For Jonny, and all our darling departed sisters and brothers..."their diminished size is in us, not in them".

[evansmummy]

I have remarked over the last few months that there are a number of us on this forum who are living through the death of our brothers and sisters. I would even go so far as to say I never even imagined there could be so many!

I have also noticed that the thread for bereaved mummies is the most amazing place of support, a great place to go and say how you feel without being judged, and knowing that others are going through something similar. And of course a place to go and get a good old MN hug.

So I wondered if those of you who have lost siblings would like to join me in making a place where we can say how we are feeling and to be here for each other, and even to gripe and moan! If you are interested, just let us know a bit about your sibling and a bit about your grief journey if you like. I'll start!

My youngest brother Jonny died a little over five months ago as a result of head injuries sustained during a hit and run accident. My family spent a week in intensive care with him in a coma before he died of heart failure on Fri 30th May 2008. Horrible, just horrible.

I feel down most of the time. But will admit to the strangest mood swings, from very depressed to almost hyper-excited. I still drink and smoke a lot, but less than right at the beginning. Suffice to say that things are not getting easier or better. Maybe even the opposite. I'm dreading Christmas, Jonny's birthday, and then the inquest and court case. I hate it all so much and wish often that it would just all go away. I still can't believe I'm writing this tuff about my own brother.

It's hard to quickly put into a short paragraph the pain and turmoil of the last five months. But I'm sure if this thread works out we'll have plenty of time to go into more detail.

Over to you...

Love Me xx

Didn't mean my post to be all 'me me me'. Blame the morphine.

MissM: Hey, you are always so selfless in your messages! Don't apologise, please! And in any case, it didn't come across as 'all about you'. And in any case again, you're allowed to say what you want here, remember? What happened with the anaesthetic? How come you had one?!

My other brother just reminded me by email, that anything she could throw at me would never be as bad as what we have to go through with our brother's deaths. He has these moments of wisdom that make me want to squeeze him. He'd hate that though . He's back from Canada in two weeks with his girlfriend. Only for a week but I literally am hopping on the spot waiting to see him. Of course I have always loved him very much, but he has become a thousand times more precious since Jonny died.

I've been listening to Jonny's fave bands all night and I'm all snotty.

MissM, I actually love you (think I've said that before) . Hope the healing goes well. You're very much in my thoughts, as are you all, and as always xx

Had an op on my foot - sadly not glamorous - a bunion that was causing trouble. Feel a bit more with it today but trying not to think how the hell I'm going to get around for the next two weeks. Think I will become close friends with the internet!

What your brother says is spot on. Aren't brothers just the best for saying exactly the right things (don't we just know it). And he's absolutely right - stupid cow can't hurt you, and whatever her problem is it's so trivial and unimportant in the face of what's happened to you and to Jonny. How are you keeping yourself from camping out at the airport?!

Emotions a bit everywhere (must still be the drugs) so am not going to say anything in reponse to your expression of love, but sending many and varied hugs back.

How are the rest of you doing this beautiful summer's day?

Hello everyone. Just wanted to say hello and to give you all a hug. when's it going to get better? x

Hey caffeine. In my experience it doesn't get better, it just gets different. Sorry

I know. It was sort of rhetorical. xxx

A big squeeze for you caffeine xx

Ooh thanks EM. appreciated that x

my brother died a year ago today and only now do i feel strong enough to say about him to strangers . I miss him so much and dont know how i got through the last year , but i have and im ok . (just )

Hey there 45nanny, what a brave post. A year is a tough tough anniversary. Most of us have been there or are close. I am so sad that someone else out there is having to go through the pain of losing a brother. Would you like to tell us about him? Well done you for getting through these twelve months xx

caffeine, any time .

45nanny, thank you for being brave enough to post. It is a hard thing to say to strangers. I still have trouble now (two years since my brother died). Please feel free to post as and when, and whatever, you feel you can. I know we would all love to hear about your brother when you're ready to tell us.

