Come and be a better parent in the trenches! Thread 2

[BertieBotts]

Terrible title sorry Next time we'll start the discussion at 900 posts, OK?

Originally started by AnotherMonkey, we are trying to improve our parenting which may include less shouting (www.theorangerhino.com) and positive boundary setting (www.ahaparenting.com), or any other goal you want. If you want to be more authoritative that's a great cause too. No judging of parenting styles allowed, honest critique OK. There is occasionally homework (but really, honest, we're nice and don't care if you want to skip past that bit)

Dumping of emotions/ranting after a bad day also acceptable. The saying "in the trenches" refers mainly to having 2+ under 5 but really any stage which is repetitive, challenging, soul destroying about parenting.

Books recommended so far:
How To Talk so Kids Will Listen and Listen So Kids Will Talk
When Your Kids Push Your Buttons
The Happiness Project
Calmer Easier Happier Parenting
The Explosive Child
The Highly Sensitive Child

Please post a little intro/reminder just with your DCs ages/stages and any extra challenges - a couple of us have relocated abroad, that kind of thing.

Phew. We made it through yesterday, in no small part down to the posts on here helping me to feel that I'm not completely losing it.

Today has been better, I went to sleep when the kids did and we had a decent night and that's made a big difference.

Welcome bexter and jelly and chocciechip

blue I can really relate to the introvert thing. Funnily enough, I've eventually started reading the spirited child book and their introvert/extrovert checklist was a lightbulb moment - I'm understanding a lot more about the differences between and my own mum.

Argh it's the end of bath time already... have to go.....

B#%^cks
Massive yelling at my DD3 over - guess what - music practice. And half way through realised that she hadn't had any proper lunch (hot choc and cake while out for a walk) which could account for some of her bad tempered behaviour (what can I blame for mine???)
Maybe I need to read that buttons book.........everything had gone so well this weekend til then

All ok now, practice done, instrument not on eBay as threatened. Friends again.
Time for for mummy and princess diaries for DD3

Sympathies, letsgo. We have had a completely hideous afternoon here. Lots of yelling, bad temper and general frustration. I feel worn down to a frazzle again.

letsgo and blue massive sympathy to you both. And and whatever else would help being flung in your direction. I feel your pain!

It's so intense sometimes.

The weekend has been fine but sort of feel like I'm in recovery after Friday! The two articles on here really resonated with me. The point made in the Huff post about social media, and our perception of others being all smiles and happy memories and hazy edges, is very true for me and makes me feel very alone sometimes when we're having a grizzly, shouty day. I imagine I'm the only person mean enough to be anything but lovely towards my two amazing little people, even when they are DRIVING ME TO DISTRACTION.

Yah boo to Fb social media happy families nonsense.
And round robin "cecilia has got her grade 8 violin" type garbage.
Yes yes to honesty and empathy about how challenging it is some days.

Courage friends. (Been watching The Lord of the rings box set....does it show?)
Tomorrow is another day

There has to be a thread title in that post, letsgo !

I'm liking the LoTR influence, makes me feel less bedraggled, more warrior

I just smiled to myself reading my last post back - when I say the weekend has been 'fine', what I mean is that I haven't embarrassed myself by bellowing loudly enough for the neighbours to hear, or been irrationally impatient (only rationally so...), or been actively unpleasant to my husband (although he probably felt a bit neglected from time to time), and came away from my ILs with self esteem (mostly) intact

I didn't mention the insane lack of sleep or DDs hysterics every time I left the room or the insane homework assignment to be completed by DS (5) or the general madness and roaring and yelling (them, not me).

Hazy edges......

But an actual positive is the relationship which is blossoming between my DCs. The first thing DD did when she woke up this was tell a sleeping DS how much she loved him. That was pretty cool.

*this morning

monkey, i am sure my downstairs neighbours think they are living below a complete monster when they hear me shout. The other day i managed to perfectly time it so i was shouting "WILL YOU JUST GET UP THE STAIRS!" just as Mr Downstairs was coming round the corner

Oh GOD I have just remembered how horribly judgy I was towards the mum who lived next door to me with a 4 year old, newly single mum, I was in a shit relationship but other than that a horrible smug mother of an under one I used to worry so terribly about the child, now I just realise he was being a four year old and she was probably just dealing with the normal 4 year old stuff!

I obviously kept my judginess to myself but shit, if I still lived in the country I think I'd have to go and send her some flowers or something!

