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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

who *isn't* ashamed to admit using formula?

635 replies

LookingForwardToSummer · 30/04/2008 11:42

feeling crap after reading the 'exclusive breastfeeding' thread! i find bf really hard and have set myself the target of 5 months, i intend to feel very proud that i went that long and then use formula happily! i can't be the only one! all the stats show low bf rates - so where is everyone?

OP posts:
ThursdayNext · 30/04/2008 13:57

margoandjerry, I went back to work when DS was 8 months and just fed him morning and evening on days when I was working, didn't express and didn't use formula. He had water from a cup in the day. This seemed the easiest option to me.
I disagree that it is very difficult to exclusively breastfed and work, especially now that you get some maternity pay for 9 months.

MrsMattie · 30/04/2008 13:59

I agree about the inconvenient facts@sabire - on both sides.
Very little genuine listening goes on in these 'debates'. Some people find it difficult to hear that breastmilk is better for babies than formula. Equally, nobody wants to listen when some women say 'well, on balance, I'd still rather not breastfeed'.

Personally, I think that aiming to get women in the UK to breastfeed for as long as the WHO advises is futile. It ain't ever gonna happen, for multiple reasons - namely that our society and culture is nothing like those of the developing countries where BF rates are much higher. Women have a different role, very different support mechanisms; families are structured differently and have a different role. I'm not saying it's a good thing, but it's reality.

MrsMattie · 30/04/2008 14:01

Sabire, you are in the minority. Yes, that's sad, but it's fact. Very few women in the UK have breast fed three children to a year and beyond, and I doubt that's going to change any time soon.

claraquitetirednow · 30/04/2008 14:04

We also have access to decent water to use in the formula in this country. It's the water which is the problem for women in developing countries, more than the formula.

Dolorescat · 30/04/2008 14:06

I think you have to consider the hours that some people work... for example I am out of house from 7am and home in eve at 9pm on the days I work (and occasional nights I will be out at 6.30pm and home 8.30am and by then ds will be at nursery), so ds has to have something which is why we have started to give formula when I am at work/ds at nursery (and he bf whenever he is with me). Ds still takes lots of frequent feeds he has not dropped many feeds even though having solids, and I don't think it's fair for me to expect nursery staff/ poor husband to settle him if he is hungry, even though I hate the idea of him having formula and my milk supply dropping.

smallwhitecat · 30/04/2008 14:08

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

margoandjerry · 30/04/2008 14:08

Sabire, you can tilt at windmills if you like but these are the facts. We live in this culture. We work long hours, have long commutes, live the lives we lead in the UK. We don't live in "other cultures". We live here.

I live in a pro bf micro culture among my friends and not one of them bfed much beyond six months. They all work. You can take 9 months mat leave but most of us can't afford it. I carried on to 9 months but my supply was drying up and we were both ready to drop it. My DD was genuinely not that bothered once food turned up in her life.

I just think extended bf is fine for those who are really committed but I have no interest in being really committed to bf now that my dd is 18 months old. If you are committed that's great but most of us have other priorities after a while. If you can still prioritise bf then great but please don't try to impose that priority on me or on women generally because it's simply shouldn't be a public health priorty. BF in the first months, absolutely, bf afterwards good but not essential.

Frankly I've got other things to worry about and if you make it a big issue you will put off loads of women.

MrsMattie · 30/04/2008 14:09

Good point@Dolores

Also, I find it insulting that the 'happy mummy happy baby' thing is treated with such contempt by some people. I was physically ill and suffered with PND after the birth of my son. The fact that my Dh was able to get up to do some of the nightfeeds, and to give me days off now and then, was a lifesaver. I had to weigh up the 'risks' of formula with the risk to my mental health, and there was no contest.

MrsMattie · 30/04/2008 14:10

Amen@margoandjerry

claraquitetirednow · 30/04/2008 14:10

Please don't now make women who DON'T return to work but chose not to bf/to stop bf'ing feel guilty. There are other reasons for stopping too.

Tortington · 30/04/2008 14:12

oh god

why dont you all just get a badge

scottishmummy · 30/04/2008 14:12

i dont know why phrase happy baby happy mummy irks so much.sounds reasonable to me.unless it has acquired some significance/connotations i am not aware of

MrsMattie · 30/04/2008 14:12

I don't think that was the point she was making@clara. The point is - comparisons between rates of BFing in the 'developing world' and the UK aren't always that helpful.The reality of most women's lives in the UK means that extended BF-ing either isn't possible, or isn't a priority.

ThursdayNext · 30/04/2008 14:13

MrsMattie, yes of course Sabire is in the minority. But switching to formula has become so common that I think some women who have successfully established breastfeeding use formula later because it is what everyone else they know does, although it may be quite easy to continue breastfeeding if they wanted to. But the advice of health visitors and friends will often be to introduce formula because that's what they are familiar with. Which is fine if the mother is happy with that, but a shame if she would like to continue breastfeeding.

MrsMattie · 30/04/2008 14:13

pmsl@Custy

Dolorescat · 30/04/2008 14:16

Yes of course Clara. All this judgement amongst women is awful isn't it.
I think the happy mum happy baby thing is so true... a depressed mum is not the best mum, so she has to do whatever enables her to feel ok and get the rest she needs. We all just need support in our choices, not to be told what to choose (waffling now!)

