Come and be a Better Parent with us in the Virtual Village

[Letsgoforawalk]

This was originally started by Another Monkey, the virtual village refers to the phrase that 'It takes a village to raise a child'.

You are welcome to vent, to ask for advice or to give us the benefit of your experience. The only thing we all seem to have in common is that we are all either ‘in there’ or have ‘been there’.

Perfection is not the goal, we are more about, as monkey brilliantly put it “choosing one thing to be less crap at at a time”.

Books recommended so far:
How To Talk so Kids Will Listen and Listen So Kids Will Talk
When Your Kids Push Your Buttons
The Happiness Project
Calmer Easier Happier Parenting
The Explosive Child
The Highly Sensitive Child
How to be a Better Parent: No Matter How Badly Your Children Behave or How Busy You Are

Potentially useful websites (useful in quite different ways…..)
//www.theorangerhino.com
//www.ahaparenting.com
//www.renegademothering.com

A wide range of potential sources of advice are listed because all our children are different and no book / technique / tactic will suit every family.

A link to the original thread is shown below, and I think Monkeys OP is worth a read as she sums it all up very well…….

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/behaviour_development/a2002053-Does-anyone-else-want-to-come-and-be-a-better-parent-with-me
wecome

[drspouse]

Well... we only have easy clothes... and there is always something to get cross about - the fact that you have to get dressed at all for example! He CAN dress himself but frequently doesn't want to. He'd rather I dressed him every day (but I have myself to dress, DD to dress, both to put suncream on, both to get breakfast for etc. etc. etc.) and honestly, even if I dressed him, he'd much rather run away naked and play than let me dress him, too.

He won't wipe his own cup, if you give him a damp cup and a cloth he just screams more IT'S YUCKY YOU WIPE IT.

I do agree about looking for problems everywhere though. He is generally fine now with motor skills but if there's anything he struggles with I tend to assume it's at least partly that. For example, with his drawing, his nursery carer does rather seem to have pigeonholed him as "boy, won't sit down, just needs to find drawing/writing fun/do it more actively and he'll get the hang of it". I actually don't think it's that, but I'm not sure if it's that he can't really see what he's aiming for in a spatial sense (which I doubt as he's brilliant at puzzles) or that he can't get his hands to cooperate (which I think is more likely).

[BertieBotts]

Or possibly he just doesn't like drawing? DS used to hate drawing until he began to be able to draw recognisable things, now he likes it, but he still hates colouring. At three it's quite normal for them not to have much fine motor control, and being actively "encouraged" to keep doing something is probably a bit of a turn off - agh. Stacking bricks like lego is good for developing fine motor control, as is threading beads/pasta onto shoelaces. Normal for them not to be able to handle the small lego pieces yet (Duplo etc is better).

[drspouse]

No, he does like it, he's always asking to do it at home, every day at nursery he "draws" me a picture to take away, he always has at least one to take home for me or DH...

[doctorboo]

I'm here thanks for PMing me Bertie

Sorry I disappeared, I wasn't very happy by the time I hit 3rd Trimester and was just trying to get through each day and then DS3 unexpectedly arrived 3 weeks early.

Our house currently has a newly turned four year old who will be getting at least some level of hand holding once he goes in to his Reception Class in September, a 21 month old who now hits, yells "no mine" and is potty training himself and the newest addition; a slightly colicky and constipated four week old.
My aim is that every Friday during the summer holidays I'm able to say I have done X amount of nice, simple, things with each of them, or all of them together. My first is to enjoy a walk in the woods with them each week.

[DreamingOfAFullNightsSleep]

Hi everyone- and yes, thanks for the PM bertie.

Congratulations drboo . How exhausting wonderful. I hope the colicky bits pass quickly.

I am on holiday this week (nowhere very exotic, Wales!) . It has brought home how irritable I can be most of the time as my dd (5 in September) told me "I don't mean to do bad things mummy" I was stressed and being a bit snappy after an epic twin melt down coming off a beach. She'd done nothing wrong

So. I am inspired. I know what I need to do. When they all fight,and are screaming blue murder at each other (this is 34,5578 times a day) I need to actually do the whole "this is not an emergency" thing. Breathe. Then speak to them. Not race in shouting "right! Enough of this! What's going on?"

Anyway, dh popped out for supplies and he's back now so best go.

Oh- and I am worried sick and losing sleep over schools. Still. We got our second choice which us also our only walking get distance school. There will be 37 in the class (2 extra got in on appeal) and though dd has done the settling sessions and I'm reassured a bit I have heard the Head is a dick. Appeal 15th July for our first choice school. But now I don't know ow whether I want to drive every day for 8 years.... I will moan about this more I'm sure.