Bertie, the bad thing is that Mr & Mrs downstairs have a 3yo daughter who is a little madam (imo) & i still judge them when i hear her kicking off! I guess its just human nature.

homework for a 5 year old (a whole other thread....
Go you warrior monkey !
Lolling at bertie and jellies huffy moments.

"The first thing DD did when she woke up this was tell a sleeping DS how much she loved him." AnotherMonkey that is so lovely! :)

Like the warrior viewpoint too!!

Letsgoforawalk I actually deactivated fb in disgust a few months ago. It is so annoying! Well, the people that I had friended obviously were :/

No hilarious tales to share but today's huge positive is that the toddler (of 21mths with a wee sis of 3 mths) didn't bite or hit anyone especially no random children whilst out! Phew!!!!!

Ha the judginess stuff reminds me of this post:

lulastic.co.uk/parenting/i-cant-help-pointing-my-avocado-at-you/

Seriously considering a name change to WarriorMonkey

bexster that's brilliant! Believe me, I understand what an achievement that is.

Tcha
Not "huffy" but "judgy" moments. Huffy almost works but is not the word I chose.

What a lovely blog post. I like her style! :)

It's true. And I was thinking about that and the A+ thing as well and thinking that it's sad that not one of us can be the perfect parent. That's bonkers isn't it?! I mean you don't ever worry about not being the perfect wife or the perfect employee or friend or whatever but motherhood you have to aim for that elusive A+. (It's more of an A* really, isn't it? The impossible grade that nobody gets in real life.)

I feel like I know the best way to react to stuff, that I should deal with things etc but then real life happens and I'm tired or distracted or DS reacts the wrong way or I want to do something else or we ran out of milk so I can't make spontaneous pancakes or whatever. I KNOW this! I know this is normal but I can't get past that guilt. If I wasn't "always on"... but we are always on. That's our job as parents.

I know we keep going around in circles with this guilt/perfectionist stuff so I'm going to start another thread asking for opinions specifically on that, I think the idea of a thread for parents wanting to improve does probably attract a few perfectionists (although I know I could do - and am doing - better even on a normal level, not a perfectionist level, too, so it's still helpful for me) and I want to get a more generalised/mixed opinion on it. Plus I don't want to derail this one because it's supposed to be about parenting. Guh.

I've realised I've stopped feeling like I enjoy it (parenting, this life, probably a bit life in general) again so I'm going to try and do my noting one thing I enjoy every day again. Feel free to join in :) I do "one thing I enjoyed doing with DS" because that's the bit I end up feeling like I don't enjoy at all and it helps to focus on the bits that I did. But do whatever you like.

So for January 12: I'm going to reuse an old one. DS found a conker dug away in some sand and said "Let's play kastanie kicking again!" and we kicked it all the way home. I like the way he switches languages mid sentence.

Good blog post - I think I'm quite a way from being able to stand up to people pointing their avocado at me though. I mean, I'm just working it all out on the fly, I've no idea what I'm doing so how can I be sure it IS the right thing?!

BertieBotts I seem to cycle round and round and in and out of Really Enjoying and Really NOT Enjoying this parenting lark. I thought it was just me!!!! I thought I'm such a bad mother, why don't I love every moment, what's wrong with me? I'm going to emotionally scar my children for life! (Did I mention I tend to lean to extremes and catastrophise?!) So I will join in too. My one for yesterday has got to be doing everything without violence from DS. Let's see where today gets us...

bertie I think I judge myself quite harshly on the whole - generally I like to feel that I'm good at what I'm doing, parenting or not. I don't have to be the best, in fact I thrive when I'm surrounded by others who feel the same and I love to be inspired by the people around me. But it's important to me to be, and to be quietly seen to be, doing well at stuff.

The problem with this parenting business is that since DD, not only do I feel completely out of my depth a lot of the time, but I feel embarrassingly so. Since when was I the sort of person who throws a tantrum or cries in front of my kids? It's embarassing. And all so damn public.

Can you link to your new thread? I'll be interested to read it.

I'm reading the spirited child book, I think I mentioned earlier, and it's very interesting. It talks about introverts and extroverts; their needs and the way those needs can clash. It quotes a guy who says something along the lines of 'if only I could eat a side of beef, drink a barrel of water, and have my needs met for a month'. But it doesn't work like that. We need our needs met daily. And as an introvert, with two small boisterous children, that hasn't been happening. Like bertie said, we're always 'on'. It was a reminder that I need to try to meet those needs in small ways.

bexster I kind of blinked when I read your post as it describes so precisely how I feel a lot of the time.

