To Smack or not to Smack

[Tigger2]

Henry McLeish, Scotlands First Minister is trying to put a Bill through that children under the age of 3 should not be smacked. What are everyones views on this. And do you think this will lead to a total ban on smacking altogether?

Tigermoth, If you asked any shrink then they would say that it is never appropriate to smack a child no matter what age. I can not see how you can approve of being violent towards your children. You are supposed to love them.

Ohh that's fighting talk, undiscovered I havn't the time to go into this now - I did post my views on smacking earlier on this long message thread.

sis, I'll try and get back to you later. I think bloss gave a good answer.

Wrong name - sas2, not sis.

Tigermoth, don't rise to 'undiscovered' comments. 'Undiscovered' left an equally, if not more so, unhelpful comment on another thread and is just looking for a fight.

I was smacked as a child in moderation and only ever on hands or legs and it never hurt me. In fact I can remember that just the threat of a smack used to put us off I think in practice mum had to smack us very little. How can you reason with a baby ? After repeated no's there has to be another way to communicate that something is wrong. I think when needed and after all else fails its not going to scar or harm the child. Just my humble opinion

Don't hit them anywhere. If you are dealing with a toddler that you can't reason with then put them in a room on there own for some 'time out', they will soon get the message. Surely you don't go around hitting babies????

Bloss, I found it interesting that you told your son that hitting mummy is wrong, and to teach him this you hit him! I'm not having a go, I just found it ironic!

I too was hit by my mum and I have inherited her short temper, which makes me capable of lashing out instead of taking time out. I have lashed out at my dd once, and I felt extremely bad about it. But this is the difference, I had done wrong, I had lashed out without thinking, a lot of people here have thought about it first. However I don't think that makes it particularly right.

Any child under the age of 2 is still a baby by my reasoning, they do not understand right from wrong. When they test you, they are just finding out their limits, they are learning what is acceptable and what is not. So I don't think at this age they are capable of being deliberately naughty and so I don't think they deserve to be smacked. However if you put me in the position that Batter's friend was in, when her child ran across a busy main road, I might well go for the sharp short shock treatment, although I think my reaction to them would probably suffice.

I guess I am lucky that dd has never done anything that naughty. Usually if I shout her full name at her very sternly she stops what she is doing. If she doesn't I will go and physically remove her, look at her and tell her off. I never have to do more than this.

I can understand why people here feel they need to smack, but I don't really agree with it, not for kids under 2. Seems to me that the people I know who do smack their kids, have very naughty kids, perhaps because once mummy has used her ultimate form of punishment, there is nothing worse to come.

Rhubarb, I totally agree with you. But I think those children that are really naughty that you talk about, are so because they are being taught that violence is ok. If mummy is doing it then why can't I.
It's simmilar to the scenario that because I'm tidy at home it has encouraged my children to be the same without me asking.
A couple of weeks ago my parents looked after my 2 and 3 year olds. My dad left a cupboard open in the kitchen (something I'd never dream of doing) and my 3 year old would not leave my dad alone until he had gone back in to the kitchen and closed the cupboard.

I am not talking about smacking a baby !! I am talking about a child that is old enough to understand right from wrong and you tell them no and they still take no notice.
This however is a very INDIVIDUAL decision and each parent must decide to discipline their child themselves and it is not for anyone else to judge. Unless of course they are battering their children which is entirely different.

Sorry, I guess we each have our own opinions on this. One thing I will say though, I never respected my mum when she smacked me and that respect has never come back either. I saw smacking as someone losing their temper, not as a punishment. I found it wholly unfair and I bitterly resented it.

You may disagree, I just thought that a victim of smacking should tell their side.

good post, Rhubarb. My oldest son had the odd smack at 3 years, not two years. So far I have not smacked my youngest son, aged 2.5 years. Don't know if I ever will. I would feel very uncomfortable about smacking a 1 year old.

Confining my pro-smacking remarks to three year olds and over, I do feel that regular shouting matches, sarcasm, lack of loving attention and constant criticism can do more harm than an occasional light tap on the back of the hand. As a child I had the odd smack, but I sensed no withdrawel of love when I was naughty. My smackings did not scar me then and or now.

I know Bloss, that your son is not yet two, but smacking in the context you describe is not bad either IMO. You are using a very carefully controlled physical means of teaching your son his physical limits. I didn't go this way with either my sons at that age, but I can see where you are coming from.

