Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

Should maternity units provide formula?

240 replies

hunkermunker · 31/12/2008 23:37

Or should you have to take it in with you if you're planning to ff?

I can see both sides of this - but what's your experience and how did you feel about it?

OP posts:
faeriemoo · 01/01/2009 14:39

By bubbleymummy on Thu 01-Jan-09 14:28:14
fallenmadonna, I think if people have chosen to formula feed in advance, they should bring it with them. It's a tricky one because I think if people know the hospital has some 'for emergencies' they won't bother AND it might encourage mummies who are intending to BF to bring their own 'just in case'...sigh...rock and a hard place!

-------

Yes, this! If it was a decision to FF in advance, it should be provided by the mother. If not and it is circumstantial it should be provided by the hospital whilst it is needed and cannot be provided by the parents.

faeriemoo · 01/01/2009 14:40

By TheFallenMadonna on Thu 01-Jan-09 14:31:53
But to return to my earlier point, if they don't bring it...

------

Then of course it should be provided, no poor mite should have to starve! That would be inhumane.

juuule · 01/01/2009 14:50

I think it should be provided by the hospital.

I used hospital supplied bottles of formula with my first baby. I was in hospital for 3 days. While in there I was shown and helped to bf. So a bit of mixed feeding for those first days. I think the bottles took the pressure off me while I learned what I was doing. Pressure possibly due to the fact that I wasn't aware that babies didn't really need any milk for the first few days anyway but, even so.

Once I came out I was feeling more confident about the bf-ing and had a great m/w who helped me get over the first painful days.
Only bf him for 12 weeks as went back to work. But by then I knew what I was doing and went on to bf my next 8 babies and didn't use any ff from the hospital again.

So in my situation the fact that the hospital provided the bottles of formula helped me with bf-ing my first baby.

mosschops30 · 01/01/2009 14:52

yes but faerie your version of circumstantial is mothers who cant bf for medical reasons.
Would you be happy to have crying, vulnerable mums struggling just to up your bf quota?

IMHO it is more important to have a happy mum and a happy baby and if that means ff then so be it.

ClarissimoUsedToBePeachy · 01/01/2009 14:54

'If it is a problem that occurs post-birth then yes of course formula should be provided if that is what is needed to prevent a baby from starving, but it should only be provided until some can be brought it by a relative or friend.'
that's plain ridiculous! formula needed for medical reasons post birth is medication not something to be rationed!

ds3's milk was on prescription after all

educate themselves? I did the unicef course in bf pre ds3. i strill couldnt bf him exclusively. its nly a totally dairy excluded diet that allows it with ds4 and I fed him ama.

there are soman other good reasons not to bf as well- for example did you know that it is suggested women with auto immune disease and a family history f autism dont bf in order to reduc asd risk? is that really a choice that should be penalised?

Reallytired · 01/01/2009 14:55

I think its important to treat the mother with some humanity. She is more than just a pair of breasts!

When my son was born I had to express as he had moderate jaudice and had problems feeding. I had major problems expressing milk and infact I even expressed blood as I was so desperate for him to have enough milk. I was quite grateful for him being giving some formula in hospital to top up.

I would like there to be some formula available in certain circumstances. I would not object to an HIV mother or a mother who had had a mastecomy, or a mother on drugs that contradict breastfeeding being given free formula. However I think that other mothers should only be allowed free formula in hospital if they have made a serious attempt at breastfeeding.

I don't think there is an issue of cost. Many formula companies are happy to give their formula for free to newborns.

The hospital that my son was born in had a special kitchen for mothers to make up formula. They felt it was important that mothers who wanted to use formula learnt how to make it up correctly.

SwedesInACape · 01/01/2009 14:55

Yes, ff should be available. I've seen women reduced to total wrecks, begging for formula to feed their unsettled newborn babies because they are not managing because there is insufficient (wo)manpower to help them make breastfeeding a success.

