Can anyone recommend a good organic formula milk for newborns?

[megglewell]

Have read a bit about HIPP but no others..

weejie, are you new to MN? i'm just wondering, because it's perfectly common for people to post that they don't want a bf debate, just info on ff thanks.

and tbh even if they do, no one can legislate for the www, so people can observe the feelings of the OP or not. there are other sites, where ffing advice (much of it out of date and dangerous, but never mind) is available without there ever being a dangerous whiff of bfing. i suppose at the end of the day you pays your money (or not) and you takes your choice. if the OP had been offended (and she wasn't) then there are ample numbers of other sites to try.

I have said sorry, once, already chequers, for my misunderstanding. I have not attacked anyone until someone told me to reel my neck in or some such rubbish.

i can give as good as i can get but i am clever enough to not get personal first.

so I will apologise for nothing else.

we are all big girls.

freddy agreed with someone else, who asked maybe rhetorically, why would anyone opened this thread. i can assume sincerity and respond to that poster.

what is the problem with that.

no i am not having a bad day. i am not even being aggressive just straight to the point.

is there a problem with that??

have a look at this
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/1364/44762 - can't you see the difference in tone? this is so much more balanced, and so much more supportive

and again tiktok - this is not an attack on you, it is regret at the cumulative amount of posts on BF and their tone at the start of this threas - for which there has been a very thoughtful apology so we don't need to go into who said what

and yes, I am new, but as my introductory debate, you can see why I thought that it might be worth somehow flagging up 'don't mention BF' without having to go through this kind of debate or even any questions; and also tbh, with some of the sarky comments of late in this debate, why I doubt I will ever become a huge fan

sadly...

"If you can't keep up with the thread then don't jump in half-cocked."

this btw, is the lecture I have been given.

no one tells me ever, when to post or not to post.

i have the democratic right to put my foot in my mouth if that is what I please to do.

Tiktok - thanks for the links but I am pmsl a bit tbh
Only one of those links is a true ff discussion about volume - and it tis very short.
Most of the links have the OP state that they have bf for x number of months etc (perhaps feeling that they need to state they have bf so as not to judged too much)
One thread starts off well , then the 7th poster mentions how she had a battle with the hosp staff to NOT give formula (in bold) - this thread then continues with many posters mentioning their fear of being 'lynched' for discussing ff

Sadly I think you have missed my point

weejie - threads will differ in tone, of course they will. The one you flag up mentions breastfeeding, too...but no one has told anyone off for being 'insensitive' for bringing the topic up.

Lesson for you, there, maybe???

As Aitch says, other internet sites are available if people want to talk about ff with no mention of bf at all, and this might suit some people better, I suppose. I prefer mumsnet as I think we do get debates and discussions as well.

er....your point,DK, was there was 'nowhere' on mumsnet where people could discuss ff without being offended or a heated debate. I linked to 6 - count 'em - where people discussed ff without being offended or a heated debate, and where people shared info and experiences and feelings.

Genuinely puzzled here. If your point was different, then I am not a mind reader

Some ff are short, true - as are some bf ones. If the question is straightforward, is answered promptly, then the thread tends to end.

"you can see why I thought that it might be worth somehow flagging up 'don't mention BF' without having to go through this kind of debate or even any questions"

it is often flagged up by the OP, weejie. the people who responded know that because they're not new to MN. you are kinda teaching your grandmother to suck eggs, tbh, and much as you have apologised i would re-iterate that you didn't show a great deal of sensitivity when you pulled the first posters up and that's the reason, i feel, that the thread became badly derailed. there are thousands of ways that you might have presented your (completely reasonable and correct) case more pleasantly.

the idea of having a 'safe' zone for ffers is disgracefully separatist imo, i ff dd but i've learned enough from hanging around on these joint boards to want to give it a bloody good go if there's a second time. that's very valuable and would be a shame to lose just because some people can't bear to live with the thought that they didn't give their child the 100% best nourishment, at least imho. it's just a fact, there's no point in putting our hands over our ears and going la la la.

Hey

I prefer mn too thanks and I have been on the anti natal / post natal threads and have made good (virtual) friends.

Do I need to go to another internet site to take freely about ff??

Tiktok, you and Aitch are very frequent posters on mn - do you then expect to command respect from us lesser users?
Do you also feel it is right to suggest we go elsewhere to discuss ff?
Sounds like if you don't like bf then get off our site to me
Could even say a little bit bullying

Those comments of yours do not sit well with me - but perhaps I'm being sensitive

did you see that i ff, DKMA? you read that bit? so why on earth would i be against the discussion of ff?

no tiktok, they don't call anyone insensitive, but they do mention being lynched for discussing FF

here is a quote from the discussion (don't know if it ss ok to do this but am a bit of a newbie)

"artyjoe - don't worry! You won't be lynched by me! Just been a few nasty 'breast vs bottle' threads recently and a few of the breast feeding brigade are on a bit of a crusade! Hopefully they'll avoid this thread!

