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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

Breastfeeding myths overheard in hospital

412 replies

hunkermunker · 23/01/2006 15:23

Woman in the bed next to me was bottlefeeding because she "couldn't be arsed to breastfeed, and they're more settled on a bottle, innit". Er, yours wasn't, love - he cried, you snored through it. And as for the method of getting your newborn baby to take a bottle that your partner had discovered... Heard her telling her mum and dad as if it was hilarious that her DP had said "Finish the fucking bottle, then" and he'd drunk it

Woman in bed opposite me was told to "put the baby to the breast and leave him there as long as it took. It might be two hours. Just let him suck". Well, OK, but might've been nice to actually show her what to do, as she had no idea. Baby had a bottle in his mouth the next morning

Woman who was in the bed after woman opposite left said, "My milk isn't in yet, so I've been giving him bottles until it is". Instead of being told, "Just let him feed, you have colostrum, which is all he needs, your milk will be in soon, I'll help you if you need it" she was asked which formula she wanted

And today I've been told to only offer one breast at each feed and since I had DS2, they've asked me how often he's feeding - am I trying to get him to go three-hourly? Er, no, he's had low blood sugar. Nobody has mentioned feeding on demand to establish supply.

Am and and

OP posts:
VeniVidiVickiQV · 24/01/2006 12:43

Sorry - but that kind of attitude towards this really annoys me ellasmum.

Its not explanations we want. Ive had the "we're run off our feet" "short staffed" "busy day" thing thrown at me. Its not that i dont sympathise with the circumstances Midwives are in - i want to train to become one myself - the point is - there shouldnt be inconsistent/and or substandard care/advice whatever the reason. Whose fault it is doesnt really matter does it?

I shouldnt have had to wait in an uncomfortable waiting room for 10 hours for test results when being considered for admission for pre eclampsia without so much as an offer of water - what the hell is that going to do to my blood pressure? What the hell is the point in keeping me in overnight to monitor said bp if no-one bothers to come round all night to check it? I shouldnt have been rushed post partum to have a shower and to have to dry myself with a used gown. I shouldnt have had to wait for hours for pain relief post partum. I shouldnt have been left to my own devices with b/feeding. I shouldnt have been told i could give DS to them for a break by one mw only to be told rather curtly by another that there was no point.

Agree with MOM.

nanneh · 24/01/2006 12:45

MoM - I am really sorry about your situation. I am not a champion for mw's, or the NHS. I am just trying to be constructive. I think that it's shocking that mothers in a so-called modern, 1st World country should have such poor birth and post-birth experiences.

My HV seemed to laugh out loud evertime I discussed bf with her, so I stopped taking my son to the baby clinic for routine checks. I weighed and measured him at home and checked charts and figures on the internet, much more useful and up to date I have to say !!

In fact I avoid my GP and the HV like the plague as they never have anything supportive or relevant to say about bf.

harpsichordcarrier · 24/01/2006 12:52

OK so here's the thing
we all agree that the support received from mw's. hv's and other HCP's is (at best) variable in quality
so what can WE do about it? as individuals?
peer support?
how does that work?

for example - I met a family friend at he weekend, his girlfriend had just had a baby. I aske dhow she was getting on and she said that she wasn't "getting on" with bf and had started ot give formula. I must say after witnessing so much anger on mumsnet about this issue, I felt very inhibited from offering any advice.
And I DO have advice to give, I really really do.
but so many times I have heard (on here) that I shouldn't make women who bottlefeed feel guilty. That it is a valid choice and that I shouldn't be smug about it. So I didn't even offer anything.
And I made sure she wasn't in the room when I started to feed.
I feel very sad about it today actually, because she gave birth at one of the hospitals listed here. and I bet she got lousy support.

Meanoldmummy · 24/01/2006 12:53

I'm not attacking or trying to antagonise anyone in particular But I will continue to tell the truth about my experiences, whether people find it palatable or not. It IS shocking. It's a national disgrace.

nanneh · 24/01/2006 13:05

harpsi - I had a simialr experience with a friend who has a young wife, about 10 years younger than me. They are quite wealthy so she gave birth in a private ward in a well-known London hospital. Her husband called me to give me the good news of the birth.

The birth had gone very well, but she had been told by the "private" health staff to give formula as "the baby was crying and probably hungry because she didn't have enough milk" [milk]. I volunteered (over the phone and during the course of the conversation) to help her so that she could stop topping up with formula, but that is far as I could push it without being smug .

Needless to say, baby is now 6 weeks old and they never called me for help or advice with bf. It's difficult, you can only offer help, you can't force it.

