only 12 days in and I feel like giving up already

[sprite25]

DD is only 12 days old and I've been trying my hardest to breast feed but really starting to get to the end of my tether with it. DD has had multiple problems (nothing major) but I feel like I'm fighting a losing battle. I'm still having visits from my MW who has helped and I feel better after her visits but always end up back at square 1 feeling exhausted and frustrated literally to tears (even today). Despite feeding DD for around an hour and half we're still having to top up her up with cup feeding formula. Should I just give up the ghost now and switch to bottles and formula???

Lansinoh - when I had mine it was called camillosan and contained lanolin - I'm allergic to lanolin - I knew that but the m/wives told me it was totally organic and natural - it wasn't.

Painful nipples and breast pain - I found out months and months afterwards this was due to thrush of the inner breast tossue - check it out.

Do what you need to. Breast isn't the be all and end all. Xx

Yes, I can't recommend getting rl support enough, it's company and comfort and guidance. Is that a possibility for tomorrow? Everyone here has been through what you've been through, we get it but all our experiences are slightly different. A professional will look at you and your baby alone .
You really are doing so well and in time your partner will develop his own ways to soothe the baby eg mine used to give dd his finger to suck. Also would he give you a guaranteed lie on for 2 hours in the morning? Much and all as I hated and feared the night feeds everything became manageable again if oh took the baby off me in the morning after a feed.

You're doing great op, christmas on top of everything can't be easy x

Mrs DV - probably inappropriate - but happy holidays. As always fab and supportive advice x

Apologies OP - plse excuse hijack. Hope it's a reasonable night for you x

Echoing the last poster, remember that this is not a "normal" time and you can't apply normal rules - first of all, your hormones all be absolutely all over the place and secondly, it's Christmas, so frankly bloody well done for getting this far!

Hi Sprite, I was in your situation once and know how miserable it is. I struggled so much with bf and when I found out she wasn't putting on any weight I was mortified. She was getting so thin that even the breastfeeding support people (who were really anti-formula) said I had to start ff. But it does get better, honestly. Some babies - and mothers - just take a long time to get the hang of bf. My DD was also tongue-tied and the midwives told me that when they appear to feed for a long time (45 mins or more) it can be because the tongue tie makes it impossible for them to feed properly and they get so tired they fall asleep. May not be true for everyone but it definitely was for us)

I started giving 1 full bottle of formula during the day, and topping up for her just-before-bed 7pm feed - so I would bf at 7pm first then offer her a bottle and see how much she'd take. Sometimes it was hardly anything, other times it was 200ml so obviously she was still hungry. And I kept on trying to bf at all other times, plus expressing a couple of times a day to keep my supply up. Slowly and surely the bf became easier until by 3-4 months both she and I had totally got the hang of it. I still kept up the 7pm bottle though because I liked it and it made sure she was full before going down for the night.

So in a nutshell: stick with bf if that's what you want to do and know that it WILL get better, but give as much formula as you need because it takes the pressure off. Also your OH can give the occasional bottle so you can get some much-needed sleep! If you express and bf when you can then your supply won't go down so there's no need to worry. And please DON'T listen to anyone who says that weight loss is normal and you don't need to ff. A baby is happy if it's full, and doesn't care where the milk comes from

Gah, sorry - ignore what I said up there about babies losing weight. It was BikeRunSki who mentioned that and I got confused

I do worry that there is something still wrong with her latch although her tongue tie was only snipped on Saturday and they said it might take her time to get used to feeding without the tt. Am currently sitting in bed feeding DD and hoping she has a better night. Does anyone know how long roughly a baby has to feed on a breast for until they get to the hindmilk that stops them being hungry?

The hind milk doesn't come all at once. Essentially, the fatty bits that people call hind milk steadily increase in concentration throughout the feed - they get washed down by milk passing through the duct. This happens more at the end, less at the beginning, but it's a constant increase during the feed, rather than a switch from one to the other.

As for how long, it totally varies. Some babies feed very fast, which would mean fatty milk quicker, if you fed recently it will be more fatty, evening milk is fattier.

So there isn't an answer I'm afraid
How has today been?

The foremilk/hindmilk think is not as precise or imports as many sources may imply.

The fat content of milk its actually lower the longer the time is between feeds.

There is no set time as you describe sprite for reaching hind milk

Link: kellymom.com/bf/got-milk/basics/foremilk-hindmilk/

Try really hard to trust that your body can sort it out as you feed.

How are babies nappies? If you can see lots coming through, its definitely going in. :)

The more often baby feeds the more milk production is stimulated. Leaving breasts 'full' will actually slow down production of milk.

Breasts are never really empty and milk is produced as baby feeds.

I minnow you said you weren't keen on information overload, but the Melanin stung

Kellymom stuff is v well researched and I find it helpful.

Ignore the melanin stung - affecting typing.

Link: kellymom.com/bf/got-milk/basics/foremilk-hindmilk/

Great information Leonard, .

Can I ask when your baby falls asleep at the breast do you normally remove them and put them down? often babies appear asleep but can still be drinking he/she will fall off the breast when they are inished. Also do you normally offer both breasts as each feeding session? That will really help zonk out baby. Try not to get hung up on how longs feeds last, as each child is individual some take 15 mins others need 45 mins. Bf is definitely hard work in the early days but becomes much easier!

