We will have a calm and worry-free pregnancy with lots of jumping beans and bouncing babies and will BROOK NO ARGUMENT on that (Part 7)

[TooImmatureTurtleDoves]

i think the floor scrubbing (or leaning over ball on all fours) think is about avoiding baby being back to back. seeing as my failure to dilate properly was apparently related to DS's position, i figure I'd better try everything! don't think it affects breech or not??

glad you enjoyed the class, if not the teacher! I've no antenatal classes this time. the nhs ones were ok last time, but i didn't feel right leaving work early to do them again. :)

I didn't do any antenatal classes last time but in the early days attached myself to a group as they all went to the net baby group which I did too. It seems to be the best thing is the friends you make through nct. I wouldn't be without my lot but the clsees didn't sound helpful for someone in my position tbh except the bf one.

jaggy - You work so late!

purple - Although when ttc dd2 I got quite accustomed to my cervix it would now seem I have possibly lost it! Nothing firm though anywhere as far as I can feel... Please let this sweep work, please let this sweep work!

Have been telling baby to listen to dream - she knows what she's talking about. I hope she's had a better nights sleep as well.

Thanks everyone, I'm definitely going to go for an early scan DH can call it my birthday prezzie if he likes as with the booking in appointment not til 10 weeks, I can't see myself getting an NHS scan before I'm 13weeks! I'm 7+1 today so it will definitely be 8 weeks before I get an appointment, I would expect.

What is bad about a back to back labour?

I could soooo go for a twix right now :d

Oooh good luck for the scan booking etc Popcorn - I think it will really set your mind at rest

I think back to back labours are generally more painful pops although I'm not entirely sure in what way it's more painful iyswim?

Scream glad you enjoyed your NCT class - how many sessions do you have to go to? And never mind the teacher - I also found that by far the most useful thing was the friends I made. I'm super glad it's cheered you up a bit.

How is your quest for a CS going by the way Scream - where are you at with it? When's your next appt?

my DS was back to back, ended up with an EMCS under General Anaesthetic. Harder to push out, means longer labour, more likelihood of intervention/distress/CS was the impression i got. Also didn't help that my cervix had a lip that didn't move out the way, so he was pushing against the edge of my cervix and getting nowhere....having seen a near identical case on OBEM it would seem that i shouldn't have been told to push until the lip had moved away...as pushing in that situation can do more harm than good...

Ah I see, thanks loopy and Biscuits :)

Got a proper jabby jabby pain in my boob today

pomme i was supposed to finish at 10, but we had some issues and i had to wait. doesn't happen too often, but i was there till 11.30 in the end. DS decided to wake up at about 1.50am as well... just had a cuddle and slept ok after that though. pre DS i used to get a long lie for this shift, i don't start till 2pm.

MW said that DS wouldn't have been pressing on the cervix properly due to his position, so i was dilating really slowly. i only got to 6 or 7 cm apparently, even with drip in the end. he did indeed get a wee bit distressed at one point loopy but was ok once i changed position. I'm not sure ending up on my back for hours with drip and epidural helped much either i suppose! i hadn't even thought about needing a cs beforehand so feel a bit more prepared for anything this time.

Good to know the ball / all fours thing is about anterior vs posterior, rather than breech vs cephalic. I hadn't realised, but that makes sense.

As for my cs campaign Biscuits, I've drafted a letter to go to the head consultant at my hospital outlining my concerns, stating my request and asking for an appointment to discuss this further. I'm hanging onto the letter for now because I have a physio appt tomorrow and I'm going to ask my physio for a letter of recommendation which I'll attach to my letter as further support. I'll send in the letter this week, and follow up next week by booking an appointment even if I haven't heard back from the consultant.

It's nice that there's another couple in our class having a planned cs as well, and theirs is also "maternal request". So there are two couples for the teacher to disapprove of! Not just DH & I!

Sorry to hear about the jabby boob pain Popcorn, I don't miss that at all! It should go soon, especially if you brook no argument with it! Glad you've made a decision about the early scan, let us know once you've booked it!

How was your DD last night Dream? Hope you both got some sleep despite the coughing.

So is everyone having pancakes today? I looooooooooooove pancake day although bizarrely I never bother to make them at any other time of year I won't be giving up anything for lent though, I think 9 months off alcohol should pretty much have me covered in the self-denial department!

Scream - exactly the same here on the pancakes. I luuuurve them, and every year say we should do them not just on pancake day, but never do. I always leave them to DH to cook though (at least partly because our frying pan is Le Creuset and would probably do me a mischief if I tried any tossing action .