I've just finished an easy read crime fiction which centred around a woman whose husband died in a road traffic accident. At the back of the book the authors (Nicci French) did a kind of mini interview. They made some comments about bereavement which I found very interesting, truthful, and wanted to share them:

"It is often assumed that bereavement is a relatively straightfoward process that starts with shock and sadness and then is gradually diluted and healed. The bereaved are expected to gradually, smoothly 'recover'. But it isn't like that. Loss can be a powerful absence that sucks the rest of one's life into it - a centrifugal force that shakes and changes everything. The stages of mourning can bring the refusal to believe it has happened, the anger with the person who has died, the sudden shattering of an assumed future, the necessity to revisit the past and see it differently.Is this madness? It can certainly feel like it... But perhaps [it is a necessary form] of insanity - a way of taking the person from one world into another."

Thanks for sharing that EM - it is very truthful indeed. And it kind of makes a mockery of the phrase 's/he went peacefully' doesn't it. Because even if the person appears to go quietly the accompanying grief can be so violent. And for us who are left we do go into another world too - I knew from the minute my brother died that I would never be the same person again.

I've been in a lot of pain after my operation and in a bit of a drugged-up state for a few days. On Monday I just lay in bed half asleep and remembered my brother in those days when he was in hospital and the agony he must have been in which he so rarely showed. In a strange way it helped, because I always used to feel so useless just sitting by his bed saying nothing. But I realised when I was feeling miserable the other day that having someone I love just sitting next to me would have helped hugely. Which made me feel better about my guilt at not being able to help him when he was so ill. Does that make any sense at all?

Thank you all for you kind words . My darling brother died after a road traffic accident . He was only 38 and was too young to go .
EM ,thats the best way , ive heard bereverment expressed . Losing my brother has changed me and as hard as i try i cant get back the way i used to feel about myself or others . Im lucky to have and amazing partner , who himself has lost some one very dear to him and so he undrstands excatly what im going through and makes huge allowances for my behaviour and my grief . I wish i could turn back time , to be able to talk to my brother more , as i grew up and moved on with my life i now realise d that i didnt know him as much as an adult as i did a child .This is a regret that i have to deal with daily , the more time moves on the more i regret it . I feel like im losing him more each day . His life was complicated , his death even more so .

Welcome 45nanny. Road traffic accidents are awful. My db was killed in a crash. Your words make so much sense to me and a lot of it i feel as well.

Hello everyone - hope you are all getting by as its the way when you are devastated - a special thanks to you all for being so kind and welcoming - thinking of you love Paris1 x

45nanny, you're very lucky to have an understanding partner. I think much as they try, people who have not beein through grief can rarely empathise. My dh does his best, bless him, but he's not very good at it! My brother was also killed in a RTA, a hit and run. He was 24. His death was also complicated, which has added the difficulty we've had along our grief journey.

All deaths are hard to bear though, complicated or less so.

MissM, that makes perfect sense. I am sure your brother appreciated your presence. What more could we ask for in our last moments than people we love around us. I hope my brother also knew we were there, and that we loved him, even though he was unconscious. Another one of those unanswered questions we have to live with. You're so right, too, about the 'going peacefully' thing. For those left behind it is often anything but peaceful. As you say it can be violent, full of turmoil, painful.

I went to the gadens after work today and cried a lot. What a release it was though, it's been building up for a number of weeks now, and it felt right to let it out at last.

Thanks Paris for your kind words. You are welcome here, and we are thinking of you too xx

My brother also went anything but peacefully. At least - it was peaceful and quiet in his room, but he was full or rage and despair and unhappiness at the thought of dying. His life was wonderful, and he wasn't ready to go, not for decades.

I've been on the verge of tears all week. Am off work next week so might find somewhere to howl as well - we should probably do that more often.

xx to you all.

Evansmummy - thanks for the Nicci French post. (actually husband and wife writing team, I think) Certainly chimed with me. I read something (Katherine Whitehorn?) comparing the grieving process with living in a different country - having to relearn and adapt to a different life. My sister's death was a defining moment - now I (and my family) live a different life, in a different place. And it's a life less rich. (not in the monetary sense)

Welcome 45nanny, you are with friends who understand x

caffeine, wise words about living in a new country. Everything, absolutely everything changes, and you're right that you have to learn a whole new way of life, one that is built around a loss, so necessarily less rich. (And yes, Nicci French = husband and wife team. First time of reading them, not bad!)