[AnotherMonkey]

Hi everyone :). It's good to catch up, great idea to PM, Bertie.

dreaming I'm amazed at those class numbers, I thought the limit was 30 for infants?! I really sympathise - it's tough making that choice when neither school is quite what you want.

We're getting along OK here... We continue to worry about DS but in lots of ways he's doing so well and has grown up so much recently. DD is my shadow at the moment, which is equally adorable and bloody annoying, depending on what mood I'm in, what it is she's demanding, and whether I need to get anything done (y'know, like going to the toilet or averting my attention for a second-and-a-half). She's been poorly recently (just kid stuff) and this is making it much worse so I'm trying really hard to be patient, but we all know how good I am at that

[BlueEyeshadow]

Hello! Thanks for bumping and PMing, Bertie

Things are still up and down here. We're in the middle of organising a house move at the moment which leads to extra stress and anxiety all round. There are masses of things about it which are outside my control, which is definitely something I find hard to deal with. Also currently working on easing up trying to micromanage everything - it's exhausting and not good for me or the boys.

The challenge for the next week is to manage the walk home from school without constantly nagging saying anything negative to the boys (with the proviso that they're not in any danger!). Anyone up for holding to account?!

[BlueEyeshadow]

Agh, I killed the thread again. Anyway, DS1 is having a complete meltdown this weekend, of a type we haven't seen for months and I'm completely at a loss for how to handle it. Everything anyone does or says seems to make things worse, but he won't be on his own. He says trying to calm down makes himself angrier. He's going to make himself sick or trigger something if he carries on this way.

[BertieBotts]

You didn't Blue I've not been sleeping well and the tiredness caught up with me today.

Hope DS is feeling better this evening? Is he coming down with something perhaps? Or do you think he's sensitive to the house move?

37 is huge. I was speaking to one of the German mums the other day and apparently class sizes are typically 25 here. She was shocked to hear that they are 30 in reception, but placated when I said every class had a TA (I don't know if that's true!)

We are waiting with bated breath for DS' school letter which tells him which class he will be in and the equipment list. It feels a bit Hogwarts Apparently you have to go out and buy specific kinds of exercise books, they don't just give them out through the school, I've been advised that Aldi often do multipacks but they won't necessarily have the right ones in so just to go to a stationer's and give them the list and they'll decipher it all for you.

[BlueEyeshadow]

Thanks Bertie. Yes, it calmed down a lot and we had a nice evening. I think there is a touch of coming down with something and a huge dollop of end-of-term-itis, with moving-related anxiety and a hangover of disappointment from something that happened yesterday all thrown in with general tiredness. Poor boy, no wonder it sent him over the edge! But he did tell us something we haven't heard before about how he gets down on himself (can't think where he gets that from...!) so at least he's talking and that's something we can work with.

Certainly most classes have a TA here, and DS2's reception class has two, as well as students in and out a lot of the time. Think TAs are under threat from the bs in the government though. :( Good luck with the equipment list! I have heard many stories about such things from German schools...

[DreamingOfAFullNightsSleep]

Sorry , wasn't clear. So, our offered school has taken 37 Reception children. They do mixed classes for key stge 1 (so first 3 years) then they're all taught together. Apparently they're only separate for registration purposes and all have equal access to Reception stuff, though my DD with her 9th Sept birthday will go into the mixed YR/Y1 class. The school emphasise that they do do stuff as one year group (not reasssuring when it's that big!) But for those 37 children plus 13 or 14 Y1 children there are 2 teachers and 2 TA's. Plus it means they have about 50 children accessing a small outdoor area so it's on a Green Band system so obviously not actually free flow as once the bands are gone, you can't go out. I don/t know. Plus 37 Year 3 children (and up to Y6 obvs) to one teacher seems huge. The other school is 2 miles away (well, we're 1.713 miles away- compared to our offered school at 0.3 miles away) and smaller, 15 pupil intake, does Forest school stuff, huge and well used outdoor areas- BUT a drive, always a drive and no friends in our village- and surely that's part of the point of living in a village. Oh, and the head is human and nice. Our appeal is this Wednesday and I'm majorly stressed about it. In fact, I think I'd like to lose it on appeal so I know I tried but don't have to drive and lose the benefit of friends...?!

Blue I will do that if you will do it for me about bedtimes and leaving the house (my big cues for being a shouty witch). So, to stay calm throughout both triggers. Shall we check in with the task on Friday??

I have been pretty good today. It has made evrything so much better. Good inspiration. I think I will re-read HTT. I have just read How Children Succeed which isn;t parenting related but is huge on how important attachment is. First noted in rats and then human studies done, and secure attachment and just responding to under 3's is all. It was interesting actually, really interesting. Has anyone read it? Paul Tough is the author.

