Come and be a Better Parent with us in the Virtual Village

[Letsgoforawalk]

This was originally started by Another Monkey, the virtual village refers to the phrase that 'It takes a village to raise a child'.

You are welcome to vent, to ask for advice or to give us the benefit of your experience. The only thing we all seem to have in common is that we are all either ‘in there’ or have ‘been there’.

Perfection is not the goal, we are more about, as monkey brilliantly put it “choosing one thing to be less crap at at a time”.

Books recommended so far:
How To Talk so Kids Will Listen and Listen So Kids Will Talk
When Your Kids Push Your Buttons
The Happiness Project
Calmer Easier Happier Parenting
The Explosive Child
The Highly Sensitive Child
How to be a Better Parent: No Matter How Badly Your Children Behave or How Busy You Are

Potentially useful websites (useful in quite different ways…..)
www.theorangerhino.com
www.ahaparenting.com
www.renegademothering.com

A wide range of potential sources of advice are listed because all our children are different and no book / technique / tactic will suit every family.

A link to the original thread is shown below, and I think Monkeys OP is worth a read as she sums it all up very well…….

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/behaviour_development/a2002053-Does-anyone-else-want-to-come-and-be-a-better-parent-with-me
wecome

I've just shouted at ds1 so hard that he wet himself

DS sometimes wets when we tell him off (even if it's a gentle telling off). I don't think he is so scared he wets himself, he is either doing it for attention (e.g. if put in room) because even the most low key trouser and pant change is attention, or because he is confused I think.

(((hazy))) How did it go? Did you survive the rest if the day? I hope you managed to get out. It keeps me sane on bad days. I parent in a better way in public mostly and my children argue less (sibling violence and rivalry is the absolute bane of my life though I guess a bit less relevant for you while ds2 is so little). To reset I've tried many things but actually, I find it incredibly hard. I might find I've set up a crafty activity but when it gets out of hand, and bits are thrown or chucked on the floor or otherwise going badly I snap even more then so I'm probably not th best person to advise here but I do have masses of sympathy.

bertie I think most of the things from.your post have been covered. The first thing I thought when I saw about the laughing was a misplaced emotion. Fear or sadness or whatever coming out as a laugh. I have certainly reacted in weird ways as as child to very sad news. my mum didn't let me forget that when her dad died when I was about 10 I immediately said "well we didn't like him much anyway" . I meant it as a way of reassuring I think, that we'd be ok. We didn't see them often and I was scared by my mum's distress. I still remember her absolute horror and what she said to me about saying that, and feel guilty. But I didn't actually mean it literally. He's only 6, just on the cusp of some control surely. But still, a 6 year old boy. Would a sand timer work to get teeth done. Going into the bathroom with him and 'checking' his technique?
I will make it my mission to read the buttons book too.

My dh has been incredibly snappy and shouty with the children today. It sounds so awful, so horrible to hear. I am re energised for my mission to decrease shouting and irritation.

My biggest one is to be more organised in the morning. I am never ready. Never prepared. Therefore always late and end up stressed and irritable if not shouting to get out of the house. I shall practice between now and the dreaded start of the school run in September.

More are you still struggling with your health? Do you have support? I don't think there is something wrong with you (if there were, you wouldn't be so upset.) - you've got so much on right now that anybody, even Mother Teresa would struggle.

What's happening now? Are they in bed? Do you have someone else there?

Do you want to talk about what happened/the future/what to do next?

I've just copied and pasted this from the last thread too. Emergency measures.

Tickling a child who you really have the urge to slap/scream/shove can diffuse that situation immediately. It stops them answering back too ;)

Go into another room and sit with your back against the door so they can't reach you (obviously as long as they are physically safe).

Rescue Remedy, if it's safe to take with your meds. Put a few drops in water and sip it throughout the day, or put a couple of drops on your tongue when you're getting to boiling point.

When you feel yourself about to shout, can you sing instead?

Have you tried the mantra "This is not an emergency." Sorry there is more of that one but I can't remember it.

