November 2014 - thread 7

[amy83firsttimer]

Jump aboard ladies.

Me too, although I'll be at the meet up on Sunday.

blamber the midwives were super helpful with ds - I must have buzzed them every time we tried for the first 24 hours (lucky enough to be kept in randomly longer than normal) and by the time we left it was fairly sorted.They ddidn't seem to mind...

Had a dream about breastfeeding last night and it worked! Yay. That means it'll be just like that in real life right? Right? Ha ha.

Anyway, off to best friend's baby shower today. She's tres posh and it's hosted by her American step-mom. Slightly dreading it but reckon if I'm underdressed I have a good excuse. I know she's really suffering with the heat so fingers crossed everyone's dressed for cool comfort.

Got her baby some clothes as a present, don't even know if that's the right etiquette or I should have got something for her?

How's everyone else today?

Starting to get nervous that a lot of people have dropped out of the rainbow collective without saying so after myself and others have spent out on all the items and spent time dying and washing everything. I really hope that's not the case as it's pretty off of people to do that and cause added expense for those who possibly can't afford it and have babies on the way! Please can those who are still doing this check the thread and let us know if you are still doing this or have pulled out. I don't mind being left with a couple of leftover bits but I don't need 10 orange baby vests when that money could have bough me something I do need.

The thread dropped off my notifications so for anyone who's stopped getting notifications, it's here: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/antenatal_clubs/2072479-November-2014-Rainbow-Collective

The people we had down were:

Random - orange
Weeonion - lime
Alita - camo green
Ladydolly - black/bottle green/navy
Study - bright blue
TeaNCakes - turquoise
Posy - violet
Twiglet - deep red/burgundy

I was hugely interested in "The Womanly Art of Breast Feeding" until I read the excerpts on Amazon and got to the part where they discussed how breasdtfeeding can be helped by first having "normal" non-intervention births.

Basically, if you have to be induced, you're fucked, lol. You've bought into the myth of medicalised births, loser!

So I just went ooooookaaaaayyy....and closed the tab.

I agree annarose, it's the only thing I struggled with in the hypnobirthing book I had - the implication that if it hurts it's your fault for buying in the 'myth/hype' that labour hurts.
I found hypnobirthing techniques v helpful, more at the start than right at the end, but it was still ruddy uncomfortable, and I doubt that was my fault entirely!

I think it's reasonable to say that induction & drugs can make the baby less alert & feeding may be slightly more difficult. That's fact.

I don't understand why that can't be said without all the evangelical stuff about drug-free non-intervention births. Yes, women are often capable of giving birth in a field with no help, but if medical intervention is needed, then let's be grateful that it's there because the outcome without it is a hell of a lot worse than a slightly less alert baby!!

I read Ina May Gaskin's "Spiritual Midwifery" and while I get the theory, that resisting labour will make it hurt more, it doesn't follow that any woman who experiences more pain must therefore be resisting the labour - we have different pain thresholds and the position of the baby can make an enormous difference from what I've read.

Also, Ina May's thing about you have to give birth quietly and happily so as not to stress out your husband made go Because obviously even childbirth has to be all about not upsetting the poor men in her world!

Its the subtle woman-blaming thing too that I can't stand. Yes, the eeeeevil doctors are mostly to blame, but god help the woman who actually screams "DRUGS NOW!!!"

Well, she's just a sheep who hasn't read the right books/isn't totally connected with her body/is putting her needs ahead of the babys.

Makes me rage. I've no doubt that intervention may affect bfing rates - I was only talking to a collegue yesterday who's baby was pretty zonked for days after birth cos of all the interventions, and as a result simply didn't want to feed. He was too flaked out. She was really struggling as he was too dozy to latch and it was very stressful. And he lost weight and eventually she formula fed cos it was simply faster to push food into him. He started gaining weight and she was massively relieved.

And you know what? He's FINE. Happy ending all around.

But you can't help wondering what the authors of those books would have thought of it.

Formula's one step removed from sparking up a fag, opening a Strongbow and pointing your newborn at the fridge saying "Help yourself," isn't it?

I'm hoping I can BF but I have already promised myself that I am not going to feel guilty if I can't. My baby's needs are very closely connected to mine when it's newborn, and I can't see how it's in the baby's interests to have a stressed, unhappy mother.

There is a huge anti-science movement amongst the new age hippy queers circles in which I move, which I find really frustrating. I've already been told that vaccinating my baby is tantamount to GBH, I know parents who refuse to get rid of their child's nits because they don't want to put "chemicals" on their heads (tea tree oil is allegedly not a chemical compound ), one of my friends believes that smoothies cure cancer. And obviously they are all hugely into natural birth and drug-free and while I'm hoping to do that, I'm not getting into the anti-science stuff that comes with it.

I think women are particularly susceptible to anti-science because historically we have had a really awful deal from medicine and the pathologising of womanhood, and because we are discouraged from hard sciences.

If I have a daughter she is learning the value of double-blind peer-reviewed testing before she gets into reception.