Anyway, I'm procrastinating when I should be getting ready for bed.

[drspouse]

Although the behavioural attachment stuff probably still stands up, to be quite frank most of these "neuro" studies are just sparkles and brain scans to go "LOOK Shiny BRAINS" and basically blinding parents, nurses, and social workers with science and based on almost nothing.

Sorry. Just read this today in fact. Not completely sure on the conclusion that having an alcoholic parent who pays no attention to you will do you no damage, though.

Anyway here we are having a mix of good and bad days/hours/minutes. Yesterday there was a lot of defiance and grabbing things the moment DS was told not to, including a drill and I think some hot things I was cooking with. Not helped by DH who is normally great, starting his drilling just as I was trying to cook i.e. both of us doing things that DS can't touch leaving him to step on DD.

This morning I accidentally got up too early but we have had a nice morning playing and reading books (and it's only 8.30 but yes I feel like we've had a whole morning). DS didn't deliberately wake me up/shout like he does some mornings, and we've played very imaginatively with his blocks and he's played with his alphie robot (a compromise as it's a bit more interactive than ipad games, but he likes it).

He told me he doesn't want to go to big school because he's not going to get bigger (the other rooms at his nursery are preparing the 4yo for school - he's only 3;6 so has another year but obviously it's getting to him). I reassured him that he doesn't have to go yet, and told him he will probably be going with T and A who he likes.

He's also been telling me he can't read his books - I think he's starting to realise that the words say more than vague narrative that can change each time! But he can still give you the gist of a story without an adult helping, either immediately after a first reading, or independently if you've read it several times. I can see we're going to have to watch "learning" books when he is learning to read, rather than actually decoding them, but I don't think we'll have any problem with him being keen to learn!

[BertieBotts]

Sounds great drspouse :) I used the Songbirds phonics books with DS which I found really great.

The brain scan thing is annoying - I'm looking into ADHD a lot at the moment and there are similar issues there. The problem is a lot of the time they don't really understand what brain scans mean except that it shows a difference. There are some documentaries on iplayer at the moment about brain science, if that is of any interest.

I love the idea of checking in :)

[drspouse]

Oh yes checking in sounds good.

I have 2 days of work/childcare this week only - one of those is a meeting with travel - nursery have an enforced holiday but it doesn't coincide with our own holiday so both DCs at CM for my working days, one day's AL to look after them and one day when I normally have only DD but I have both.

Aim for the week... praise for not hitting while getting dressed/ready in mornings...
get out each day (have a plan for a train/park outing with a friend and her DCs on Thursday)
one to one time with DS on days we're at home... (he asked to do sticking today but I am about to go out and haven't had time so I have that planned for Tuesday, they are at the CM tomorrow)

Any ideas about the messing with/hitting/stepping on/generally being a PITA to DD? It is better than it was but DH only has the helpful answer "soon she'll start being much more of a pain herself"

[DreamingOfAFullNightsSleep]

drspouse it was behavioural studies. So looking St the behaviour of baby rats with mothers who didn't do much locking send grooming compared to baby rats of mothers that did. Big difference. Then they looked at babies and the 4 levels of attachment- securely attached, anxiously attached, poorly attached and one I've forgotten and followed the babies up to be adults of 30 or so. Again, striking differences.

I have managed to get irritable with the dc while trying to clean out the rat cage. But other than that, still doing well here!

[DreamingOfAFullNightsSleep]

Oh and drspouse not really bar getting them to help with her or help you and reminding him she's small and to be gentle and look after her. Nothing has worked with mine though

[drspouse]

[hanging head in despair smiley]

[BlueEyeshadow]

So, biting my tongue while walking back from school yesterday showed me that if DS1 is really getting under the wheels of our neighbour's pushchair, she's perfectly capable of getting him to move herself...

[drspouse]

Awful day yesterday (I hadn't slept well which was the main problem but DS woke me up by shouting at me, then tried to shut a drawer on my hand so I grabbed him away from it and hurt both of us in the process, me by stubbing my toe). I also discovered it is possible to say "I want my snack continuously on a loop for 15 minutes before breakfast. Got very little done at work and had to come home early but DH kindly picked the DCs up. I think it's the fact that I have to do it every day morning and night, dressing, feeding, and chivvying along. And I particularly can't cope when sleep deprived.
Today has been much better but we still had to do 3 minutes time out twice for hitting DD, and it's only mid afternoon.