Yes it's here: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/parenting/2280847-Perfectionism

Bexster it's definitely not just you although I feel like it's more extreme for me than for others - unless it's just words a lot of people post on facebook stuff like "I am so blessed!" or something which is a mix "Grr little tinkers but it's a good job they're cute" or something. I mean, I know nobody is going to put "I hate my kids and my life and it would be a relief to go to sleep and never wake up" on facebook, but most of the time I don't feel blessed at all and I can't see the positive when I feel negative, I feel like DS spoils everything and I feel like a total freak, monster, fraud for feeling that way. I have fleeting moments of enjoyment. I know most of that is depression talking but I still worry that it's just the way I am.

Can I make a suggestion though on your sentence for the day - if you word it that way it's focusing on the negative (without violence) but you could turn it around and say "It was really nice that DS was co-operative today" or "It was really nice to have a calm day with DS" or "It was great to see DS in control of his temper" or whatever fits.

Right - I have vanilla syrup for my coffee and fresh bread and honey for breakfast so let's see if that cheers me up

Funnily I just came across this while looking for something else carried-family.blogspot.de/2009/03/on-letting-go-of-perfection.html

Funny how the "right" thing sometimes plops into our laps. I'd read that years ago but it didn't reach me at that time.

That is a really good article BertieBotts "I even managed to slow down and just BE with the children" that's worth striving for as is "Being a model of someone doing their best, having ideals, trying to live up to them, and putting things right as best I can as soon as I can when I know I'm making a mess of it" So much healthier!

And you're right about my phrasing. So yesterday can be all about DS being gentle and nice to everyone and today's might be about DS stopping in the middle of what he was happily doing, picking up one of DD's books and showing it to her :) though we've not had the afternoon yet...

This is a very reassuring thread. In and of itself it is probably making me a slightly better parent as I can be less stressed, realising that it's fairly normal to find it HARD and I'm not actually the ONLY ONE to lose my temper :/ and by not having to BEAT MYSELF UP about that on top of everything else does make me feel a bit better. Which in turn, will make me be a bit nicer :)

Need to check out this spirited children book. Sounds really interesting...

AnotherMonkey that's interesting what you say about needing your needs met daily and being always ON. I was trying to explain something similar to DH as how I feel - I just need time to be me, to do things for me that aren't anything to do with basic needs (like eating, drinking, going to the loo... Though it'd be nice to have the time for those too!!!), for things that aren't anything to do with childcare, to just be left alone for one moment!!! I think bf an apparently very hungry baby exacerbates that too. Without this down time I just start to feel ARGH!!!!!

BertieBotts that must be super tough to have to struggle with depression and a DS. I have struggled with depression in the past but not when I've had to care for others. I can't imagine how hard that must be. Hope at least your breakfast went well.

Well, good luck for today everyone! !

warrior monkey and bexster perhaps you could set up catastrophisers anonymous? With "always look on the bright side of life" from the life of Brian as your anthem, and t shirts with "it's not as bad as we think it is!" Printed on them to wear at meetings?

Seriously though, the thing about "perfect", it's a subjective term that cannot be defined for an activity like being a parent. I'll have a look at your thread bertie ..

bexster have you had a look at any of the books/websites posted in the OP of this thread? They are up there because we have found them useful to read or look at. There is no One Right Way in parenting, but there are behaviours, ways of speaking to children etc that are Helpful as opposed to CounterProductive and for me certainly reading a few books was really useful. It helps you see what you are doing that is working, and points you in the right direction of what to do when things are not working......

Having said that, you have a baby and a toddler, you are right "in it" at the mo. Sometimes you just need to go with the flow, taking support where and when you can. (So glad you find the thread reassuring, clever monkey has located a pocket of MN where dismissive and judgemental doesn't rule)
I'm going to make a Victoria sponge this aft. Here is a virtual slice for you all..

Cake (real) this was after 4 teenage girls and an older person...well, me had launched in.

Oh wow yum! I live Victoria sponge!!! Looks a particularly good one with lots of creamy filling

I haven't looked at the books or websites - I hadn't realised they were there. But I will take a look. I like to read things to help me work things out. Thanks for the tip!

And yes Catastrophisers Anonymous sounds brilliant haha I think we need it!!!!!

Seriously I did actually read that OP (I've just re-read it) thought must check those sites and books out. And promptly forgot all about them!! Thanks Letsgoforawalk!