I had to be induced with dd and still managed to bf her for two years. There were hard times but you get through it and I always just trusted myself that I could do it and I did.

I'm of the "anti science" persuasion to a degree - I delayed vaccinations with DD and she had her 13 month ones at 2.5 and I had no intention of giving the preschool booster but her "father" did it when she was 6 against my will & frankly I'll never forgive him and still want to stab him in the eye for that. I used hippy herbal products on her, no Johnson's devils piss stuff, never used a baby wipe or soap or bubble bath before the age of 3, she never had any drinks except water, milk or fresh juice or any food that wasn't 100% natural, organic and totally home made before school and even then only got it at parties or school dinners which I would rage over, and never used chemical lotions and creams on her, no nappy rash cream, no nit lotion, nothing, no chemical cleaning products in the house, no air fresheners, hairsprays, perfumes allowed, I went medieval on the ex for soaking the garden in weed killer and moved to my mother's with DD for 3 months over it. And I stand by it all. I'll be doing it all again with this one. However when it comes to birth I am elective c-section all the way and won't even entertain the notion of natural birth, with or without pain relief, give me every damn drug going and as medicalised birth as possible!

I want the safest most natural birth I can have.

Women can and do give birth in the middle of a field but I'm sure if we all did it then the infant and maternal mortality rate would increase...

But then what is the definition of a 'natural birth'. I want to use a birthing pool, It's not meds and it's not invasive like forceps, but it's a form of intervention!

Oh and my camo green is a bit lighter than expected so apologies!

My bright Easy Jet orange is more dark, dull orange.

First baby shower survived! There were 3 pregnant guests plus the friend who's having the baby shower. Very interesting especially as one of the other pregnant guests is a midwife and there was also a doctor and a senior obstetrician there.
Not cringey either and she seemed to like the present and I got fed cake. All round success I'd say. She's got the bednest so had a fiddle with that too.

We've had a glorious day at a local craft/food/music festival, then last minute play in the paddling pool with ds, then dh said he'd put him to bed and ran a bath for me... I'm really Really REALLY going to miss this in a few months.
Actually really quite nervous about coping with two under two (only just though.) I know something like 60% of the population do it, and it's the age gap we wanted but arghgghhg!

Moan moan moan....
Can't sleep, stinking cold, cant take any medicine, can't breathe, too hot....
Moan moan moan...

I can't be the only one in the country who wants it to be 20 degrees cooler and raining? Had enough now!

Yeah Petal, my MIL defo is another one to moan. She has driven me crazy over her weekend stay in our house. I cannot convince her that this is not a heat, it's called summer
The funny bit is that she keeps painting ME ill by going on about me suffering from heat, not being able to walk (she literally asked if I could walk when we were to walk around nearby town!) and being tired after 40 minute wander because of my pregnancy.
So to make a point that I am VERY well, I did stuff in the garden for the rest of the afternoon. Hope seeing me digging, cutting, watering etc for hours will make her back off my non-existing pregnancy symptoms.

On the more happy note, since Friday my DH can also feel the DD kicks from outside. Now we can feel them together! He was very excited as I have been for a week moving her hand around my bump and telling that then was a kick but he could not feel them.
I still cannot believe how it all is coming together in one piece and it's my body hosting the whole thing! :)

Feeling energetic this morning. Up at 6.15, walked neighbour's dog at 7.45, in the pool with reluctant DH at 9.10. Just back from pool now after 25 lengths. Is it nap time yet?

Petal I am glad it's cooler today although I threw up violently at lunchtime so not sure what that's all about. We'd headed out in the car to go and look at buggies and had to turn round cos I was felling sick and went all sweaty. I was sick not longer after we got back. Not eaten anything weird etc. still feel slightly off but have kept toast, lucozade and water down now.

Strawberry, my dp finally felt bean yesterday - every time I've got him to come and feel, bean has gone quiet but gave a right kick yesterday. I can also see my belly moving sometimes (but wobbly so it shows as a wobble!)

Interesting to read everyone's thoughts on bf and births.

Oh no FTMK hope it was just an off day and you're not like it again.

Petal I completely agree, I could feel my heart beatig through my head at about 3 this morning, had to get a wet flannel and wipe myself down infront of a fan for half an hour. Hasn't been as bad today tho and I may have napped during the sunniest bit so I didn't notice it particularly.
My friends have bought me a paddling pool now so if I get hot, I'm in it for the day!!

In terms of natural birth, I had always said epidural, as my mum swore by it, but now talking to others I want to try and go as natural as possible as I know it can make the baby less stressed. But my pain threshold is that of a 2 year old so I'm guessing in 3 and a half months time I will be on here listing the different types of drugs I had and how wonderful they were......

I really just want to avoid an epidural, a caesarean or forceps if possible and id like to be in labour less than 36 hours. If that happens then ill be over the moon even if the rest of the plans go out the window!

It's so lovely when your DP can feel the baby kick. DP got home from work the other day and I gave her a hug, and the baby kicked so hard it HER in the stomach! She looked ever so surprised