So is it just me who has viscerally negative reactions to talk about breastfeeding 4 or 5 year olds

[TwigorTreat]

Now look I know its different strokes for different folks and I am not judging anyone as I know logically that its fine and anyone who does is doing what they deem their very best for their own children.

But I am talking about a experiencing a sense of distaste that I cannot help. I do have a negative and almost physical reaction to the thought of breastfeeding my 3 year old let alone an older child. And I have discussed this before when it came to extending breastfeeding for my own child beyond 6 months and with the discussion was capable of making it past that psychological barrier to 11 months.

Perhaps the thought of having a reasonable discussion over this particular reaction is just a step too far for us on Mumsnet. But I thought I'd give it a go anyway .. what, with it being Saturday and all that.

Anyone who experiences the same sense of negativity will no doubt need to gulp down hard before adding to this discussion. Just as anyone who is on the 'other side of the fence' will need to take copious amounts of oxygen into their system to calm down before posting .. I hope both sides do though... it could be interesting and educational

Twig - probably (relevant).

And it certainly means that your mother has come at your bf-ing your children with a non-neutral attitude. Either envy (I was bottle fed - my mother longed to bf us), or 'prickliness' at the implication that your different choice prepresented at the very least a different choice to her own - and potentially an inferred criticism.

When I first put my DS to the breast I was slightly uneasy at some of the twinges etc, I also had a few people look at me strange in certain places. Their problem.

After I got used to bf I loved it and was distraught when DS decided he would not stop biting at 9months. When he was ill at 12 months I was desperate to put him on the breast and I couldnt. I know if I could have I would have and dont know when I would have stopped. It was awful to me not to be able to do what felt like the most natural and beautiful thing in the world to help my baby by feeding him from my breast.

BF is not a constant with an 8/9 month old anymore than I expect it would be with a 3/4/5 yr old, so it isnt likely to be seen out and about, plus unlike bottle feeding at that age it isnt going to fuck up teeth etc. It can also be the only way for some parents to get one-to-one time or even the required calcuim/milk into their child.

I personally feel rather yucky at the thought of people performing oral sex on each other, My problem but it doesnt make it weird or strange or disgusting, just private.

I can't see any logic in the position that it's wrong to bf them once they start walking or talking. The fact that a toddler can walk and/or talk doesn't mean that they suddenly stop needing the closeness and comfort that bfing can bring, and it doesn't make the mother's milk any less nutritious.

Most non-human mammals learn to walk very early and continue drinking their mother's milk long after they have started walking. And even young babies (well under a year) can communicate that they want milk through gestures, baby signing or grabbing mum's shirt. Why should the fact that they can ask for it mean they shouldn't get it? That seems paradoxical to me.

PS I am bfing my 2 1/2 year old as I type this.

I agree w/Twig's OP [don't faint, dear ]

QV - To be honest, the 'neurotic' thing is really not about extended breastfeeding, if someone who strikes me as overly obsessed by this whole subject said "you know, I make all my meals from scratch and only ever buy organic" I would be thinking "well, yes, thats probably cos you're neurotic" despite the fact that, in isolation, I'd view that as a positive choice.

and nod at Jeremy

I have only read the op so sorry if i'm repeating anything.

I fed my DD until she was 2 and only stopped as I fell pregnant and she weaned herself when she couldn't fit on my lap anymore .

The idea that somebody feels this is somehow wrong or creepy is very upsetting to me and are perhaps views not best expressed on a board with known ex breastfeeders. You clearly admit yourself that you have issues with mothers feeding their toddlers, I am not sure what you hope to achieve by posting about them?

I was thinking today how it seems to be perfectly accepted to say exactly how you feel about people who breastfeed for longer than society deems the 'norm' and to completly disregard the feelings of these mothers, but if I was to air negative views of ff or toddlers with dummies (surely that is fulfilling the same sucking/comfort need in an older child) I would rightfully be chewed up and spat out.

Perhaps you need to do some searching inside yourself to see why you feel like this, instead of asking the people you are offending why you feel this way

but what about all those of us who bf our children at home? out of your sight. it seems to be the visibility of it that some of you are having problems with and yet that makes it more difficult.

i stopped feeding ds in public about 14m because so many people react badly. does that make you feel better?

Really, though, how would you expect this discussion to go if you'd started off telling us how its different strokes for different folks and you are not judging anyone as you know logically that its fine but you do have a negative and almost physical reaction to the thought of homosexuality, and mumblechum had chimed in to say that there was "nothing creepier than two adult men sticking their tongues down wach others' throats in public."?

