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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

The expression 'breastfeeding nazi'...

94 replies

emkana · 10/05/2004 13:35

... is offensive and meaningless, just plain horrible. I really wish it wouldn't be used on Mumsnet anymore - I find it very upsetting that people do.

I've written this on another thread today, but I feel so strongly about it that I decided to start another thread.

How about 'breastfeeding fanatic', if you need to describe a certain type of breastfeeding supporter?

OP posts:
dinosaur · 10/05/2004 13:38

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

aloha · 10/05/2004 14:01

Emkana, I've complained about myself. Lots of people feel as you do. It is upsettingly offensive and against Mumsnet's policy.

Piffleoffagus · 10/05/2004 14:19

i call myself a pro breatfeeding mum... I agree it is disgusting terminology

suedonim · 10/05/2004 14:44

I agree. According to my dictionary, it's a derogatory term and imo has no place here. I'm not all that keen on 'fanatic' tbh, I think it has overtones of extremism. I think 'pro-bfing' or 'bf supporter' or 'bf enthusiast' are alternatives.

Piffleoffagus · 10/05/2004 14:55

or lactating champion?
pmsl lets turn this into a good thread!

Original poster
emkana · 10/05/2004 15:52

I don't think it's that funny -
but then I'm German so I haven't got a sense of humour

OP posts:
Piffleoffagus · 10/05/2004 17:08

LOL
I think? If not I apologise for being a wordsmith and thinking thesaurus type analogies are funny.
That's for being a kiwi, we're thick as pigsh=t don't you know?

Clayhead · 10/05/2004 17:39

Lactivist?

papillon · 10/05/2004 17:57

those two words don´t go together

How are milkbar junkie

papillon · 10/05/2004 17:58

speak for yourself Piffleoffagus and don´t run pigs down like that - they always get a hard rap

Clayhead · 10/05/2004 18:09

They used 'moveable feast' on Cutting it the other night.

In The Times one of the columists refers to his bf wife as the Milk Monitor.

JJ · 10/05/2004 19:24

I love "breastfeeding fanatic". It differentiates people like me, a moveable feast who had milkbar junkies for sons, from people who are just nuts about it and think formula is the devil's own work or worse yet, "much of a muchness".

(Piff, not sure where the "pro-breastfeeding" label lies in terms of the above -- makes me think of 1950's propaganda, so I like it, too. "Breastfeeding fanatic" is just more in your face. )

The thing is, it's necessary to keep the concept with its derogatory tone (because it is a good descriptor of how some people feel - don't go all 1984 on me), but lose the offensiveness and well, the sickening nature of the previous phrase.

Heathcliffscathy · 10/05/2004 20:02

JJ I agree. There are people on MN that are more than pro b/f, they are anti anything else: formula is the devil's work/much of a muchness/puts child at risk, etc etc.

hercules · 10/05/2004 20:06

Hear, Hear emkna!
The other term that has been used on mumshnet is breastfeeding mafia!
Very ignorant imo.

JJ · 11/05/2004 06:39

Oh dear, didn't want to start a breastfeeding/formula debate, just wanted to say that "breastfeeding fanatic" does describe the feeling some women get from the people who are very pro-breastfeeding. Most women here are breastfeeding enthusiasts or breastfeeding supporters (necessary for public acceptance, help for new mothers, etc etc) without being breastfeeding fanatics (ie, what you feed your child doesn't matter if you don't breastfeed).

Not sure that made sense, but I had a real giggle with emkana's first post!

Original poster
emkana · 11/05/2004 08:48

I fear that I'll really come across as having no sense of humour now, but I really don't understand what was so funny about my first post, JJ?

OP posts:
bunnyrabbit · 11/05/2004 09:01

I think the phrase is supposed to be an insult anyway, so BF fanatic doesn't really come close to the rather nasty undertones impied here. In fact, I think best to leave the whole thing alone!! No need for people who are pro-BF to be refferred to in such a negative way IMHO, each to their own......