Aloha · 24/01/2006 13:12

Actually the midwives I encountered were not rushed off their feet. The lazy, cruel cow who was in charge when I was in refused to get off her arse and come out from behind her desk to help me. Sometimes 'short staffed' is an excuse for cruel and nasty and incompetent.

Aloha · 24/01/2006 13:12

Actually the midwives I encountered were not rushed off their feet. The lazy, cruel cow who was in charge when I was in refused to get off her arse and come out from behind her desk to help me. Sometimes 'short staffed' is an excuse for cruel and nasty and incompetent.

Meanoldmummy · 24/01/2006 13:17

I found the same thing. Most of the time on the ward I spent 6 weeks on the midwives sat on their bottoms in their office, eating, chatting and making personal telephone calls. Occasionally they were aproached by a pregnant/post-natal woman needing something, and almost they invariably reacted in an ungracious and unkind manner.

ellasmum1 · 24/01/2006 13:24

sorry to hear you met so many horrible midwives mom.I must admit i've met a few in my time but truly believe most of the ones i work with are kind and caring,just v frustrated with the constraints of the nhs. mummytostven,its not so much to do with the postnatal ward,more that you are trained in an idealistic cocoon,imagining talking and helping women breastfeed etc but the cold reality is that there is little time to do anything but medical "tasks" like taking blood pressures(obviously extremely important!)Changing drip bags/running blood transfusions/emptying catheter bags/taking bloods/chasing blood results etc etc.its an endless list!So many newly qualified midwives leave when they realize what its like.You need about 3 times the number of staff.

beejay · 24/01/2006 13:24

Scandanavian countries prob do have better national health systems and maternity care because they have higher taxes. Staffing a maternity ward adequately costs money.
And like ellasmum said, how on earth are you supposed to support 14 women with complex and varied needs at one time?

The whole system needs better resourcing, a lot of midwives obviously need better training, but again that costs money.
Also I guess that postnatal care doesn't hit the headlines in quite the same way as breast cancer drugs or the whole ( ridiculous) MMR hype.

Meanoldmummy · 24/01/2006 13:31

But it ISN'T just about over-stretched midwives trying to support too many women at the same time and being rushed. A shred of compassion, a glimmer of humanity would have been nice. I've been in very stressful and demanding situations myself, and never behaved towards anyone the way those evil witches did. I think it's sad, and disgraceful, that so many women give up breastfeeding before they even leave hospital - not because of lack of support due to understaffing, but due to abuse, wilful negligence and assault by crap midwives. I certainly wasn't the only woman shedding tears of humiliation and outrage on my ward.

melrose · 24/01/2006 13:32

I got lots of help from a lovely (quite old!) auxilary on the night shift of my second night in hospital. She was an angel and would have given up without her! She had all 4 in my ward b/f by the end of the night in a "I've got thousands of babes to do this, no reason yours won't" kind of way

BUT apart from her mw's were useless. My advice to all 1st timers would be ask ask and ask for help. I had real difficulty getting DS to latch on so rang the buzzer every time to get them to help/ check it was right.

My community mw was v old school too (told me to drink Guiness when was struggling with my supply - it worked!!), so think it is perhaps a generation thing.

melrose · 24/01/2006 13:32

I got lots of help from a lovely (quite old!) auxilary on the night shift of my second night in hospital. She was an angel and would have given up without her! She had all 4 in my ward b/f by the end of the night in a "I've got thousands of babes to do this, no reason yours won't" kind of way

BUT apart from her mw's were useless. My advice to all 1st timers would be ask ask and ask for help. I had real difficulty getting DS to latch on so rang the buzzer every time to get them to help/ check it was right.

My community mw was v old school too (told me to drink Guiness when was struggling with my supply - it worked!!), so think it is perhaps a generation thing.

tiktok · 24/01/2006 13:34

Offering help or even a comment to friends and family is hard - I have learnt to tread very carefully indeed since I first did it and almost lost a friend.

This is what I do. I ask 'how's the feeding going?' without making any assumption about method, and they can say 'ok' if they want to and nothing else. If they say 'crap - I can't manage the bf...' or something similar, I say, 'if you want to tell me more about that, I might be able to suggest something.....' and I take it very gently from there. They might even say, 'well, I started to breastfeed but it went all horrible and he's on the bottle now' I say, 'if you want to know about starting again, then just ask...' and usually they don't!

I have helped a handful of friends and rellies, but I still use the counselling skills I use with other mothers inc. don't be directive, let the mother drive the whole thing, and don't judge.