Rhubarb, I totally agree. Smacking is the lazy persons way out. It is harder to give the child time out or to THINK about a punishment that will teach them right from wrong without belittleing them.
By the way, I was smacked as a child and do not really get on very well with my mum (my dad never laid a finger on me)

I agree with Tigermoth and I wasn't smacked a lot at all as a child but the rare occassions I was I haven't ended up resenting mum for it.
Hopefully I will never need to smack my dd because I would hate too, but at the same time I don't want her to become spoiled and always expect to get her own way. In retrospect, I was punished a lot more than smacked and that really worked because even as young as toddling I understood a punishment like not having my dessert or my teddy being taken away.

Yeah, I think there's a difference between losing your temper and smacking in a controlled way. The odd smack for something really naughty will often have the desired effect, but smacking as a routine form of punishment won't.

I agree absolutely with that. As long as the child understands why etc, etc and it's not a regular occurrence - that is awful and I would think would lead to a child feeling very hurt and being withdrawn. Same as listening to constant quarrels.

Talking of quarrels, I'm going now before undiscovered gets herself into another one!

What a hot potato this is turning out to be. Bloss - I would say I do agree with you. I occasionally smack my boy (now 2.8) but I don?t think I am so calm as you! I don?t do it hard and I feel it is more for shock value and does seem to work. I also tried all those other methods but they don?t always work. I didn?t smack till he was about 2 thinking he may not understand before then (being a late talker I?ve given him the benefit of the doubt). As you say he appears to test boundaries and did go through a phase of hitting me too. I found that grabbing his wrists and pushing him away seems to work as it didn?t seem right to hit him in retaliation to him hitting me. He seems to have stopped this now and a lot of it was done when he was bored and was testing my reactions. I?ve smacked less and less recently so I feel that my son is reaching an age where I can reason with him.

I do 99% of the childcare and I am only human after all and do get angry with him. It nearly always involves shouting at him but sometimes if he is being deliberately tiresome then it has involved a smack. I think this kind of low-key discipline is a far cry from some forms of punishment where the parent/carer is obviously on a power trip and who perhaps hits very hard. Also let us not forget that mental cruelty can be very damaging. Undiscovered ? sometimes it is not possible to put an older child into another room ? what is to stop them just walking back or doing something naughty in the other room?

It depends how you behave the rest of the time, loving, promoting good behaviour etc. I also think that smacking doesn?t promote violence. Anyway who is to say that we don?t all have some kind of an aggressive streak in us ? growing up is about learning to control ourselves and discovering that being aggressive isn?t socially acceptable. Many toddlers are extremely aggressive and I?d bet that some of them are never smacked at all.

I was smacked as a child and yet I?ve turned into an extremely passive adult with an excellent relationship with my parents. It is all too easy to blame problems with our parents on something specific like smacking but it is bound to be more complex than that. I am talking about low-key smacking here ? not those who had very aggressive parents.

I agree with you Eulalia.
This is also a bit like the routine or no routine debate.
It depends a lot on the child's behaviour and on the parent's behaviour.
My cousin has 3 boys and we were talking about this not long ago...she smacks her second one as he is very unruly. She has never smacked her eldest... he is such an easy child... she doesn't need to ! She suspects that her 3rd will be a very easy child as well... She is not pro-smacking at all but as she told me her 2nd one won't listen until she looks likes she means business!

The governments of all countries should be more concerned with 'real' abuse.

There is a difference between abuse and discipline. The odd smack is NOT abuse. Hitting with the buckle of an army belt is abuse, as happened to me between the ages of 8 and 12, more often than not, it was because I hadn't washed the dishes correctly or tidied my bedroom.

Well that's my piece said, I'm off to get a chinese take-away.

That's not the half of it, there's the 'other' abuse too. The only reason it stopped at the age of 12 was because my Step-Father was sent to prison for 6 months for it, and my sister and I were taken into care for our own protection when he came out.

OK I think, some days I think about it some days I don't. But I don't let it affect my life. We're talking 24 years since it stopped, I'm not sure about whether I've 'got over' it, probably not, but it just gets pushed to back of my mind.

I suppose it only really affects me when I see the NSPCC ads on tv. Oh and it's made me fiercely protective of my kids.

I'm anti-smacking. I've used time out very effectively for when ds used to hit me. Luckily it worked for us. However, when he recently went to grab the hot iron on the ironing board, I smacked his hand. Both of us were shocked but it was a gut reaction/damage limitation thing. I think when a child does something that is dangerous like that, you can't start reasoning about what the best thing to do is. You haven't the time. Anyway, I now live in a crumpled zone and haven't ironed since!