bottle. so i am a great advocate for nipple shields (even tho i was told by a contrary midwife that i was 'starving the poor wee pet!!'

I found with my first I couldn't remember anything, didn't have a clue how to breast feed or when and for how long, my second will be different. I think because midwifes know the drill some of them forget that you havent got a clue and I think new mums should be given some guide lines either before delivery or straight away after giving birth maybe if i was given advice straight away i would have taken to it more easily

I've only read the original post but thinking back over my 4 DC, I would say that I would have appreciated knowing that each baby can be very different.

My first baby fed well and was very easy. I was a star breastfeeder! Then along came my second and she was so fussy. She would think about feeding, go on, change her mind, come off, get squirted in the face, cry, think about it, have another go, take in too much, gulp, get hiccups, cry... on and on.

She was an early c-section which I've always thought was part of the issue. I would have really appreciated someone coming round and seeing if it was going ok rather than assuming that because I was on my second child I knew what I was doing.

4th baby was a rather large 10lb 14 and they kept taking blood samples to keep an eye on his sugar levels because larger babies are at risk of hypoglycemia. While I didn't have an issue with this, and having researched it, I can see why it was necessary - the attitude of the maternity staff was 'you'll have to give him formula' rather than encouraging me to feed and feed and feed him. Even though I had just given birth, had this lovely healthy baby, had breastfed 3 other children, they seemed too quick to try to give him formula (which I refused). Fortunately his sugar levels were ok and he is still solely breastfed 9 months on .

Incidentally, my friend's baby was given a bottle in hospital while she was sleeping because they 'didn't want to wake her'. After hearing this I scrawled across my birth plan that my baby/ies were not to be given formula without my consent.

About 12 different midwives tried to get ds1 breastfeeding in the 5 days after he was born. Eventually on day 6, another midwife visited me at home, took one look at me attempting to bf him and told me to forget the 'correct' way of doing it and just plonk his head on a pillow. Immediately, he breast-fed for 45 minutes - the previous record was about 5 mins (we were topping up with formula).

I often think, if that midwife hadn't called round then I would not have breast-fed ds1, I am so grateful to her!

I'd have liked to be taught how to feed lying down with ds1, as it made a real difference in the early days with ds2 - I was in a midwife led unit with him and they were much more positive about co-sleeping - in hospital with ds1 it was made out to be a complete no-no.

I'd also like to have been told with ds1 that he wasn't going to starve if he finished a breast in 5 minutes and wanted the other side. The whole fore and hind milk thing made me really paranoid that he wasn't getting enough, and it's only on here and kellymom that I've really picked up the information that's made me confident with my speedy feeders.

Had ecs and would have been handy to know that I would be VERY man handled on night one EVERY 3 HOURS to draw off colosterum and syringe into baby to get my boobs started.
I had no idea n thought it would all just 'happen'. V painfull
Also I only ever intended to bf for 3 months and once home with some bf issues hv visitor informed me it takes 3 months to fully establish, so all started to feel like hell on earth for no real gain.
My boobs weren't enough for baby and I wish someone had been frank.
I'm not a martyr to bf and wish I hadn't been so encouraged.
I feel this put me n baby thru unnecessary stress when all I was ever interested in was a happy alert baby (not constant hunger crying and one feed drifting into another)
If it aint working call it a day! I just kept being told my experience was not uncommon and it would get better, it didn't.
The most helpful people were formula helplines who were just sympathetic mothers and frankly were biased for bf over formula but honest enough to say 'at this stage its very important that you start to get some sleep' (11 weeks old n still feeding 2 hourly for an hour! thought I was gonna die!)

I'd just like somebody who didn't say 'Your nipples are too flat - you'll never be able to breastfeed. Give it a go but there's formula in that box over there if you want it.'

Coming to this a bit late - but I wish I'd known some of the stuff on here.

I was very lucky to have a great experience in hospital (happy to 'name and praise' - Surrey County in Guildford) - encouraged to bf as soon as I could after giving birth, and shown how to feed lying down as had blood loss and wasn't able to sit up. Massive encouragement to keep trying over next couple of days - skin to skin - syringing colostrum for me when I was too tired to think straight.

Was really useful that they weren't too stressed when my DS didn't feed much for the first day, and were happy to leave it some time. Being told about tiny stomach size was really useful as well.

Gentle encouragement and praise when it worked were most important things. A quiet feeding room away from the ward was also helpful.

Most of my 'I wish' are about the NCT breastfeeding class beforehand - more pictures of people breastfeeding who don't have boobs like Dolly Parton. I know they say even people with small boobs can feed (and I now know that's true), but it doesn't help that every picture shows boobs bigger than the baby's head.
More effort to make bf seem less 'knit your own yoghurt' - and don't tut at people if they laugh at some of the more ridiculous aspects!

Also, remember that most mums today were born when ff was the big thing, so telling people who were ff as babies that it's almost guaranteed to lead to adult obesity and lifelong ill health, is not overly helpful.

Wow - obviously felt more strongly about this than I thought!

Totally agree with the poster who mentioned having to "shape" the breast if larger in that department, once shown how by my community midwife on day 3 things really clicked into place for us and we are still going strong at 6 months.

Oh and the non stop feeding too!

Also find a pillow/support that suits you because it will become invaluable, I ended up with a firm bed pillow rather than a shaped one which we still use now.

a.bf is not the be all end all.ff is ok
b.it does hurt, and is hard
c.pushing mums breast in baby mouth in not establishing a latch.it is rough and unnecessary
d.dont beat yourself up or set too high expectations if bf doesnt work