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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Were they right or should I complain?

152 replies

Gauchita · 16/10/2011 16:30

Right, having shed a few tears I'm now calmer and can ask you all about this. I really don't know whether they were right or not, so I'm perfectly open to be told they were and if so I'll just get a grip and forget it.

Today we went shopping as DD needed new pijamas. While we were shopping at a store (don't know if I can name them) DS, who is 6 weeks old, started crying. I had fed him at home so that he wasn't hungry for a little while at least, so I took him out of his pram to check whether it was maybe wind. It wasn't wind, he was hungry so I looked for a quiet area in the store, sat down in a low level piece of furniture and started feeding him. I was very discreet (nothing could be seen), no one could see me, there were only two other ladies in that area. A female member of staff passed by me as I was next to one of those "staff only" doors. She saw me and smiled, didn't say anything.

A few minutes later a member of security approached me and told me, very politely, he had been told I was here and he had been asked to tell me I couldn't breastfeed in the store. DH was near now (he had been queuing to pay), heard him and asked whether he was sure that was right. He said yes, so DH politely asked him to speak to the supervisor.

By now I had already finished feeding DS so we just waited for the supervisor to come. When she arrived she told us a member of staff had told her I was there and that I couldn't breastfeed the baby in the store. To be honest she didn't choose the best approach (tone and manner), we asked whether she was sure that was right and she said yes, that this made customers feel uncomfortable Sad She then changed what she had said a bit and now it hadn't been a member of staff who had told her but a customer who had complained about me breastfeeding. I could see DH's face by now and I was already feeling a lump in my throat so I asked DH to leave it there and to just go.

DH, however, asked her again how things had been then, whether it had been a member of staff or a customer, etc, to be honest I just wanted to get out. She had the lovely idea to speak quite loudly the whole time so I felt people were looking at us, agh! DH asked her for her name so she went away with him and DD to give him a card and meanwhile I started putting DS in his pram. The security guy, who stayed with me, then told me that maybe it had to do with the fact that no food or drinks were allowed in the store Confused And then he said he had been breastfed himself and he had breastfed as well (I think he obviously meant his partner) so he had no problem with it but this was how things were. I could only feel the lump in my throat getting bigger and bigger so I just said "This is really disappointing, to be honest" and started to walk towards the lift.

Were they right? This never happened to me with DD (2.4 now) and in 6 weeks it's happened to me twice at two different stores. Would it have been any different had I not sat down and directly walk around feeding him? Would they have been able to say the same? I clearly remember feeding DD walking around places all the time so maybe things have changed? Should I complain with their head office? I really want to know if they were right so as to not do it again or plan whatever outing I have to do better. I felt horrible and cried from the moment I stepped out of the store, but I'm prepared to be told I'm just being hormonal and overreacting.

Thanks and sorry for the length!

OP posts:
Tortoiseinadarkspell · 17/10/2011 05:32

You've done brilliantly, Gauchita. You and your husband both; you didn't make a scene, you questioned them at the time and got a name and time, there's absolutely nothing they can throw back at you about causing a disturbance. To be able to follow this up so quickly and so well with a six week old - well, gosh, is all.

Gauchita · 17/10/2011 05:55

Tortoise, I hope they don't have the nerve to ignore us or brush us off, hopefully they will have the dignity to at least reply to our letter.
Ironically, yesterday it was mothers' day back home... I'm so angry this woman made another woman, a mum, feel this way.

OP posts:
idlevice · 17/10/2011 06:46

How disappointing. No wonder bf-ing rates are so low - experiences & attitudes like this are bound to contribute. I think I will take to carrying a copy of the relevant paperwork around with me in case the need arises.

BullyBeefBadgers · 17/10/2011 06:56

You were definitely in the right OP. Complain away as other women may be in the same position as you. Unfortunately some people out there are still victorian in their attitudes towards BF and she sounds like one of them. I think her attitude sounds worse. If she had somehow got the rules wrong and been lovely about it I would have given her the benefit of the doubt but seeing as she rudely pointed you in the direction of mothercare as if all BF mothers should rush to mothercare just to feed is disgraceful. I only hope she doesn't have children to pass that attitude onto.

Congrats on your baby OP and hope you get her good Grin

FrankNCock · 18/10/2011 21:12

Good on you, let us know what happens. Happy to read the letter if you haven't sent it already. I enjoy a good letter of complaint. Grin

Secondtimelucky · 18/10/2011 21:44

Good on you for complaining. Hopefully if we say stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M stupid H&M lots of times it will trigger something on their media alerts to pull up the need for some very urgent staff training and a big apology to you.