Sadly though, I don't think we'll get them done today as we have our growth scan at 3, then back to get DS from nursery, but doubt DH will be home then, then I've got to get DS in bed and get to our first nct refresher class for 7:30 so all a bit manic!!

However hopefully we might manage to do them at the weekend? If I'm lucky, there is a pancake shop in our village and if I've done my jobs I might sneak in there for one after dropping DS off at nursery and before I go to pick up DH for the scan appt.

Your plan for operation CS sounds very efficient Scream and I'm sure that being do organised will help. Also glad you have safety in numbers at your nct group. Some teachers are fine and pragmatic about all this stuff but others are a bit if you 'give in' and have something as cheaty as gas and air, or a paracetamol, or if you don't give birth in a field or whatever

I was just saying to DH last might that I think there's a lot of media pressure on pg women that if you can give birth, possibly with G&A, but no tears / grazes / stitches, that in some way you've done it 'right'. I wholeheartedly disagree with this idea of course but I still think there is this pressure there.

We had a girl come in to yoga last night to tell her birth story and she was all 'oh I'm so glad I only had G&A and no other drugs, I wouldn't have felt do able to bond with my baby if I'd been out of it on drugs' blah blah blah. Well I'm really glad for her that she had a straightforward and fairly quick birth (whole thing start to finish was say, 6 hours?) but it just isn't helpful to spout that sort of stuff when you've never been in the position of needing anything else, or having any complications. But my point about the pressure is that the yoga teacher was saying things like 'oh what a success story' as if she'd done it 'right'. Of course we'd all love a birth like that but it just doesn't work like that all the time!

Rant over - don't know where that came from

Also not giving up anything for lent, other than perhaps, smoking, drinking, class A drugs, hay fever tablets, Brie, sleeping through the night etc

NB, even not pregnant I don't do drugs or smoke, just for clarity......

I always suspected you were a closet hippy hooked on drugs Biscuits Otherwise how could you possibly be so nice all the time!?!

I totally agree on the pressure issue. I've said this before but I HATE the comment "Your body is designed to give birth" as if it's a completely unknown phenomenon for the body to experience a complication whilst going through a normal process. The last person to say this to me was the consultant at my last appt. How can you sit in a hospital filled with people who's bodies aren't doing what they want them too, people whose lungs or liver or ovaries aren't doing what they're "designed" to do, and expect me to swallow that line!?! I rather think my body is also designed to walk without pain - that's not working out so well for me at the moment!

Okay, rant over That was a sympathy rant by the way, I'm not back in my funked out mood yet

Yum yum yum, had some pancakes wth maple syrup already. DH chose to have savoury pancakes . Today I have decided is going to be a productive day - I WILL tackle the enormous pile of miscellaneous papers that has been uncovered by emptying out the second bedroom. I will not sit around ignoring this most boring of tasks. Oh no. Today is going to be PRODUCTIVE.

Right after I do a bit of internet shopping... ahem...

right I'm tired already and I've only inflated my ball, not actually done any exercise.

i want to internet shop too. PIL have kindly offered to buy a new pram if we decide we do want to replace the annoying bursty tyres one... might just do some research...

Hello all!

I'm still tired and sore but was only up with my own issues, not dd . Sadly that was still a lot of getting up as sleeping propped up & on side = unbearable rib pain, but flatter is better for ribs but horrendous for reflux...

Yes popcorn my dd was back to back too. means baby would come out 'sunny side up' so facing ceiling if you're on your back. More painful labour as apparently the 'wrong' bit of the head is pressing on the cervix so it doesn't dilate so well plus its a wider circumference of head they're presenting. And they're more likely to get stuck and not descend as their spine is in line with your spine so they push against your ?? coccyx. All in all, bad plan. I did all the hands and knees stuff but struggled on my side due to rib pain so probably undid it all by sleeping on my back for at least parts of the night.

I need to learn to make pancakes so i can make dd some for tea!!! Recipe anyone? Needs to be idiot proof.

And scream, nothing annoys me more than 'your body was designed to give birth'. Maybe before we started walking on 2 legs but our lower spinal curve really gets in the way now and I can tell you, my body had no idea and was certainly giving no sign of being designed for any such thing last time!!!

Brooking for Biscuits to have a good scan today. I'd have been really and at the lady who turned up at yoga. Good job for her baby then that she didn't need any drugs if she wouldn't have been able to bond with it otherwise

Scream I was put off NCT hearing stories like that. Like others have said, just use it to seek out some like minded people.