I was just joking with you but I suppose it's lost if you didn't see the other threads!"

and this was one of the few times bf was mentioned!

again, no personal attacks intended here, but there is this feeling going on from what I've read here, and what people have told me, so really, won't it only help the BF case if those who strongly advocate it are aware of how they may come across?

weejie, if you are not a fan of sarky remarks, then mumsnet is prob not the place for you...you should read other threads if you think this one got a bit hot to handle

Seriously, though, stick around and get used to the cut and thrust, and resist telling other old-timers what to do or not to be insensitive until your feet are under the table. That sounds more 'emphatic' than I intend, I think, as every website/talkboard needs new people all the time, and that's great...but it's like joining in a convo at a party or a club. You listen first, pick up on the vibes and the drift of what's going on. And then you join in, and when you first join in, your introductory contributions are not, normally, a sentence or two complaining about others' behaviour, followed by some ideas on how the organisation could be changed. Are they?

i've got this feeling from what i've read here, and from what people have told me, that a lot of ffers read stuff that actually isn't written on the page and instead project their own feelings about ffing and bfing and take offence where none is ever intended...

aitch, you are missing the piont, big style

do tell, shinola.

DKMA - eeeek! No, of course you don't need to go elsewhere to talk about ff....and no, I don't command respect ( ) 'cos of being around for longer....dear me. Blimey. Talk about ff all you want and I'll join in too. The thread you mention is not a heated debate, and people are worried about being 'lynched' and this fear is quelled. It doesn't prove your point at all.

It is very, very rare that there is criticism of formula feeding mothers - when there is, that's where the virtual lynching takes place. There is a lot of imagined criticism - for instance, there have been suggestions on this thread that ff mothers are criticised here and they really have not been.

I have been in here enough to get a sense of people feeling uncomfortable - I refer you back to my previous post where someone mentions being 'lynched'

and I think a fair few people agreed the cumulative effect of the posts at the start of this was problematic

but tiktok, you are having a go at me, again, which is why I think this got out of hand in the first place

Aitch yes I did see that you ff, and you hung around on these forums for long enough to want to give bf a go - but that was you, your circumstances etc etc.
To say 'would be a shame to lose just because some people can't bear to live with the thought that they didn't give their child the 100% best nourishment' is very much your attitude to it.

There is a real feeling amongst some of us (perhaps the braver ones) who feel we need some space from the bf debate (for whatever reason - not for you to judge) and we are struggling to discuss our feeding choice freely on mn.
Can you understand that?

And for the record I too bf - so stick that in yer pipe and smoke it

My beef here is NOTHING to do with 'breast v's bottle' but that ff are mnetters too y'know!

the piont is that people are feeling overwhlmed by the bf debate and frankly want a break from it all, somewhere safe where they can discuss the issues, and how to do that but at the same time support people who may not know about bf is an intersting question, and by prolonging the sarky and more personal natiure of this you are just keeping this whole thing going round in circles and a bit unpleasant

well as i said before, plenty of times people write in their OP that they really don't want to discuss bfing. whether or not people observe that is up to them, it's a public forum, you can't have an MNHQ ruling on it surely? bfing comments would be deleted? is that what you're suggesting?

we're all grown-ups, aren't we? if i saw someone explicitly say that they didn't want any discussion of bfing i'd adhere to that easily, and i'd be inclined to point it out to people that weren't adhering to it. but at the end of the day... if the OP thinks that they can control a global population's response to a qu, they're mistaken. and yes, they maybe should think about going to a more segregated, more censored site.

the OP in this instance didn't care either way, i note, not for the first time, so weejie was most definitely responding to something that wasn't there.

shinola, how funny, you don't see the inherent irony in your last sentence?

I disagree that ff are 'taking offence where not intended' and 'projecting'

I agree that it is rare for there to be outright criticism of ff mothers - however it is VERY common for little comments, snipes, even well meaning advice where it is not asked for (with the best intentions) to make ff parents feel mn is not a comfortable place to discuss such things.

I have bf, mixed fed and FF - I have no projection issues Aitch and I count myself on neither side, I'm just saying it how I see it.

Tiktok - as a first time mum with an exclusively breastfed four-month old, I would like to say a big thank you to you for continuing to post on this board despite what I see as fairly extreme provocation not to, as I have learnt a huge amount about breastfeeding (and formula feeding too) from reading your posts over the past few months.

Hopefully knowing the good you are doing from sharing your knowledge will help you to continue doing so!

and, again, for the record, I have bf no probs, I'm saying how other peopple see the little comments as DKMA said it, and a quck review of other discussions will show you people alluding to this, as per the lynch comment I posted

i have bf, mix fed and ff as well, DKMA, and i am seeing it as i see it.

re; "I agree that it is rare for there to be outright criticism of ff mothers - however it is VERY common for little comments, snipes, even well meaning advice where it is not asked for (with the best intentions) to make ff parents feel mn is not a comfortable place to discuss such things."

what is your solution? a ffers-only zone? presumably with a corresponding bfers-only zone? really? as someone who bf, mix fed and ff, i would fight that to the hilt. because you'd be kicking me off MN, you see.