Should maternity units provide formula?

[hunkermunker]

Or should you have to take it in with you if you're planning to ff?

I can see both sides of this - but what's your experience and how did you feel about it?

So you weould have 15 women bringing in their own sterilisers, boiling kettles, using up fridge space, how would that work. Surely the cost to the NHS would be less just providing a couple of days worth of formula.
I dont think it would promote bf, it certainly wouldnt have made my life easier or harder.
What would have made it easier would be more midwifery staff, with better bf knowledge, better attitudes towards ff and bf, and with more time to spend with new mums.
IMHO the bf help for women in this country sucks, and thats what need improvement not the withdrawal of ff in hospitals. Its like thinking that putting cigarettes under the counter will deter smokers - utter bollocks

normally =/= always.

HTH

well said

it is not hte provision of formula that is the issue it is the lack of breastfeeding support

it is MWs telling ladies to top up if baby is too big/small, early/late

it is HVs saying top up if baby feeds too much/not enough

it is lack of 24 hour , 365 day a year accurate, correct and unbiased breastfeeding support that is the problem

giving or not giving out formula in hospital is a red herring IMO

"So you weould have 15 women bringing in their own sterilisers, boiling kettles, using up fridge space, how would that work. Surely the cost to the NHS would be less just providing a couple of days worth of formula."

No, I would prefer 15 women breastfeeding on demand with no need for access to a steriliser (which I'd already said the hospital should provide) unless to express milk for sick babies or to donate if they have a surplus of milk). Very, very few women actually physically cannot breastfeed and this is usually known about pre-birth, so they could provide their own formula. As I have stated numerous times, formula should be provided as required for those who genuinely need it.

I completely agree with the need for trained BF counsellors available 24/7 in all maternity units but unfortunately the funding is not in place whilst the NHS are having to provide free formula to baby Tom, Dick and Harry because Mummy didn't want to breastfeed.

look, there is far more wastage in the NHS than you are making out

the provision of formula is low on a lsit of things that could be cut back on within the maternity services and the NHS as a whole

your last line is really quite patronising and i think you are trying to be provocative

IMO, the problem is not with the midwives and HVs that sometimes give inaccurate advice, it is with many women's lack of educating themselves about things.

A lot of women go into birth and parenthood thinking that everything will be handed to them on a plate. They take doctor/midwive/auntie Jean's advice on everything from infant nutrition to schools.

Women need to be told that they can educated themselves. This isn't the dark ages anymore when women had to be barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen.

I have already read replies on this thread that make me sad. Women who think they have no choices.

and how will they educate themselves, if not by attending classes or asking HCPs ?

you can read lots of books etc but until that baby is in your arms, and you cna;t get baby lathced on ,then what?

artifical feeding is a choice a lot of women make, some make an informed choicel, some don;t and cutting off access to milk within the hospital won;t change things a jot and will breed resentment and anger IMO

But it is - IMO - true that most women who give up breastfeeding in the couple of days they spend in a post-natal ward give up because they want to give up, not because they have to. Two days is not long enough to try to breastfeed IMO. You either try or you don't. If you don't, provide your own (with the exceptions I've already stated).

Sore nips, cracked nips, engorgement and lack of sleep are NORMAL for early breastfeeding days. If mother's educated themselves about this in the first place there would be far, far less need to reach for the formula, especially in those precious first few days.

Until the lack of breastfeeding support in hospital is rectified, sadly woman have to educate themselves. It shouldn't be like that, but it is.

If a woman came in with no formula, what else could the hospital do but provide some? You can't force a woman to breastfeed FGS.

fariemoo youre really starting to get on my nerves now.

I could not bf first time because dd just simply wasnt interested, she wouldnt latch on despite nurmerous attempts by myself and numerous inept midwives.
When I managed to bf ds, after a week it was so terribly painful that i was screaming in pain at each feed and ds was drinking more blood than breastmilk, dh took matters into his own hands and decided he could no longer see his wife or his son crying all day and went out and bought formula, after which both his wife and his child were contented and satisfied (and not in pain)!!

Your assumption that women formula feed because they cant be bothered is ignorant and insulting. Women should have the right to choice, in everything, and removing formula from hospitals would not fund the amount of bf counsellors and good training for mw's that is needed.
Maybe the NHS could stop treating piss-heads every weekend and make them pay for their treatment in a private A&E, that would fund a bf counsellor for every woman on a 1:1 basis IMHO.
Why take away choice, if you want funding the NHS wastes plenty of money elsewhere

I gave up after 3 days because I had to with DS1. He would not latch on no matter what I tried or what the MWs tried. I was constantly fobbed off being told it was due to the pethedine I had in labour and he would 'wake up'. In the end I had to give him the formula and despite initally wanting to FF I hated it so much.

