Why is MN carrying breastpump ads now?

[Brollyflower]

Anyone else think this is a bit odd? Especially as it's promoting the brand name of a well known nipple cream too...

Marchpane -you don't agree that the major cause of soreness and nipple damage in breastfeeding mothers is related to positioning and attachment (latch)?

Also, I'm not sure how it benefits women to say breastfeeding is easy. Most people I know who have continued to bf beyond a few weeks have said they were helped by knowing it can be incredibly difficult for the first few weeks, this isn't abnormal, but then usually gets much easier after 6 weeks or so.

Breastfeeding is natural, and good for you and babe for reasons x, y, z surely more helpful.

Ooop x-posted, and you say that as someone setting up a support group. Really?

Who said breastfeeding was easy ?

Well, I kind of get you, but I also think there are MUCH bigger things to worry about/battles to save your energy for.

I don't mean that in a bitchy way -- obv it is the case for many posts on MN but with this, it just doesn't seem worth getting aerated about.

Toodleoo

What do you suggest instead of advertising? A breastpump factsheet?

Brolly - I get you too. The more pumping is seen as part and parcel of breastfeeding (and with the likes of SWMNBN and CBC claiming pumping output = milk supply) the more medicalised and mechanised bfing becomes.

It becomes that extra step needed to be mastered in order to bf successfully. You need to be bfing and pumping so baby will take a bottle so you are 'free' to go out and resume your life sans baby.

For all the ubiquitousness of expressing within the current Western bfing culture not many women seem to be aware that:-

even the most expensive pump is not as good as their healthy baby (caveats apply for ill or prem babies),

that pumping output is not a good indicator of supply,

that most women need to express more than once (both sides) to make enough milk for one expressed feed,

that exclusive pumping whilst it can be the only way to give bm to a baby can lead to dwindling supply (pump doesn't remove as much milk as baby, sending the signal not as much milk needed) this in't a given but can and does happen,

that a mix of hand expressing and pumping can be the most effective way to get the most amount of milk.

Doesn't seem like pump advertising is telling the whole story (funny that).

Plus the controversy surrounding Lansinoh's parent company (they are Pigeon who are WHO Code breakers re advertising bottles etc) so it's a bit of an ethical minefield really.

To be clear I have used umpteen different pumps with varying degrees of success from about 30 'sucks' to one drop of milk to being able to pump 3-4oz in a matter of minutes. In my case pumping was the only way I kept my supply going until DD1 went back to bfing (was almost exclusively bottle fed for 8w) and also the only way I was able to keep bfing DD3 whilst I was ill in hospital and whilst she was ill in hospital (we've had a crappy year with regards to health).

So I am really glad that pumps exist but think that they should be treated like any piece of medical equipment - used when the benefits outweigh the risks (risks in this case being stressed over 'lack' of milk/feeling like you have to express so XX can feed the baby/adding an extra layer of things to do [pump/sterilise/cup or bottle feed baby]).

No I'm not saying breastfeeding is easy, but neither is it bound to be horrendous with only equipment saving you

I think it's a strange thing to say. I bf DS for 12 months. I used a breast pump on occasion, once he was past the 6 wk mark. It was not a necessary evil, I chose to so it gave me more flexibility and definitely made the bf experience better for me.

So I bought one out of choice, and yes advertising is designed to guide consumers in their product choice. Nothing wrong with that. Doesn't detract from the need to provide proper bf support, in the same way the info provided in advertising of kids medicines does not replace seeing your doctor.

Tbh I think taking such a hard line against any bf aids is quite offputting, not all successful breastfeeders are so inflexible.

FSS really

"advertising is designed to guide consumers in their product choice"

no it's aimed to sell products. Tehre is a distinction

Of course it's to sell products, I am not totally stooopid. But in order to do that, advertising tells you what a product is, what it does, it's benefits etc. And thus you choose your product.

When I researched breast pumps, this was the information I looked for, as well as recommendations from midwife etc.

Flutey said: "Tbh taking such a hard line against any bf aids is quite offputting"

Who is taking a hard line against "bf aids" (your words)? I am talking about advertising products, not using them nor the existence of them nor indeed suggesting their use under some circumstances.