5littleducks - that actually sounds like a pretty good response from M&S. Ok, one staff member was stupid, but at least the manager knew the score and head office had the sense to grovel. Now just some reminder training for the staff who might be getting it wrong...

Gauchita · 19/10/2011 09:43

Busy and crazy days here. We had a programmed trip down south to get DS's passport on Monday so I've been offline. AND I got mastitis yesterday, ouch! On ABs at the moment and fortunately improving a bit. Now back home so I want to get this letter going. Does anyone know if it's better to email it to them or to send it by post? I'm just thinking that email is more immediate but not sure what's best.

Off to complete the legal part of the letter and I'll post it, suggestions welcome!

OP posts:
RitaMorgan · 19/10/2011 10:56

I think I would email - then you can CC it to as many managers/directors etc as you can find the email addresses of. Harder to ignore then.

Gauchita · 19/10/2011 12:00

Right, DH is now looking for email addresses from H&M directors on Google as they're not that easy to find, I also agree email is faster and you can cc more people. If we can't find any I'll have to email customer services, which is the address the supervisor gave us. I entered a hyperlink where it says Equality Act 2010 in the email so that it takes them directly to the Act.

Here's the letter. I suck at writing this type of thing, so any suggestions are welcome Smile I think it might be too long Blush

To whom it may concern,

I am writing to you to complain about an unfortunate incident that took place on Sunday 16th October 2011 at the H&M store in XXX.

We had been to the other H&M store in XXX buying some pyjamas for our daughter when we headed off to the XXX store to find some things for me. While we were there our son, who is 6 weeks old, started to cry. He had been fed before we left our house but it had already been about an hour since then.

We looked at the queue and decided that my husband would stand in line with our daughter to pay for the things we had chosen while I fed our son. I went to a quiet area of the store in order not to be in anyone?s way and I started breastfeeding the baby; this was right next to a ?staff only? door, but I made sure I was not in the middle of anything or anyone?s way.

Minutes later a member of security approached me and said someone had informed him I was there and that he had to tell me I could not breastfeed in the store. I was extremely surprised, to be honest, and my husband, who came over after paying for our items, asked him whether he was sure about that. He said yes and repeated what he had said before. My husband went on to tell him that there had been a newspaper article about exactly the same type of incident at another retailer and that he was sure what he was saying was not correct and proceeded to ask for the store supervisor.

Ms. XXX, who claimed to be the store supervisor, approached us minutes later and repeated what the security person had told us; that a member of staff had informed her of my feeding the baby and that I could not do it as ?customers didn?t like it?. Then she went on to slightly change her words and now it had not been a member of staff who had ?reported? me but a customer who had complained about me feeding the baby.

My husband again asked her whether she was sure and also told her about the article in the newspaper, but she just went on to say I could not feed the baby in the store, that it was company policy, that there were no facilities for that and that there were, in her exact words, ?cafes or Mothercares to do that?.

To be honest, I was quite shocked at the level of ignorance a store supervisor could show; not to mention her lack of sensitivity and decorum to speak to us. She always chose a rather loud tone of voice, which was completely unnecessary, and made me feel embarrassed, when I had no reason at all to feel that way.

My husband said we would have to complain with H&M head office as this was not legal. She simply told us to complain, but that I could not feed the baby in the store (by now I had already finished feeding him). My husband wanted to record her words for our complaint but she refused.

At that moment the only thing I could think of was getting out of the store as soon as I could, so I told my husband we should just leave. He demanded to have her details and she agreed to give us a customer service card and wrote her name at the back.

As a regular H&M customer I can honestly say I was extremely disappointed at this appalling demonstration of ignorance, lack of customer care, not to mention the fact that what she asked from me was/is not legal.

Pursuant to the Equality Act 2010 a woman is protected by the law and can breastfeed in public places such as parks, hospitals, shops, theatres, public transport, etc. I urge you to take a look at this Act and read it thoroughly.

It is very disappointing to see that clearly the staff at H&M have not been trained in this respect, and that maybe this same incident happens on a daily basis at your stores. Our baby is very young; at 6 weeks you cannot tell when they are going to be hungry again. Do you really think it is reasonable to ask for a mother to drop everything she has in her hands while shopping at one of your stores and, as your supervisor clearly told me, look for a café or a ?Mothercare? to feed him? Is that really what you expect women to do when they have babies/children who are breastfed and happen to be out shopping?