I do think it's important to say something!

innorway · 24/01/2006 13:40

We do pay a lot more taxes here, almost half my wage is taxed. We also have to pay to see a doctor although you only pay a one-off amount for healthcare when pregnant (about £10) which covers scans and all visits. I don't know what the ratio is mw to mums/babies, but it must be better than 1 to 14 - I would guess 1 to 6 or less. Normal stay in hospital is 3 days, with the emphasis on bf. Baby is put to breast straight away, they recommend lots of skin to skin contact to get milk in. Once home we do not get the daily follow up that you get in the UK. One visit in 10 days (but they do not release you until able to bf (if that's want you want) and until baby has regained birthweight. Most Norwegian women bf for atleast first 6 months, most continue until end of first year (we also get 1 yr maternity leave with 80% - and child care costs 1/4 of what it costs in uk - but remember we do pay almost 50% tax!!) - and the cheapest bottle of wine you can be is about £10!

harpsichordcarrier · 24/01/2006 13:43

I know tiktok (that you should say something) and I USED to but that was before mumsnet... now I am very afraid of giving offence if it someone I don't know very well. and i know how grim those first few weeks are, and all..
oh I don;t know, I just don't think the solution is in hospitals, I think it is among peers
btw am training to be an antenatal teacher so this is all fascinating stuff

beejay · 24/01/2006 13:43

God I wish I lived in norway. So much saner

innorway · 24/01/2006 13:54

Norway is certainly very family orientated, I moan about the price of things, but they do know how to balance work and family. I guess I'm lucky really - although I'm always thinking the grass is greener (can't buy rice crispies).

It's a funny thing about bf though, it's the most natural thing in the world, but it does take a fair bit of practice. I've got 3 kiddies and it was only with the last that it went completely smoothly from the beginning. With the other 2 we succeeded in the end, but not without blood and tears! (literally). But I've heard that la leche league give very good support in the UK?

SauerKraut · 24/01/2006 14:00

I live in C at the moment but have had 1 baby in Paris, 1 baby in Kent, 1 baby in Tyne and Wear and 1 baby in Baden, CH. In Paris, I was encouraged to and helped to bf by some midwives, and begged to bottle feed by others- ended up mixed feeding for 3 months then giving up bf. It really depended on which midwives were on at the time, and, mostly, the ones encouraging me to bf were impatient and each one gave conflicting advice. In Kent and North Shields, they were amazed I wanted to do it, and I was made to feel embarassed by the other patients, and looked on as an oddball by the midwives. Luckily, my first experience made me all the more determined to do it fully 2nd and 3rd time round. Here, on the contrary, it was absolutely assumed that I would bf- everyone is told they must for at least the first few weeks. The women with premies or ill babies in incubators are set up with weird and wonderful electric pumps and express every 4 hours- midwives come in to make sure they're doing it. The bf-ing mothers are given special meals and herbal teas to encourage milk production. Wish I could have had my first there too!

SauerKraut · 24/01/2006 14:00

Sorry, that should read CH

popsycalindisguise · 24/01/2006 14:02

I have had 2 babies in north shields (same hospital as you...) and found them very supportive

you did have to be very proactive in asking for advice otherwise you were pretty much left to it however

SauerKraut · 24/01/2006 14:11

Was there 8 years ago, glad it was better when you were there. Mind you, I am not very good at asking for advice!

beejay · 24/01/2006 14:13

The LLL were fab, totally rescued me. Far more helpful than any of the (sweet and well meaning) midwives, IME

kittyfish · 24/01/2006 14:14

Just wanted to say that I am shocked to the core by these stories. I was incredibly lucky with my midwives from my first pre-natal who were all keen on bfing. The MW at Swindon Hosp (it is fab - ignore the horror stories) was great - as soon as my daughter came out she was on my chest and latched on with MWs help. Only after a quick feed was she cleaned, weighed etc. All the HVs at my local practice are also pro breast feeding. I have always wondered why alot of women have such difficulty with bfing. Now I know why.

tiktok · 24/01/2006 14:18

The thing about Scandinavia is they never had a bottle culture like we have...formula never really caught on.

A Norwegian friend of mine says they managed to avoid it, because Norway is a small country and therefore a small market, with no huge urban areas where promotion of formula could really take hold. Most women were giving birth at home until much later than we were in the UK, so no promotion of practices like separation of mother and baby and scheduled feeds and top ups.

I don't know how far all that applies to Denmark and Sweden, where breastfeeding is equally high. But I do know that none of these countries ever got to a point where the majority of women were doing anything other than breastfeed, at least while their babies were small.