MissM, I have to apologise to you. I had always very naively presumed that people who knew they were dying would somehow come to terms with it. I am so sorry for you, and your family, and especially your brother, to realise that that isn't always the case. It puts a whole new light on your grieving and makes me understand it so differently. I am really sorry.

On tuesdays the 1st ANN of my brother death i kept busy and was suprised that i felt strange ,but not sad and i didnt cry . I spent the eveing with a few family members and we raised a glass to my bother , it was all so very normal.
But then today whilst doing nothing but housework ,i had the radio on and they played records from the year of my brothers birth , i became toatally overwhelmed by grief, it felt like i was reliving the whole situation a year ago , it took my breath away the total pain and sadness , i sobbed for an hour and just couldnt understand why life is so cruel . Thank you all , it seems easier to talk to strangers , my friends dont ask any more , and as most of them didnt know my brother , rarely asked at all .
Miis m , how sad for you and your family , but for your brother i dont know the right words to say ,how terrible sad for him it has certainly made me think and send you a hug .

Perhaps older people do EM, I don't know. I imagine that an 84 year-old who knows their life is coming to an end has some kind of coming to terms. But there was no coming to terms for Jim. He accepted it as a fact, in so much as you can accept that you're going to die at the age of 34, but although he put all his rage and energy into his writing and music, he didn't want to die at all. The day he found out his transplant hadn't worked was one of utter and complete despair for all of us.

When you know someone is going to die - and I'm sure Cyteen will attest to this - there are never enough goodbyes you can say, never enough conversations to have, never enough time to say all the things you want to say. And when they actually do die, even though you knew it was going to happen, it is still an almighty shock. I always expected to see Jim the next day after I left him on the Thursday.

There's no need to apologise. Everyone's experience and understanding is so different. We're all reeling around in that other country.

45nanny, I know what you mean abhout the anniversary. So far I have been much more affected by grief during the few days before and after the date rather than the date itself. No explanation really, other than just to say, you're not alone . My friends are like yours too, nobody ever mentions it anymore, as if they believe I've 'moved on', much like that explanation from the book that I posted the other day. It's not that easy though, we live with the ramifications of death forever, even when other people assume we've accepted it. I'm glad we have this thread full os people who understand. I'd be lost without it.

MissM, I like 45nanny, just don't have the words. What can be said? But I do have that ache in my heart for you and Jim, and your family.

I woke up this morning and for the first time since the early days, forgot Jonny was dead. I awoke thinking about my Mum's 60th birthday dinner in a few weeks that she's having in a posh restaurant in France, and that both my brothers would have to wear smart shirts. Was honestly a few moments before I realised what I was thinking. And the sadness when I did realise..... Well, you all know.

If you're interested, the play my brother wrote in the weeks before he died will be broadcast on the radio tonight. It's a London station, Resonance FM, but you can listen on t'internet if not in London: www.resonancefm.co.uk . It's on at 8pm and is called 'Soup and a side salad'. Our brother and a couple of band mates will be talking about Jim afterwards.

Thinking about your comments on acceptance: my brother fought and fought against his illness with his usual stoical stubbornness determination, even up to last ditch surgery that had a 50/50 chance of giving him a few more hours or killing him on the table. But over the last few days of his life, I think he was ready to go...he had accepted his fate, and he was tired...and that guts me so much, that something was stronger than his stubbornness.

Hello all, and welcome to all new arrivals. You are indeed among people who understand, here.

I think my brother was the same Cyteen - he was so tired of fighting by the end. He hadn't accepted his fate, but I think he was resigned to it. And he couldn't bear the pain or the knowledge that the cancer was eating away his brain. That was his biggest fear. I do know above all that he didn't want to die.

Cancer is such an evil disease. It even kills the strongest (and most stubborn) in the end.