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Original poster

Should a perfectly normal 4.5 year old manage to sit at the table for maybe 45 mins or an hour for a meal?

157 replies

MNersanonymous · 20/04/2008 16:30

Had lunch yesterday with a dear friend and her ds who is 4.5.

Between courses he'd get down from the table at the (thankfully child friendly) restaurant and go off e.g. for a walk with his dad. Ds (2.10) meanwhile has been happily sitting in restaurants since he was well under 2 because we have taught him getting down is not acceptable - and he does still get toys or crayons whilst we wait for the first course.

DF is entitled to have different rules but this time my ds started asking if he could go off for a walk too.

Now I know all kids are different but isn't it fair to think that by 4.5 a child should manage a short meal in a restaurant WITH toys and crayons might I add without getting down? And by short meal I mean maybe 45 mins or an hour?

Am I being unreasonable in my expectations and also what should i say to ds now he has started wanting to copy the other little boy?
I managed a 'in our family we stay at the table' but that was only ok as my friend wasn'tthere by then - if she had been it would have sounded really rude.

How can I get ds to stick with our rules without it looking like I'm slagging off theirs?

OP posts:
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yurt1 · 20/04/2008 23:07

last time we went to the theatre dh got told off for fidgeting too much (in the gods he got claustrophobic) [shame]

marina · 20/04/2008 23:07

oh, and agree with everyone else that dcs' behaviour while non verbal and tethered in a Handysitt is NOT relevant as soon as they can express their real views
Ds and dd are poles apart in this respect, although curiously the one who sits still seems to eat less in the end. We have one child who can seemingly consume an entire course while zooming past the table on her latest lap of the facilities and one who will happily take three hours to eat half a petit mille-feuille

yurt1 · 20/04/2008 23:07

even

marina · 20/04/2008 23:09

yurt, at least he was awake. Since dcs, dh is out cold by the end of the first scene - be it Stomp or The Iceman Cometh

bossykate · 20/04/2008 23:10

oh god the last time i saw the iceman cometh i would have chewed off my own arm to get out... dh and i called it the "the iceman goeth... and goeth... and goeth... on and on..."

marina · 20/04/2008 23:13

I think a low was reached when dh snatched 40 about eight feet away from Alex Jennings and Simon Russell Beale bawling their way through the first scene of The Alchemist, bk.
I was overlaughing wildly to try and compensate

bossykate · 20/04/2008 23:18

well it is warm and dark and cosy when the lights go down...

speaking of which i must go to bed as life begins in real and earnest again tomorrow - thank god. have been disrupted for about a month by the "easter" holidays.

good night all

Blueblob · 21/04/2008 01:27

Well my first wouldn't sit anywhere for very long and any meal out would involve a few walks - on a good day - He was a right PITA and not that much into drawing or colouring. OK we found out years later that he couldn't see much, it explains some things!

The youngest was a doll when eating out. It helped he liked food and was happy looking at books or scribbling. He was my sweet cafe friendly baby and toddler.

Cafe babe has not long turned 3 and is now a complete PITA whilst eating out. The older one is now perfectly behaved . He's now happy drawing and doing word searches. I'm sure in a few years they'll both be OK out in public.

I've also known children who have always been fine when eating out and have remained that way. Who knows?

Blueblob · 21/04/2008 01:44

Read a couple of earlier replies now. My eldest we took out many times, from a young age. My younger more cafe happy baby not so many times. My eldest every day in year one, the teacher found it hard to stop him moving, dunno what a few restaurants visits would achieve.

No I never let him get away with bad behaviour, of course we spoke to, and involved him. Involve him??? Like you had to do that. Strike up a conversation? He was already in your face minutes before demanding why you were asking / telling him things he already knew. That was at age 2 and 3, whilst thinking a cartwheel was a perfectly great idea.

Bless him, but my youngest was a different creature. Who knows how they'll both turn out, both lots of personality in their own ways. However, up to know, one has certainly been less in my face than the other

slim22 · 21/04/2008 01:50

TO OP

Don't be too smug about your well behaved 2 year old! Just wait a few months and you'll be pulling your hair like everybody else!
IMHO boys are ALL pretty full on from 3 to 5 or 6.

Good luck and enjoy the calm before the storm.

Blueblob · 21/04/2008 01:53

On a slightly different note, this whole European chidren thing. I'm often in France and Spain and hardly ever see young children out late at night in restaruants. When they are, no body seems to mind them walking about and talking. Most of the local restaurants where we go in France and you get the strong impression young children aren't exactely welcome. Slightly south in Spain where it's hotter and, yes, children are up and about, but they're not all sitting their like stuffed olives.

slim22 · 21/04/2008 01:55

There is one solution though: take a portable DVD to the restaurant

slim22 · 21/04/2008 01:56

Bluebob you are right. But cultural differences are a whole new debate!

widgypog · 21/04/2008 08:56

didnt mean to offend devil..It is just in my experience the kids that run around have laid back parents. It is of course not fact just my experience.