I'd like to put the message across that just because you gave your baby a few formula feeds in hospital in the first few days, it's not too late to breastfeed.
The first couple of days postpartum isn't exactly the best time to be embarking on a new time-consuming, painful, skill and looking after the other needs of this new small person whilst simultaneously being deprived of sleep.

ClarissimoUsedToBePeachy · 01/01/2009 14:57

kayzr '
She said my milk is too watery but it looks exactly as its described in the book. Also DS2 starts of with really quick sucking and small pauses and then towards the end he takes less sucks with bigger pauses. Both of which are said to be quite normal. '

sounds very normal to me

if baby s gauining any weuight and is having wet /dirty napies and alert baby is doing OK

stuff the HV

mosschops30 · 01/01/2009 14:59

Can I just ask why we think the NHS shouldnt provide free formula?
Is it because it costs too much?
Is it because it encourages ff?
Just what is the reasoning behind this thread?

This is making me so angry, the NHS waste fucking thousands of pounds a year yet, so please dont tell me its a money issue

Leo9 · 01/01/2009 15:03

Of course they should. Things are not always good after a birth and some people are not going to manage to BF for many reasons. Of course it should be available because those babies deserve food as much as BF babies! Not all new mothers would have visitors to go out and fetch them formula and it needs to be available.

ClarissimoUsedToBePeachy · 01/01/2009 15:48

mosschops I assumed it was the encouragement of non bf issue

but tbh I don't think it does do that. I dn't think if a woman sees a tin of formula she thinks 'must stop bf'. the issue is support and acceptance of bf imo.

Reallytired · 01/01/2009 16:06

SwedesInACape I disagree with you, mixed feeding in early days can sabortage breastfeeding. Many babies get confused between the sucking relex needed for bottle and the nipple. This can lead to the baby sucking a nipple instead of the tongue action needed. The poor mother can end up very sore.

Also the colustrum really helps the baby to be healthy.

"The first couple of days postpartum isn't exactly the best time to be embarking on a new time-consuming, painful, skill and looking after the other needs of this new small person whilst simultaneously being deprived of sleep. "

It probably isn't the best time, but there is little choice. Even if you choose to formula feed then you still have to learn to look after this little person.

slackrunner · 01/01/2009 16:22

I'm very glad that ff was available in hospital. My dd has severe CP (we didn't know it when she was born) and as a result struggled to bf BIG TIME. I ended up staying in hospital for five days with her until I eventually managed to get bf to work for us (with the aid of lots of expressing and staff support and bloody mindedness from me).

Having ff available should we have needed it took a lot of the pressure off me, even though I dodn't use it. To have known at 3am in the morning when I was trying to get her to latch on that there was no alternative nutrition available to her would have finished me off quite frankly (and I fully planned to BF so would not have taken FF with me I suspect).

IMO not providing ff is a ridiculous idea.

bubbleymummy · 01/01/2009 16:23

Reallytired, I agree that mixed feeding can sabotage breastfeeding but I think the point that was being made (correct me if I am wrong swedesinacape) is that just because a woman does resort to a bottle on a couple of occasions doesn't mean she HAS to give up completely on the idea of breastfeeding. My friend has said so many times that if she knew she could have kept trying to breastfeed after she gave her DD a bottle she would have done but she thought that once she had a bottle that was it - there was no going back.

juuule · 01/01/2009 16:49

As I said before I think that using bottles in hospital in the first few days supported me get started with breastfeeding.

faeriemoo · 01/01/2009 16:59

I guess it, again, comes down to the level of support available.

juuule, I am happy to hear that your mix feeding allowed you to establish a good BF relationship with your baby. Unfortunately, for every happy story, there are ten sad ones - for example the mother who offered one bottle of formula, then asked the midwife for help and was told "Oh, I'm busy just now, just give another bottle of formula just now and I'll see you later" and leaves hospital a FFer, against everything she wanted.