I know a lot of the time we're talking gentle parenting/not punitive methods etc but short term maybe that's a bit much to expect? What about (for now) going with a very formulaic and precise method like 123 Magic. When you get the thyroid stuff and the meds sorted and everything better under control, then you can move back into gentle parenting. In the meantime 123 magic is positive, easy to remember and keeps everyone calm.

Where is your DH? Is he able to be around at stress points? Are you able to increase (paid/family/whatever) childcare while you're dealing with stuff? Is he being supportive with your health stuff? Do you have RL friends/family who are aware of it too?

Sorry for barrage of questions I wish I could come and help :( (Not that my post last night was that reassuring!)

Dreaming that is my motivation for doing things like dishwasher emptying or lunchbox prep last thing at night before I go to bed. I say to myself "you don't want to do this now but you will be so glad you did in the morning" ....and when the alarm goes off I remember that one job is already done and it just makes everything better. Oddly out of all proportion better than the effort it entailed the night before.

please don't see that as smug, there are plenty days I get up and find I've done buggerall and its all there waiting for me.

The dog is lovely natured but completely not (house, obedience, lead) trained, we are having her. they say she loves food and is very bright (some collie in the mix) so I'm hoping that means she is very trainable......
Written down that looks totally mad.
If you don't see me on here much I'll be over on the dog threads, pleading for help........

Look up Zak George on youtube! I've been addicted to him, it's like attachment parenting for dogs but he has SO MUCH energy.

moresnow sorry I missed your post. Hope things got better. I have nothing to add to what bertie and others said.

Thanks all, after a very rocky start we had a pretty nice afternoon (sun helped).

Got over the initial hump by lying down in my bed doing stickers with him. DS rolling about with us. That made us both feel better I think. Morning was pretty rubbish, shouted at him too much mainly at points where he was slow or refusing to do as I asked. That whole respect/control thing I guess. Also just emotion spilling in the wrong way - I felt on the verge of tears a lot of the morning. Managed to have a sort of nap on my bed feeding DS2 with DS1 in his room and the stairgate on. About 15 min of dozing - made such a difference. We got out to a park; had lunch in the cafe; went to playgroup. He was basically brilliant all afternoon given how tired he must have been since I decided not to try for a nap. He's sort of dropping them and the effort of getting him to sleep is a real pressure/trigger point so I chose to avoid it today. Also tried to do some chasing/tickling/pretending to gobble him up games to make us feel good, and to descriptively praise him as much as possible.

I feel so awful about making him cry this morning, but as we stood in the hall at 5.20 he shouted 'No!' when I said he should go back to bed or lie in mummy's bed. I could see the whole day stretching out ahead of us and it felt too much to cope with. So I shouted it was too early and we would both be tired all day and he had to let me rest or I couldn't cope. Then I lay on the spare bed in his room and when I looked up he was sat on his bed witha tear in his eye. Being a parent has made me realise I actually can't cope well emotionally without sleep. I hope he knows we do love him despite it all, and am trying to focus on the good parts because if I dwell on the part where I was a bitch then I know I will feel shit tomorrow and be shouty all over again.

Moresnow I won't add anything to Bertie's really great list, just a hand to hold from someone who also wonders wtf is wrong with her sometimes, and tries to remember that what's 'wrong' is we're tired, not in the best health and trying to do something which is both hard and very important to us. Here's hoping we have better days tomorrow.

OK so as for me.

I don't think DS' laughter in this case was misplaced emotion. It was after the whole incident and he was not laughing at me or trying to get me to join in if that makes sense, in fact, it probably wasn't even laughing - just silly noises etc. Either way some small clue that he was slipping back into the hyperactive behaviour - I have got really, really finely attuned to these clues.

It wasn't about bedtime, or at least, there are no general/ongoing issues with bedtime. This is a thing he does sometimes but other times is really good. We already have an incentive for bedtime in that if he gets ready in time he can watch TV on the laptop or play games on the tablet. Luckily screens don't affect his ability to sleep and they have always calmed him down.