Sorry you're feeling rough still dream

Yay for new pram jaggy

Pancakes were done at lunchtime here. DS had strawberries and Nutella, I kept it simple and went for old fashioned lemon and sugar. DH has put in a request for later, so I will be going for a second round then

We are waiting for the weekend for our pancakes as DH cooks them and does about 6 times the recipe which takes a while to cook. He won't be in until late tonight as he has the chinese customers hounding him to sort their problem out. He wants to get it sorted otherwise he will have to fly out there and is not too keen ATM !
First day back to work after half term and I now feel completely wiped out! One of the parents bought her new baby in, 11 days old. She went into labour at 3.30, got in the pool at home and he was born at 5.30! That will do me thanks :)
Hope scan is all good biscuits

Thank you for the brooking - seems to be paying off! So the baby is still big (quelle suprise?) but no more big if you see what I mean. It hasn't gone up the centiles at all, so is growing at the rate it should for a 90+ centile baby.

Apparently it is in the region of 6lb 14 at the mo (plus or minus 25%!!). So I would guess that would be on a par with its big brother, ish.

In terms of an exit strategy I think they're fairly hopeful that I should be able to do it vaginally, but the mw did say that as long as they know what happened last time, if it's not progressing they might bail out sooner for a CS, so that made me feel a bit better. I think I might work out a birth plan to put my thoughts down while they still make sense. I think they are also slightly banking on me going early ish again. I'm finding I'm a lot less panicked about things now - I think I did my panicking about 5-10 weeks ago.

If I'm still preggo I have another scan at 38 weeks, but not really a growth scan, just to check the amount of fluid. But as I say I think they're kind of hoping I'm off their books by then. If I'm at that scan I'll be pushing to find out how big the baby is again and talking about when they would induce or CS me - I don't fancy going to 42 weeks!

So, the kidneys are also looking the same - no worse which is good. Just needs to be followed up post birth with renal scans etc.

So all in all, it's good news I guess.

Jealous of your pancakes Scarlet - especially round 2 tonight! I never got my pancake earlier but I might go tomorrow - I'm not missing out

Dream sorry you're so uncomfortable , you poor poor thing. At least dd slept through, it's just a shame you can't. I felt really ill last night after I got up for the loo, so I said to DH 'oh, I feel sick', 'do you?' . Cheers darling!

I've forgotten everything else - sorry that was all so mememe

we had our scan this afternoon, DP pleased as just one baby in there! heartbeat fine, and legs were kicking like crazy, but as i suspected, i ovulated late so they now think my due date is the 11th Sept rather than 3rd-5th which is what various medical people told me it would be!! Happy with that as even if it's as early as DS was, it should still be born in September for the new school year Bean was too small for them to get a decent measurement for the nuchal test, so got to go back next Tuesday for another scan. Very relieved that all is well in there!!

just curious, is there anyone on here who has had a back to back that hasn't resulted in an EMCS??

Yay for a good scan Loopy

Great news - and a bonus scan next week too

Oh, you've reminded me, at the moment this baby is back to back , so I also would like to know the answer to that question. They don't seem that bothered about it, but I might be able to let you know in a few weeks if I can get away without an EMCS!

To be fair they said there's still a chance it'll turn itself and the contractions might turn it

I must also try to establish when I go into labour which way it is!

Hi all!

Biscuits, so glad the scan went well! Sounds like UBB is a great size too?

Loopy, congrats to you too for a great scan!

Purple and Dream, it could be discharge... though (TMI!) doesn't smell . After lying down for a few hours yesterday evening and then last night, there were no gushes - despite a few teeny ones during the day (which could just be collected discharge I suppose?). Felt fine for most of today but there was another suspicious incident earlier.. I'm not sure. Either way, LO is moving lots still, and I'm feeling fine, so trying not to worry for the meantime. Midwife appointment on Fri, and if I'm overly concerned tomorrow or Thurs I'll phone up beforehand. Purple, I did manage to get my sweet fix in the end..! Sorry you're feeling rough Dream* :(

Scream, how are things going re your CS mission? Have you talked to many people? You might have posted about it already and I've missed it, sorry! The NCT class sounds interesting, people-wise. I like the idea of them, but what with potential house buying and moving we definitely can't afford them!