I still believe that if a mother chooses to formula feed in advance with no medical reasons or special circumstances (e.g. babies dietary needs), she should provide her own, in the same way that if you didn't like what was on offer on the hospital menu, you'd ask your partner to bring you in some food.

SalLikesCoffee · 01/01/2009 17:09

Faeriemoo, on your second point - if she brought in formula from home, how would that be different? Surely that would increase her not getting help, as then she wouldn't even have to ask the mw in the first place?

juuule · 01/01/2009 17:10

I realise I might be being a bit naive here but I don't understand why mothers don't just use trial and error to feed their baby if they've been shown initially how to. With my first I remember that once he'd been washed, weighed and warmed up he was given to me and I was shown how to hold him and how to put him to the breast(which was just going over what I'd been shown at antenatal classes only this time with a real baby).
The rest of the time the m/w were too busy to be spending a lot of time with me and I was more or less left to my own devices.
We did have an afternoon babycare session. One day it was 'how to bath a baby' and the next day it was 'how to make up a bottle'.

I only really got started bf-ing in earnest once I got home.

faeriemoo · 01/01/2009 17:14

By SalLikesCoffee on Thu 01-Jan-09 17:09:20
Faeriemoo, on your second point - if she brought in formula from home, how would that be different? Surely that would increase her not getting help, as then she wouldn't even have to ask the mw in the first place?

-----

Because if she brought formula at home at least it would show she had thought about the possibility of formula feeding in the early days, rather than just reaching for the formula out of the desperation of those first 24-48 hours that I guess most of us have had.

I know in the early days/weeks, my BF relationship with my DD2 was saved by thinking "Just one more feed/day then I'll decide" and working through any problems. If formula had been readily available at the click of a finger, it might have been a different story.

SalLikesCoffee · 01/01/2009 17:15

Because sometimes something might not be textbook.

In my case my baby was a little weak at first. All the books I've read said to tickle them / blow in their faces etc etc if they don't drink, and I tried all that but he kept stopping after less than five minutes. I'd put him down and not long he'd want milk again. Repeat.

Only after someone said to ignore all that, that he was just tired, to let him drink a sip or two, let him rest for 5 or 10 minutes, another sip etc etc until he got strong enough for a proper feed, did I feel relaxed and successful about it. If I was at home I'd have thought I don't have enough milk.

faeriemoo · 01/01/2009 17:16

juuule - great post. Unfortunately, not all expectant mothers attend BFing workshops/antenatal classes or pick up a book during their pregnancy so don't know what to expect. It can be somewhat daunting when you are expected to just get on with things, especially after a traumatic or tiring labour.

faeriemoo · 01/01/2009 17:18

SLC - glad you managed to sort things out. However it is much more widely publicised now that rooming in and skin to skin contact is one of the best ways to encourage a reluctant and sleepy feeder.

A lot of literature and research is outdated - this is also a problem.

SalLikesCoffee · 01/01/2009 17:21

True. What I found strange is that this was also the advice I was given by most of the midwives (hence the suggestion about annual courses / occasional retraining if that's not your speciality).

juuule · 01/01/2009 17:21

So are you saying fairiemoo, that a large number of new mothers have no idea whatsoever about how to put a baby's mouth onto a nipple? and that nobody ever shows them how to at least once in the immediate period after giving birth? and that by not having formula available in hospitals would help rectify that situation?

SwedesInACape · 01/01/2009 17:29

BubbleyMummy - Thanks. Yes, that was pecisely what I was trying to say. Very inelegantly.

I have no dount it sabbotages breasfeeding sometimes but perhaps because there is this feeling of there is no going back after the baby's lips have touched the demon bottle teat.

My advice to anyone keen to breastfeed would be to get out of hospital as quickly as possible and engage the assistance of proper breastfeeding support. If you give a bottle before you get out of there, it's really NOT the end of breastfeeding.