Panzee I would suggest appropriate and timely information provided by health professionals and others without a vested interest (i.e. not companies or people who get financial benefit from the sale or hire of such equipment). There is quite a difference, for example, between endorsing X brand of pump and discussing "a double electric breastpump" or discussing the pros and cons of hand expressing, a manual pump or an electric pump.

Also, people who like reading advertising, do you think a product manufacturer or vendor gives you full, accurate and impartial information about any potential disadvantages of their product?

If not, are they the best place to get a balanced view?

So you'd rather attack me than explain your qualifications? How disappointing and immature.

I think you're just deliberately trying to wind people up. Or you are of extremely limited intelligence. Either way no point in debating with you in the same way there's no reasoning with a toddler.

I'm hiding this thread before I really lose it.

I have not attacked anyone. I asked you a question.

I had incredibly sore nipples I nearly quit - I didn't know about the creams - wish I'd known earlier. Didn't change my position or latch at all, they cleared up and were fine for the 13 months following that.

Ditto realising what a help a breast pump could be - would have made life much happier with DS1 in those early days/weeks/months.

I do see the point regarding the commercialisation of breastfeeding, and companies will look for a way of squeezing money out of everything. I don't think breastpump ads are a good thing, but they're not intrinsically worse than any other type of advertising imo.

But Brolly, I inferred that you meant that use of breast pumps under some circumstances meant where there was a medical reason to do so, and therefore does not include those of us who simply choose, for whatever reason, to use a breast pump and find it helps us.

By saying that advertising them is not appropriate, it seems you are saying they are bad except under a particular set of circumstances. And this has not been my experience of them, I found mine to be a great help, and therefore I disagree.

Sorry Flutey, no that's not what I meant. Of course people use breastpumps to express milk for all sorts of reasons. That could be because they want to go out for the night, or because they're returning to work or whatever.

The fact remains that pumping, especially if combined with introducing a bottle, and especially in the early days can (not will, but can) interfere with some aspects of breastfeeding. As most women only breastfeed for a short time and the vast majority say for less time than they wanted to, I don't think actively promoting pumps to all is helpful. Lots of mums antentally who intend to breastfeed seem to believe that a pump, bottles and a steriliser are essential bits of kit even if they are very sure they don't want to use formula. This mantra about pumping to allow dad to feed and to give yourself a break is very ingrained, and where does some of that come from? It would be in the interests of people that make and sell this kit to promote these ideas, wouldn't it? Of course, if people want to do that and can make it work for them then it's absolutely fine. It isn't essential though, it is possible to breastfeed without owning a breastpump .

If we are asking is this ethical, breast pumps are not covered, per se, by the WHO code on marketing, which is a good starting point. It is fine to market breastpumps, and to advertise them, if we are talking about the Code (people may have an opinion either way of course).

However, it would be possible to advertise breast pumps in a way that broke the spirit and the letter of the WHO code - I have not seen the MN ads so can't comment.

If the breast pump is advertised in a way that implied or stated that giving pumped milk was better than/the same as direct breastfeeding, then it would break the spirit of the code.

If it showed the baby being bottle fed with EBM, or showed bottles with teats on (so they become bottles, and not just milk containers), then it would break the letter of the WHO code because bottles are covered by the code.

Just showing the pump in use or by itself is not a violation of the code.

I don't have strong feelings about it, personally, as long as the ad is in line with the Code.

There are plenty of products that some people find useful and some people find useless. A breastpump can be handy, and I would argue, along with WHO/UNICEF, that all women should at least know how to maintain milk production if they are separated from their babies, and that means expressing - by hand (virtually cost free) or pump (if they want to spend money).

I don't think that advertising a breastpump in principle undermines breastfeeding.

Whoops - just seen the ad.

Looks ok to me :)

I don't have any issues with pumps or creams being advertised and would rather people didn't start the 'you must do x or y' or else it's not right/good for the baby etc.
We're all adults and should be free to make our own choices and decisions.

"I would argue, along with WHO/UNICEF, that all women should at least know how to maintain milk production if they are separated from their babies, and that means expressing - by hand (virtually cost free) or pump (if they want to spend money)."

I agree. That info doesn't have to be provided through advertising, though, does it? Are you arguing that these ads are a good thing because they provide that info?

Tiktok -do you think all use of breastpumps is helpful to any breastfeeding woman in all circumstances?