Money wise... I agree that there's nothing wrong with being careful with money - I'm super careful! We've been carefully buying a few bits every time a pay slip has come in, and we've now got nearly everything for the baby. We haven't yet got a moses basket - which we think we'll need space-wise until the nursery's ready - but my father in law has offered to buy something to help us out (and was quite miffed we'd already bought everything else!), so hopefully he'll help us out with that. I'm also currently working insanely hard to get bump up our income as much as possible before I go on ML... the joys of being partly freelance!

Does anyone have any recommendations re birthing balls? That's one thing I haven't got yet - chucked my physio ball for my back when we moved a while back, which was daft as it would come in useful now!

Pancakes sound lovely! DH is on a bit of a healthy eating diet, so I don't think we'll be having any here. Besides, he's a fan of American pancakes.. which I have no problem with (and make for breakfast every now and again) but I think pancake day should be about English pancakes, which he doesn't agree with .

Ooh great scan news! 25% is a huge margin though!
Music give your MW a ring please, if it is your waters then you need checking over. Keep checking your temp in the mean time and if you have a fever go and get checked out.
I have this birth ball DH bought it and I was bit at the ££s I was looking at one on natal hypnotherapy site as I was buying anyway, but bought both off Amazon. It does have posters and things which will be helpful, you have to pick the ball size according to height so check that out.

Oh and me me me! I had a OP baby that wouldn't shift! I think she turned in labour and ultimately I just felt my labour in my back more than anything for the beginning and I attribute being so late due to her position.

Sorry you had a rough night Dream I did too, but luckily Dh was able to go into work a bit late so I could sleep. I have the battle of not wanting to sleep on my back as it is uncomfortable and possibly dangerous, but sleeping on my side kills my ribs and pelvis. I also ordered the 2 way elite today so that will be here Thurs :)

Jaggy new pushchair exciting! Good luck with the VBAC obviously it will be great.

I have to confess I have been getting a few twinges now! I think it is nothing but it shows my body is gearing up!

Dh is currently making pancake batter with DDs 'help' she is a very careful stirrer! Although I have given her pasta earlier so hopefully won't be a big pancake binge, Dh has doubled the mix and we are going for the thin recipe as got a bit bored of thick. Usually do thick when it is just me and the girls so eat them fairly regularly. :)

Sorry if I have missed anyone!

Yes, the plus/minus 25% gives us 5lb 3oz - 8lb 9oz

My labour was back to back from start to finish and didn't end up EMCS. It should have been an EMCS and it very nearly was. It was only naivity on my part (I thought EMCS would be worse than forceps) so I kept refusing the EMCS.

The labour was very, very long. 3 days. I was told that the baby would probably turn during labour. He didn't. People say back to back is more painful. I don't know as I don't have a normal labour to compare it to, but I did honestly think that it wasn't possible to survive that amount of pain and I was terrified . The consultant tried to talk me into CS from about 6 hours before DS actually arrived. In the end I agreed, but on the condition they tried forceps first. I was taken to theatre as they did think it would end up being EMCS. I was told I had 3 pushes to get him out with forceps and if it didn't work they would do EMCS. I had an episiotomy and they turned him round with their hands while I pushed, then pulled him out with the forceps. Recovery wise, the episiotomy wasn't too bad. Obviously very sore for a few weeks and I was aware of it for months afterwards. But painful? Not really.

In hindsight, I should have gone for the CS. But I'd been frightened by a friend who'd had one 3 months previously who'd suffered terribly afterwards with an infection. If I end up in the same boat this time, I will go for a section as soon as it's offered. Not that I think that will be an easier option, just that it will mean the labour pain is over sooner.

So pleased your scan went well Loopy and it's good that the dates tied in with what you suspected. Are you making a big announcement now or does everyone already know?

Biscuits fantastic that your LO is still looking good and growing well. Maybe our plans to get together again before he/she arrives will be scuppered after all?

I had a back to back that didn't end in emcs. Failed ventouse then forceps all in theatre. Much like scarlet but shorter labour.

loopy I also had back to back labour and third degree tear rather than emcs. I was induced also very long like scarlet. I also refused CS 10 hours before she was born which i now regret. I also didn't want an op and the recovery, and to 'fail' so insisted on vb too. In hindsight it was very painful, long time in theatre afterwards for my repair and i wish I'd gone to CS. I also was terrified of the pain like scarlet and kept thinking it must be because something was going wrong but was reassured it was because induction is more painful
plus a back to back labour...

Biscuits I was told up to 50% out for growth scans sometimes! Someone on twins thread was told one was a whole lb lighter than the other, went into labour next day and identical birthweights!