MilaMae · 30/04/2008 14:19

I'm definately not ashamed. One of my babies was rushed into SCIBU with severe jaundice and dehydration whilst she was being exclusively breast fed-formula stopped her from being brain damaged.

There are lots of things in an ideal world I'd like my kids to have that they haven't had.

Being fed excusively bfed for a year, yes if I could have
bought it bottled.

Eating a 100% organic diet from day one hmmmm yes that too.

A total tv free existance yes that to.

To have never heard me shout yes that too.

I could add loads more but the list is endless. The fact is I've done my best to give them as much as I could of each.

Exclusive breast milk for a year or more is preferable and only that. Formula in this country is a damn good alternative. The vast majority of babies aren't exclusively breast fed so the vast majority of babies have formula at some time. The vast majority thrive.

I

MilaMae · 30/04/2008 14:25

There are also other children to consider.

I'm a SAHM but still couldn't do it past 6 weeks-lying on the sofa with a novel to establish breast feeding ( a helpful suggestion I actually read on here) aint actually an option when you've got 15month old twins biting your ankles.

AitchTwoCiao · 30/04/2008 14:28

oh this is completely bogus, it presupposes that an inflammatory and snidey thread title is correct and that the prevailing view is that women who ff should feel ashamed. the prevailing view, however, is the opposite, rightly or wrongly.

hunkermunker · 30/04/2008 14:31

If you're happy to use formula, then there's no problem and there ought to be no guilt. If you do still feel guilt even though you're cheerful about using formula, please can you explain why?

If you're not happy to use formula and you feel guilty about it, will stopping talking about breastfeeding at all or pretending there are no risks to formula feeding make you feel better?

I feel I ought to say something about breastfeeding and working now, but I will be accused of smuggery, so I won't. It's the sort of thing I mean though - I'm made to feel guilty for talking about ways round seemingly impassable situations for women who are still making their decisions by those who have made their decisions already and cannot alter them.

kayzisexpecting · 30/04/2008 14:31

I do think the MWs and HVs need a bit more training if possible.

DS wouldn't or couldn't latch on. He would suck for about 30 seconds and then come off and start crying. I'd try a few times and then I'd make him a bottle as I couldn't cope with seeing him in distress. The MW and the HV both said "breast is best" but when I asked for help I got "keep trying" or shown the pictures in that pregnancy book you get given. I felt like screaming at them "I can put his gob on my boob" as thats all the book really showed you.

I have been told by my mw that I had when I was pg with DS(she broke her ankle a week before he was born so couldn't help me) that having the pethedine would have made him sleepy and that maybe that was why he never latched on in the hospital and after the nurse gave him a bottle he wanted the bottle instead.

hunkermunker · 30/04/2008 14:33

Dolores "Yes of course Clara. All this judgement amongst women is awful isn't it.
I think the happy mum happy baby thing is so true... a depressed mum is not the best mum, so she has to do whatever enables her to feel ok and get the rest she needs. We all just need support in our choices, not to be told what to choose (waffling now!)"

Who's telling anyone what to choose? Most women want to breastfeed. They tell us this themselves.

Depressed mums don't need to be told they have to ff to feel better either. It can make depression far worse to be forced to ff, in fact.

AitchTwoCiao · 30/04/2008 14:35

yes, this automatic correlation between happiness and ffing gets right on my useless tits. ffing made me unhappy. if it makes people HAPPY then there's no problem. zero. zilcho. rien.

MrsMattie · 30/04/2008 14:35

I don't think there is a prevailing view. The messages we receive are completely mixed and confusing.

Through pregnancy, my experience was:

  • At antenatal classes - no discussion of formula feeding, assumed you will just get on fine with BF-ing because it's 'natural'.
  • All pregnancy guides and magazines I read promote breastfeeding as 'best'.
  • Doctors surgery full of leaflets and posters on 'Breast is best'.
  • Midwife says 'Of course you'll breastfeed, won't you?'
-All women in my family have breastfed, so completely normal to me and I assume I will too.

After birth:

  • no help or support for BFing problems
  • bastard MWs who tell me one minute my son 'needs a formula top up' and the next shoving my breast roughly into his mouth like I am bloody thick not to be able to do it
  • The general public hostile to me when I breastfeed - dirty looks, tut-tuts, shaking of head
  • Oh, surprise surprise! the general public hostile to me when I formula feed, too! Snide remarks at toddler groups. Someone actually saying 'its' a shame' I'm not still BF-ing

Fucked up, mixed up messages. So I'm afraid it's not as simple as 'the whole world is against FF or BF-ing mums'. Not that simple at all. If anything, it looks to me like our society isn't very supportive of women in general. And the lack of understanding for other women's positions on this topic when it comes up on MN just proves that. We can't even support each other.

rant over.

MrsMattie · 30/04/2008 14:37

In answer to this question, hunker: If you do still feel guilt even though you're cheerful about using formula, please can you explain why?

I felt guilty about not 'giving my son the best start' by breastfeeding past 6 weeks, but I felt much happier myself when the pain stopped and I was able to pass over some of the responsibility for feeding to my husband. The happiness outweighed the guilt. Humans are emotionally complex.

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