The silliness - is just irritating because it is so extreme and he has no concept of when to stop. Also I think I get more irritated just around bedtime, because it's a time of day when I'm often tired and hungry (but can't start my dinner because I have to sort DS out) and also because sometimes I'm looking forward to something that I can start as soon as he's in bed and I want him to hurry up and go there I'm often trying to do something on my computer and don't have a lot of patience for listening to jokes or whatever. He also tends to watch annoying youtube videos over dinner (yeah, we have shitty habits of feeding him separately and he watches TV, mainly because he seems to find it literally impossible to sit on a chair and DH and I end up chewing our own hands off trying to avoid reacting to it, or we bitch at him constantly for the entire meal and it's just miserable. Plus it's too early for us to eat but not want to snack on junk again later.) So Family Dinner happens once a week, and the rest of the time he eats in front of the TV and falls off the chair approximately three times a meal. Dinner is sometimes late, so he just carries on watching youtube until bedtime. If it's earlier then he will go off and do other things and if I have energy then I am going around doing various things.

But when I don't have energy AND dinner was late (because I had no energy) AND he's been on a youtube spiral AND I'm rooting for that bedtime and plugged into my screen, that triggers it. So I think it probably is an attention thing. Whereas I'm thinking "Oh thank god I got through, almost time for no attention needed, yay!" he is thinking "But I didn't tell you 500 unfunny jokes today. Or ask you baffling science and geography and history questions! Or do my impression of a toaster. And we didn't play a game. Time to play a game!" and trying to squeeze in that last drop.

In fact, it's better recently because he doesn't always have tickets by that time of day so he doesn't always watch TV in a constant line for hours, which is a bad habit I let him get into when I'm tired or overwhelmed. When he's not watching TV he is more likely to interact with me in a way I find acceptable, and when I'm not plugged into my screen I am more likely to respond to even his annoying behaviour better.

I'm now 99% sure that I have AD(H)D, so it would not surprise me if DS had it too. But it's not really relevant for now and will only really become an issue if it bleeds into school, at which point we will start the ball rolling, or they will. So whether this kind of frustrating behaviour is my fault, a quirk that he will grow out of or a genuine difficulty is sort of unknown for now.

Hazy have you tried one of those clocks? There's a bunny one and a sun and moon one. You set it to a time and DC know they are only allowed to come and wake you when the sun comes up or the bunny is awake.

Oh and last night, I was premenstrual, which I didn't realise.

bertie it's like they sense your attention is drifting from them. Even if mine were happily settled in another room, if I turned on the computer and started working, within minutes there would be someone in the doorway saying "mu-um...."
It doesn't happen now. Dissertation and studies all finished and DCs have hit the teenage indifference phase. ..some days.
Right. Zac George on house training here I come.

hazy you did good. Sounds like you managed well and retrieved the day. I assume you have done all the obvious stuff like blackout blinds or linings? Or is this an occasional thing?

Uggh. Yes, bad morning here too. I also shouted at DD because she wouldn't brush her fucking teeth.

I got out of bed the wrong side this morning (probably because I had to get out of it so many times last night) and it was just going to happen at some point. I tried and tried to 'start again' but I just couldn't reset my mood and my temper won out

I think I need to read the 'buttons' book too.

The trouble with this gentle parenting malarkey is that it requires a lot of energy and requires you to react to the individual circumstances anew each time and sometimes when you're knackered and grumpy you just want a script to fall back on.

Aaaargh! I fucked up basically and I'm cross with myself.

We have a gro clock moresnow - it's pretty good. DD understands it and quite often waits for 'wakey time' not this morning, though, unfortunately. We have friends who say their DCs absolutely obey it, too, so it's worth a try if this is a persistent issue.

moresnow I just want to come and give you a massive hug. Tbh, it sounds like you're doing so well. Incredibly well, actually.

It's not your fault that your DS wet himself and it's not your fault that he's ill. Your reaction to what happened sounds perfectly within reasonable limits and I agree with you - if I was at the park and could see someone in that situation, I would do whatever I could to help, even if it was only to come and check you were ok or if you needed anything when you got back to the pushchair. I wouldn't just stand and watch.

It gets easier, I promise.