I wanted to express but my MWs said I couldn't until he was 6 weeks old or it would affect my supply and cause DS1 nipple confusion.

DS2 is given formula top ups. Now down to 1-2 a day but was having about 6 top ups 2 weeks ago. When you are told by your MW that if you don't give formula top ups they might take your baby into hospital what are you supposed to do?

Oh what rubbish FM! I read up every single book and online discussion that I could find, went to antenatal classes, yet, until I had my baby in my arms, I had no clue. (And yes, even practiced holding a pillow, a doll etc, in advance and all. )

mosschops, it sounds like you had a very stressful experience of breastfeeding but do you not think if you had had proper support in hospital instead of the 'numerous inept midwives' and someone who you could have contacted/visited after you left the hospital that you could have solved your problems and continued? You obviously felt that you had no alternative to formula so was that really a choice for you? You should have had the choice of proper support so that you could have continued to feed your baby the way you wanted to!
faeriemoo, cracked nipples aren't 'normal' in the early days and are really a problem that needs to be resolved or it can get quite serious. However, I do appreciate what you are saying in that breastfeeding is often portrayed as easy, so when these problems do materialise women think they are doing something wrong. If the knowledge was there that these were common problems that CAN be resolved with the proper help (and the proper help was provided!) I think breastfeeding rates would greatly improve. I think attending a breastfeeding support group as part of your antenatal care would give pregnant women the opportunity to speak to mums with real experiences of breastfeeding who had overcome these problems and this would maybe give new mums more confidence in themselves if they encountered the same problems.

absolutelky bubbley i do think that with proper support i could have bf dd or continued to bf ds. However I dont think the way to this is to remove formula from maternity units to fund it. For one, it wouldnt be enough and two, yes it was a choice for me at that time.
So until the NHS provides that support to women 24 hrs a day 365 days a year then they should provide formula

Kayzr, your experience just empasises how important it is to have specialist breastfeeding support in hospitals. So many midwives just give inaccurate advice! Premature babies who are fed through tubes/bottles for several weeks go on to successfully breastfeed. Expressing and giving your DS a bottle would have been so much better than you having to switch to formula against your wishes.
I also wish more women knew that giving a bottle wasn't the end of breastfeeding. Many women successfully switch back to fully breastfeeding after they have given bottles...

Mosschops I agree that formula will not be able to be removed from hospitals until the support is there for breastfeeding but I do think it shouldn't be as readily given out. Also, if it is given, breastfeeding support should still be offered so that the mum can switch back to breastfeeding if that is what she wants.

I think I just have the worlds worst stand in MW. With DS1 my normal MW had broken her ankle and with DS2 my normal MW was on holiday. Both times I was sent the same MW.

With DS2 I tried to say that we didn't want to give him any formula but she actually forced DH to the shop by saying that if he didn't go and get it she would have to admit DS2.

But the OP is referring to people who have chosen to ff. Do you think it shouldn't be so readily handed out to them?

kayzr! what a horrible woman - did you report her?

No but my HV wants too. I am quite annoyed as I've just got that 'Bestfeeding' book and a couple of the things that she said were going wrong are in there and it says it is normal.

She said my milk is too watery but it looks exactly as its described in the book. Also DS2 starts of with really quick sucking and small pauses and then towards the end he takes less sucks with bigger pauses. Both of which are said to be quite normal.

Completely normal! Well done you for doing the research yourself. I would definitely report her - other women may not be as strong as you in resisting her inaccurate advice and opinions!

fallenmadonna, I think if people have chosen to formula feed in advance, they should bring it with them. It's a tricky one because I think if people know the hospital has some 'for emergencies' they won't bother AND it might encourage mummies who are intending to BF to bring their own 'just in case'...sigh...rock and a hard place!

Btw (sorry OP, realise slightly off-topic), insufficient bf-ing training isn't only an NHS problem, so not only due to funding. I went private, and the midwives I saw gave completely contrasting advice to the breastfeeding specialist I eventually saw on my last day. She said they gave me out of date advice, and with her assistance, everything got a lot easier. Maybe a change in legislation with compulsory bf-ing training (perhaps attending courses every year) would help too? Just an idea.

But to return to my earlier point, if they don't bring it...