[DreamingOfAFullNightsSleep]

That's good blue. Good for you. Yesterday I failed epically at bedtime. Didn't manage to get DT2 to bed til 10pm. no idea why, he's 3, he'd had no nap, been up since 8:20am- late I know, and late for him. But he'd been active, had a swimming lesson. Why?! Why?! Sadly I lost the plot and went scary mummy and dh finally took over.

Tonight though, all has been lovely and calm. So far. Only one definitely asleep and that's the one I just cuddled to sleep though. But in beds and peaceful so far.

drspouse I'm the same at the minute. Sleeping badly myself and then struggling from early in the day to keep my temper. It's very testing and I find it so much harder to stay calm when I'm tired.

Day 2 of near continuous whining from DT1. DT2 being difficult-well, even more ran usual, tired probably. DD fell in the canal and was freezing and very shocked, I had no spare clothes, DTs wouldn't just come back to the car, quickly . I was a bit short with them but didn't lose it. They are driving me round the twist though. They do nothing I say or ask. Nothing. Then this evening DT1 came running in while I was tidying toys to say he'd fallen over and grazed his elbow. While running in the road with DT2- I'd totally forgotten to shut the gates. I had no idea they were doing that, or that they'd be so stupid. We have hedges and there's no pavement, narrow lane, cars still drive way too fast. Either or both could have been killed. Terrifies me just to think of it now. How could I have forgotten to shut the gates?!

So, all in all, a really shit day (though at least I didn't stuff up bedtime) and we have our school appeal tomorrow, which I still don't even know if I want to win.

[doctorboo]

Morning!

I promise I'll come back and do a catch up and comment, I'm finding my three quite, erm, tiring. I'm more tired than last week that's for sure.
As I type, my frozen shopping needs to be put away, but is sat on the kitchen floor while DS3 is jiggled...oh and now DS2 has woken up from his nap. Back later! x

[AnotherMonkey]

Bloody hell dreaming what a day. and a huge hug.

Sending big 'it will pass' support vibes to everyone having a rough time this week x

[AnotherMonkey]

I've just come on to unload in a peaceful place!

Today has been one of those days when I've got my own stuff going on, it's all been a bit stressful, and I really could have done with a straightforward evening at home.

I swear that my two can sniff out weakness and gleefully attempt to see what they can get away with.

One thing I find tricky with DD is that she is a VERY tactile little bean, and most of the time this is lovely. But the smallest hint that I might need a bit of space seems to send her into a panic and she attaches herself to me for the duration. Complete with attention demanding conversation which only gets louder and crosser if I don't have the energy to understand and repeat back exactly what she said and participate in an acceptably enthusiastic manner.

DS is a bit of a space cowboy anyway, getting him through any kind of sequence of events needs serious focus, and not an evening passes without a blocked toilet/ insane mess/ accidental droppage/ similar. Tonight, I went up to check that all was OK as he'd been in the bathroom for some time. I'd been in there for a while, we'd been chatting, I asked him to stop fiddling with stuff on the shelf as he has an excellent track record for dropping stuff in the toilet.
Me: DS, please put that toothbrush down, we don't want a toothbrush down the toilet eh?
DS: I did drop DD's toothbrush down the toilet. I have wiped it though. But not cleaned it. Wiped it.
Me:



.



I have a cold beer to finish and then I'm going to bed!

[BertieBotts]

Oh no Dreaming! Thank goodness nothing happened, those moments are awful and you just keep going over them in your head don't you? Try not to worry too much about it. You'll remember to close the gates in future!

My childminder's daughter fell in the canal one day when she was walking with DS, he was totally freaked out by it, and refused to walk that way for ages.

Rat thing sounds a bit like Bowlby who did stuff about attachment but it was decades ago. They had three categories of attachment - secure attachment, insecure avoidant, and insecure something else. Anxious? But then later stuff I've read says that although this was really important at the time and really revolutionised practice e.g. in hospitals, children's homes and around issues such as childcare, it doesn't actually correspond to attachment vs gina ford type parenting. It's more extreme than that.

I am waiting for the washing machine to finish after DH and DS complained about lack of clothes this morning. I was really miffed because I felt like I was up to date but I wasn't. Then I ended up being really horrible to DS and making him cry and leaving him at kindergarten crying because I was late and he was acting slow "on purpose" I did apologise to him later. The thing was this morning he said "But it's not my responsibility to make you on time for work, mummy, you should have woken me up earlier." He was totally right!

[BlueEyeshadow]

Oh, how scary Dreaming. Glad everyone's ok.

Monkey at toothbrush incident.

What a wise remark, Bertie!

We've had a pretty awful morning so far. Now the trick is going to be not letting it hang over the rest of the day.