Have you been back to the doctors about your thyroid medication?

mummybare I hope your day is going more smoothly I know what you mean, sometimes I don't want to turn it into a game or a race or a challenge or imaginary play... I just want them to do it.

sometimes I don't want to turn it into a game or a race or a challenge or imaginary play... I just want them to do it.

^^ Exactly! And because I don't make demands very often, I sort of feel like I ought to be 'in credit' somehow. I realise this is not how it works, but at these moments logic doesn't come into it.

Oh and I totally relate to 'being on edge trying to be supermum' - such a good description.

Oh gosh. Really?? THAT was what you were worried that he had wet himself through being shouted at? Lovely, that was nothing of the sort!

You had a great time at the park - well done you. It sounds like you had a good day, and I don't think they will think it was ruined.

Running away into a road is serious, and a shouty kind of response is absolutely fine.

Then he had an accident, because he hadn't gone to the toilet in time. Nothing to do with the shouting :) Just a normal potty training incident.

You haven't messed it up. He was having so much fun playing that he obviously forgot to go and left it too late - it happens.

He was probably playing up/less aware of his bladder because he was coming down with something.

You see? Your assumptions are coming to the worst for you when it's probably the very opposite.

YYYY to feeling "in credit" and wanting it to work. I think that is my biggest downside to gentle parenting.

moresnow, yes, totally agree with Bertie there - it's not your fault and anyone would have shouted in those circs.

And with "being on edge trying to be supermum" too. Sometimes the awareness of not parenting how I/we want to or not "living up to" the books/theory is enough in itself to seriously send me over the edge.

We had a very shouty morning this morning, because the boys wanted me to paint their faces for Comic Relief dress-up, which meant I needed them to get dressed in good time. So obviously they chose to muck about instead...

Hello, can I join? I've not read the full thread yet but skimmed through the first few pages and a lot resonates with me. Will catch up on all posts later whilst doing the night feed, hoping to get some tips for managing my shoutyness. I have dd(3) and a ds(10 months). My main issue is that my dd doesn't bloody listen, so I repeat myself over and over again until I burst with rage and start shrieking and yelling.

3 year old just don't listen do they?! Such a big con, "the terrible two's" when 3 and 4 are so much worse. Getting closer and getting down on their level helps. As does lowering your expectations.

We are away for 3 nights (probably) at my mums. No dh. DT2 a bit croupy last night so it was an inserted night and I am crossing everything he is ok here tonight. So I have been a bit of an irritable mum, again, today. And mine really do take the mickey and mess about at bedtime bertie and for the reasons you mentioned (being tired, wanting to do.something else,wanting to stop giving them attention, thinking they should just go the fuck to bed) it's a big trigger for me.

Really get the being "in credit" and trying (and failing in my case) to be supermum too.

madge you are very welcome! Hi. it's really hard when they do that. There are lots of good sources in the OP but if you want to not repeat yourself try and get her attention before you say anything then, have a motto of "say it once but say it well.", hold her attention and check by observation that she has heard and understood.

moresnow I too take a different view of your longer tale....often they "play up" just before they go down with something. If I had a £ for every time I've been driven to distraction by an inexplicably bad day only to have a child throwing up or pyrexial the next (or that night) I'd be a rich woman. (Well, enough for a takeaway maybe)
About the shouting-wet himself 'link', I agree with Bertie and Blue. It wasn't you, it just happened. The thing to do to get a positive out of it is think about what your options might be if it happened again. Would the baby have come to any harm if you'd left him on the changing mat and quickly retrieved DS1?
Considering what you are up against health wise, I think you are doing fantastically well.
Really I do.

Have you had a conversation with your HV about your health and how it is affecting you and your boys? They may be able to help in some way.

Sometimes local colleges have childcare students who need placements and they get placed with families. I had one for a while and in some ways she was as useless as a chocolate teapot, (well, she was meant to be learning, not an expert!) but she was an extra body around which was very handy when I got food poisoning shortly after DD 3 was born.

Happy Friday everyone, here's to a good weekend with helpful partners, cooperative children and a bit of sunshine.
Well we can dream....