And why is it different for breastfeeding?

I can only speak for myself and I think it's fine.
I'm far more likely to have 'viscerally negative' about women who are scared and repulsed by something so natural and womanly.

I've fed a four year old a few times in my BF career. I'm still feeding my 2.5 year old. I know a woman who still feeds her 9 year old girl.

Ah, that seems much more logical Scaremy

Harpsi - your post of 20:02:42 says it all. People who comment negatively on extended bf often make referenes to the child 'pulling up [the mother's] top' and similar - gestures/actions which in other contexts are associated with sexuality. Our society's sexualisation of breasts has very much tainted its perception of the bf relationship - very IMO.

I am tandem feeding my 2.5yo and my 5 week old. I am very much an advocate of self-weaning and used to love feeding ds1. Since about 30 weeks pg, though, I have begun to find it more and more difficult - primarily because he is in effect demand fed and his demand went up in late pg, and especially after the birth, from once or twice a day to severa ltimes. I attempt to limit him, but have to be extremely careful so that he doesn't feel pushed out in favour of ds2 (FWIW he is nothing but affectionate to ds2 and has coped brilliantly with the upheaval). I missed the moment to restrict bf to certain times. Anyway, I find his demands actually beginning to cause an almost physical feeling of 'I don't want this' in me, which makes me desperately , as I fought so hard to bf him in the first place and I feel sad our relationship has changed. Fortunately I think he hasn't noticed yet. But it is not any of harpsi's list that causes this discomfort.

I am always particularly at the idea that walking and talking (or example - insert any milestone) somehow require (what is perceived as) maturity in other areas - e.g. being able to do without sources of comfort such as bf. I think the absolute, open expression of emotional needs that small children practise makesw many people uncomfortable - possibly because it was 'trained' out of them at a very early age. An alternative concept of maturity could mean a child knowing what it needs at particlar stages in its life and seeking to fulfil thisneed, to give it up all the more easily when its right time comes. This, I'm sure, is wht my ds1 is doing - so I am gritting my teeth and bearing it.

typos result from 1-handed typing - feeding ds2

Twig, I am sorry to hear your mother made it so hard for you to breastfeed for as long as you felt you wanted to. I do understand how hard that must have felt and what a difference it can make to either have, or not have, the support of your own mother when feeding your child

I wonder whether there's a feeling in some women that extended BFers are 'letting the side down'. There we go, displaying our long straggly tits to the world (OK, maybe that's just me) and revolting the passers-by, and the more physically modest/continent women feel that we are letting dyalight in on magic - allowing men to see that women's breasts are quite often less than glamorous, or that women are quite often sexually unavailable or uninterested. It's like not shaving your legs, or not trimming your pubes.

Does this post make any sense at all?

policy - yes, it does. It really does.

berolina that is a lovely way of putting it, i entirely agree. people seem so obsessed with controlling small children

I was thinking about the earlier post asking what a breastfed child's peers would think of them being breastfed - and wondering why the poster thought the subject would come up? The child wouldn't be breastfed during school hours! Many school age children need to wear nappies at night time but I doubt they share this with their friends.

praise be!

I often wish I'd fed dd for much longer. I think I would find it more rewarding to feed her now as an 18month old who could express her feeding needs/wants etc very easily compared with feeding her as a young baby. On the other hand I know that I would find it very irritating to have her trying to get my breasts out to feed whenever she felt like a drink so perhaps it wouldn't have worked out for me.

Looking at harpsi's list of themes etc whenever I've discussed bf with my friend those who express the sort of feeling that Twig is almost always say it's the animalistic nature of it that they don't like. Somehow they view ff as more sophisticated, prob wrong word but can't think of a better one, and bf as too primitive , as though it's somthing we should have evolved out of doing.

Well Freud probably has a lot to answer for in regards to a large part of society reaction to extended b/feeding.
I fell into breastfeeding my babies without having researched all the benefits. It was good for them and I was too knackered for even contemplating a difficult task like sterilizing. I liked breastfeeding them. But I stopped when ds was 11 months, because I craved freedom. I felt in a way the need to know that they could survive even without me.

very good policy, and yes makes perfect sense.

You are making me think of those ridiculous Hooter Hider things in the US. I think bf can be viewed (subconsciously) as misappropriation of breasts - which just shows how wrong-way-round we as a society have got about the whole thing.