I was made to feel by this very unsympathetic member of staff that what I was doing was not right, that it was making other customers uncomfortable. No woman or mother should be made to feel that. Women with young babies should not be made to feel they have to geographically plan their outings with exact precision so as to drop everything at the sign of hunger from their babies to look for a place to feed their babies. Our daughter was breastfed for 18 months and I fed her anywhere and everywhere and I never experienced such an incident.

As I said before, considering myself a regular customer at H&M I was extremely disappointed. I looked at the three bags we had full of products from your store in disbelief and asked myself why I had spent our money there.

I sincerely hope you reconsider your company policy and modify it accordingly as soon as possible. What your staff have been told to do/say is not legal. You cannot ask a woman to stop breastfeeding or leave your store to breastfeed; it is completely unacceptable.

I am copying La Leche League, the Association of Breastfeeding Mothers and Breastfeeding Network in this email as well.

Looking forward to hearing from you,

Kind regards,

Gauchita.

OP posts:
organiccarrotcake · 19/10/2011 12:39

Very much behind what you're doing, Gauchita. You are being polite and clear and I very much look forward to hearing their reply.

You might like to consider CCing the NCT as well. You might also send them this link; www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/9308753.Breastfeeding_women_unite_for_store_celebration/ which covers what happened recently when staff in a Debenhams concession made the same mistake, and in the end Debenhams dealt with it very well.

tiktok · 19/10/2011 12:42

Go for it, Gauchita :)

choceyes · 19/10/2011 12:59

HOw disgraceful of H&M! Poor you, you did nothing wrong. Looking forward to hearing their reply.

RitaMorgan · 19/10/2011 12:59

I think I might leave out the bit about feeding the baby before you left the house etc - you don't need to justify yourself, you baby needed to be fed and that's it!

NotJustClassic · 19/10/2011 13:05

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Gauchita · 19/10/2011 13:12

Thanks for all the suggestions Smile

Rita, DH said the same. I'm taking it out now.
NotJustClassic, Grin at not giving them kind regards. I'll put "yours" then.
Organic, I'll include the NCT as well, yes.

Couldn't find any personal emails. I think I'll have to use the customer service one.

OP posts:
Gauchita · 19/10/2011 13:16

DH just found the email of the marketing manager to send her the email... What do you think, yes or no?

OP posts:
fluffythevampirestabber · 19/10/2011 13:23

I would send it to her.

If you can get a "personal" email address rather than a generic one, you're less likely to be ignored iyswim?

fluffythevampirestabber · 19/10/2011 13:35

Just a tip.

Since you have the marketing manager's email addy. Corporations usually follow the same format for emails

eg [email protected]

or [email protected]

so, since the MD is Karl-Johan Persson, the chairman of the board is Stefan Persson, and so on - the link to the board of directors is here it should be possible for you to work out all of their email addys or have a fair good stab at them

Gauchita · 19/10/2011 13:45

Fluffy, yes, I saw that but I wasn't sure whether to email them as all seem to be from HQ in Stockholm. The only name DH managed to find from the UK was this marketing manager. Thinking about it, it does concern them anyway even though they're not the ones responsible from the UK stores, you're right Grin

OP posts:
fluffythevampirestabber · 19/10/2011 13:48

Well they're in charge of H&M as a brand - me I'd email the MD but then I'm bolshie Grin

Gauchita · 19/10/2011 13:50

Yes, you're right, I'll cc him and some more as well! Grin

OP posts:
fluffythevampirestabber · 19/10/2011 13:51
Grin
Debs75 · 19/10/2011 14:00

You were treated really badly so I'm glad you are complaining about this.
The e-mail is abit long, you only really need to put you were feeding a tiny baby, discreetly and then were told you couldn't feed by a security guard then the manager. You have to make a point of how rude the manager was and how she was very discouteous to you. and point out that you as a customert was made to feel uncomfortable and unwanted. Cite any recent laws as well.

Hope you get a satisfactory reply

Gauchita · 19/10/2011 14:08

I've re-read it and shortened it a bit now Smile

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catsareevil · 19/10/2011 14:12

Thats awful of them. H&M does tend to be bad for customer service.

If you havent sent your letter yet, I think that there are some bits that would be better taken out: - the 'to be honest', the bit about the newspaper (because its not surprising that they didnt find that a convincing arguement in itself, and you are completely right and dont need the back up of a newspaper). I would also take out the bit about your husband 'demanding' the address and asking to record her, as they will probably say that was inappropriate.

I dont think you need to say much about the difficulty of planning feeding of a young baby. Yes it is difficult but that is irrelevent. It is your right to feed your baby when you want to, even if you could have perfectly easily done it elsewhere.

The reply from H&M should be good. I hope they apologise profusely to you Smile