Incidentally, I have heard the same adjective applied to Gina Ford on this site before and haven't seen any complaints.

BR

JJ · 11/05/2004 09:09

That was a horrible word choice on my part -- the phrase you used just fit so perfectly it made me smile.

Sorry about that! I should know the dangers of posting before caffeine hits my system.

aloha · 11/05/2004 09:23

Sophable, I have posted to say that formula is all much of a muchness. I really don't think that makes me a fanatic - I gave the bloody stuff to my own son from day one, practically. But the truth is all commercially available formulas are much of a muchness. What's so extreme about that? There are also risks associated with its use, particularly with very young babies - a well-documented extra risk of allergy, for example. Saying that isn't extreme either IMO.

misdee · 11/05/2004 09:25

sorry for being a bit stupid, but what does the expression 'much of muchness' mean? everytime i read it i think of munchkins and the wizard of oz!

SoupDragon · 11/05/2004 09:32

"much of a muchness" means "pretty much all the same"

JJ · 11/05/2004 09:41

Aloha, but that's simply not true. There are guidelines from US and European doctors' organizations about which formulas to use, especially when there is a history of allergy. There are some formulas which these groups believe should not be readily available (eg low-iron) and the research into formula formulations (?) is supported by them also.

Plus, if you look at a store shelf there are obviously very dissimilar formulas: soya, goats' milk, cows' milk, partially hydrolysed, blah blah blah. Some have added this or thats and even when comparing a broad category (eg cows' milk formulas) there are differences.

To say otherwise is incorrect.

JJ · 11/05/2004 09:50

One of the problems I have with "much of a muchness" is that if someone says they're worried about allergies and asks about formula, the general response is "if you don't breastfeed, which formula you feed your child doesn't matter". Which is categorically not true for children who have a family history of allergy.

And choosing the correct formula in that case is more of issue because the mother is not breastfeeding and the child loses that protection that breastmilk provides.

aloha · 11/05/2004 10:05

I have posted to say that soy formula should not from what I have read be given unless under direction of a dr. But most people aren't thinking of soy formula - the vast majority of brands on supermarket shelves are cows milk formulas. They may have a bit of this or a bit of that - I actualy went for an organic one (BabyNat) but mainly because I thought the tin was pretty - but there is no research that I know of that says that any commercial formula is different in its effects than any other. Of course I am not talking about the specialist formulas available on prescription - but then you can't get those in the supermarket anyway. As I said, my son had everything - Cow & Gate, BabyNat, the lot - and I feel reasonably comfortable with that decision (though I would have preferred him not to have formula quite so early, personally). He seems a very healthy child. But there is lots of evidence that formula, while it is controlled, regulated and in our society safe and nutritious - does not contain and cannot contain the live hormones, enzymes and fatty acids of human milk.
I certainly don't think that to point this out puts anyone on a par with Dr Mengele or those who pushed tiny children into gas chambers.

JJ · 11/05/2004 10:27

But that's not what I'm saying, aloha. I agree that many of them are the same. When someone posts asking a question, isn't it in their best interests to answer it fully? Most threads about formula and allergy go something like this:

Poster: I'm worried about allergies. Which formula should I use.
Responder: You should breastfeed. Otherwise it doesn't matter.

When, ideally, it should go like this:

Poster: I'm worried about allergies. Which formula should I use.
Responder: The best prevention is breastfeeding. Otherwise, if you have a strong family history (you, your husband or other children) of allergies, you should try and use an extensively hydrolysed formula such as Neocate. If you don't have a history of allergies, it doesn't really matter, except that soya formulas aren't recommended. You can get a prescription for Neocate from your doctor. If you need some support for your position, here's a paper outlining the AAP and European equivalent's recommendations (see table 1 in particular). Also, be sure to take it to the hospital with you, because the midwives there will give your child whatever formula they have on hand.

And I didn't call you any names!