Oh I didn't realise that's how it worked so if she's been feeding on one breast for 40 minutes and still cries its not because she hasn't had any of the satisfying stuff? Looks like it might be another night of co-sleeping (even though I dont feel 100% safe doing it) as she's fed for at least half an hour on each breast, had a top up of ebm and is now being rocked with a dummy but still isn't settling, and I feel like a sleep deprived zombie

That sounds rough, but yes, she will have had the good stuff as it were.

I know co-sleeping can feel weird, I was never totally relaxed about it, but we did it in the rough patches, and it was a life saver. I took the view it was safer than me being so tired I fell asleep on the sofa (happened once - scary), which is genuinely dangerous.

Hope she settles soon.

Just checking back in to see how you're getting on. There's some great advice on this thread - I hope you're finding it helpful!

DD is 9 weeks and I we'll remember the dread of bedtime coming. I regularly had a little weep at about 4pm about it. I found a pre dinner nap helped, as did a packet of hobnobs.

Our NCT lady said that right at the end of a feed, when you think they've finished, but they occasionally do gentle fluttery sucks - that's when they're getting the really fatty stuff, but that (as said above) the fat content increases throughout the feed. Baby takes exactly what baby needs. That's why feeds are often of different lengths.

We rarely need to offer the second boob now, but until 5 ish weeks i could feed from 3 or even 4 sides in one feed. Just keep offering - you can't over feed a breastfed baby.

You've done really well, and you're asking for help in the right place. Is there a breastfeeding cafe near you where you can get some real life support next week?

I promise you'll be fine when DH goes back to work. Just make sure the fridge is full of things you can eat with one hand!

tingly boobs is normal. mine are actually painful when they let down the milk but that is normal too. nipples should only hurt at the beginnings of feeds i think.

Just had a visit from MW and to be honest feel rather devestated :( MW has suggested that DD is mixed fed as she hasn't put any weight on since last check and isn't producing the dirty nappies. MW got us to give her a few ounces of ready made formula from a bottle and DD was instantly satisfied and dropped off to sleep in DH arms, she's never been like that even after 2 hours of BF. MW said to have 24 hours of mixed feeding so I can get some rest to decide what to do...i feel so awful and hate that I can't even feed my baby properly and hate my body for not doing one of the most natural things its meant to do.

I remember how that feels but it's why formula was invented - because bf can be so so hard. Enjoy your peaceful sleeping baby - have some me time; happy baby, happy mummy - it becomes a virtuous circle. Childbirth and breastfeeding are teeny tiny parts of being a mummy and a parent. Doesn't feel like it now but it will. I was crap at breastfeeding but my dc who are 19 and 15 now grew up just fine. Fitter. Stronger and cleverer than some of the bf ones.

Don't feel devastated, be pleased your midwife is helping you. Mine refused saying they only supported bf and couldn't facilitate ff. It made me feel unable to admit defeat and I struggled on for far too long.

Have a weep, have a little rest and look forward to a lovely life as a mummy. Your lo has had the best of the antibodies now. Xx

Hi Sprite25, some really good advice here. There's really no one right or wrong answer, just what ever you think is best for you and your baby. Trust your instincts, I know it's hard in the beginning because you're new to all this and you're tired from the lack of sleep so it's hard to be decisive. I felt overwhelmed by all the advice and didn't know what to do either. Eventually I literally threw out my baby books and began to do what I thought was best. Best thing I ever did, felt so much more relaxed and happier. I was still tired though! Take care and good luck!

I was upset when I gave up too. Mainly as I was so sleep deprived and hormonal that I had no reserves left.

But TBH within about three days I didn't care any more, I had moved on and was enjoying the rest of motherhood.

As my wise friend, mother of seven said, it's all too much with the first baby. Something has to give. You may well have a completely different experience with any subsequent DC you have.

I did. DS1 got two weeks, which at least means he (and your baby) got that early milk. At 21 he is strong, healthy and brainy :). And my next two DC were a doddle to BF.

Just read your last post. Please don't feel devastated, one of my babies was a good feeder, the other one not so at all and needed to feed frequently, choked and spluttered all the time and didn't put much weight on at all for the first few months. Both only had one dirty nappy a month until they were weaned onto solids. I used to take them to the doctor worried about the lack of dirty nappies and I was told each time not to worry, it's fairly normal. Babies are all different and also all feed differently. Both of mine are very healthy 7 year olds who eat extremely well, they've turned out just fine. Try not to worry too much and beat yourself up about it, your baby will turn out just fine whatever you do, it is clear that you love your baby very much and that's the most important thing.

You are doing well OP, despite feeling so off key with it all. It can take time to get it going right. No one gets into a car after their first 40 minute lesson and passes the test the following day, it takes practise. It's often the same with BFing, you and baby are both learning something new and different.
I also recommend La Leche League. They give fantastic advice and support IME.
Co sleeping is very helpful and very natural too. My Dd used to just help herself after a while as I slept. You kind of know they are feeding, but you are relaxed and resting while they do it.