I am soo not a natural parent having my dd was a surprise to say the least but I have managed it. For what its worth my dd is VERy strong minded and spirited.!!

TotalChaos · 21/04/2008 09:02

ooooh at last I get a chance to be smug about something on here - I fail the MN motherhood olympics good style with everything else food related. DS, 4, has always loved eating out, going to cafes - so he could easy manage 45 minutes. Must be a nature rather than nurture thing with him.

In response to the OP - way to handle it with other parents is to do a self-deprecating - god I'm far too lazy to be arsed walking DS round a restaurant, not letting him go walkies.

yurt1 · 21/04/2008 09:05

Did he snore marina?

My most embarrassing theatre moment was taking ds3 (aged 2) - to a children's very theatrical play - where he didn't quite get the whole concept. We were encouragaed to sit at the front (mistake) and he spent the whole time saying loudly that the man was scaring him, the he wanted to go to sleep, that he wanted to swap seats (we did in the end) and when the actors said "look, away she flies" or something and pointed into the distance he said "there's nothing there". They then said " it;s time to go home" (as part of the play) and he tried to march me out the door.

I'm only ever going by myself in the future. My family are too embarrassing

Dottydot · 21/04/2008 09:11

Hmm. Ds1 on his own - yes, he's wonderful to take out on his own and always has been - quiet, still (this of course worries me and I wish he was more lively).

Ds2 on his own - not a chance! Drives you bonkers and is a wriggler, fidgeter, talks at 180 decibels and I think always will.

Both of them together? Are you kidding... The only restaurant we dare to go to as a family is Pizza Express. And they're not naughty, they're just little boys who get excited about going out and then of course wind each other up, get bored, blah blah.

Wouldn't have it any other way! Am looking forward to maybe the day we can progress to a pub lunch or something (I'm giving it another 5 years or so), but if dp and I want to go out for a meal, we get a babysitter and go out on our own.

msappropriate · 21/04/2008 09:15

do the people who put it all down to their fab parenting skills really believe that the parents with more active kids have never spent any time trying to get them to sti still in resaurants and have only been to a cafe once every 2 or so years. jeez mn smugness at its worse.

snookie28 · 21/04/2008 09:33

With regard to french children sitting in restaurants I think a lot of it is down to the level of discipline. IME they treat children like little adults and expect them to behave the same way. This is backed up with serious discipline including smacking. I once saw a couple insisting that their 4 year old finish his Steak Tartare (raw minced steak). He was gagging between mouthfuls.

My husband is french and we have decided that this is NOT the way we want to bring up our children. So what if they need a little stroll in a restaurant. Why is it important?

AbbeyA · 21/04/2008 09:57

A lot depends on how many DCs you have. It is much easier with an only child because they come up to adult level, once you have more than one you are pulled down to childish level to a greater extent. I have done both, having had an only DC for 8 years and then 2 very close in age. The eldest was like a mini adult at 4yrs and would sit happily, taking part in conversations, the younger ones could play games together,or argue,tell silly jokes etc.

Hulababy · 21/04/2008 09:58

Def agree that it is far easier with one child than with more.

FluffyMummy123 · 21/04/2008 10:00

Message withdrawn

marina · 21/04/2008 10:20

No but his head did that unmistakeable bobbling about yurt!
I know Alex Jennings had clocked him
Ds has only now at nine taken to the theatre. He got under the seat and farted his way through the last (and rather drawn-out it must be said) scene of Ian McKellen's panto at the Old Vic
The live arts are definitely not for all

Original poster
MNersanonymous · 21/04/2008 10:24

Agree with Abbey and Hula - I went out recently for a meal with another mum who has two kids and it is a totally different kettle of fish.

I can sit there with my ds and chat away/ occupy him whereas if I had two I'm sure they would be more likely to want to go wandering.

I def think you've hit on another key reason for the difference there with many of us on here.

By the way whoever said don't be too smug about my 2 year old - he is very close to 3. I don't buy this but will be happy to eat my words along with ds's dinner because he has wandered off in a restaurant!

OP posts:
HonoriaGlossop · 21/04/2008 10:51

I can't TELL you how impossible my ds would have found sitting for an hour at a restaurant - still would find it nigh on impossible and he's six this year.

He would do it if pushed because he's polite - but I don't think it's age appropriate anyway. Kids are not mini adults and do not see the point in leisurely lunches with chats etc...food is fuel and then it's on to something more interesting and that's fine IMO. As they get older they will automatically get more able/more interested; no point practising.