Walking into a surname disaster?

[Minimoon123]

Ok, so I'm a FTM, 40 weeks pregnant today and don't know if I'm having a boy or a girl. Looking for thoughts on whether I'm heading into a world of surname pain or not because...

DP and I not married. He's Irish, I'm English. He has no family - both parents passed away, no siblings, basically no one to carry on his name whereas there are bazillions with my surname. So months ago I said baby should take his name. He said he didn't mind. But now seems to mind!

Didn't discover until a couple of days ago that he considers that the baby will take the correct Irish version of his name depending on their gender. So if a girl, instead of his surname: O' XXX, would be Nic XXX. (O' means 'son of' and Nic means 'daughter of' apparently). To complicate matters further Nic is pronounced Nee. And to complicate matters even further, the first name and surname of our potential daughter also involves a lot of Nee Noo and Naa type sounds. Basically she would sound like an ambulance siren.

(Slight side note, I already caved on the first name as he played the 'the only name I like is my dead mother's name' card. So we're in fully Irish territory here with first and surname despite the fact I'm English and we live in England.)

So: I held firm (not easy as DP is super stubborn) and have refused to agree to Nic XXX but instead have managed to agree a compromise on just dropping the O' so it's as close to DP's surname as possible while still making sense to him (and she has to have Nic as a middle name). But what that effectively means is:

DP will be O' XXX
DD would be XXX
DS (if/when) would be O' XXX
And I would be YYY

So the poor child would have a slightly different surname from anyone else. Is this going to cause problems? Travel? etc? I thought it would be ok but I can tell my mother is worried which has worried me!

Obviously it might all be moot if it's a boy but then there's always a chance of a girl in the future so I guess good to know!

What do you think? (Sorry post got looong!) I don't want to reopen the argument with DP but equally I don't want to wander into a mess with my eyes closed.

You got bigger problems than a baby name. Your dh doesnt respect you at all.

He's being ridiculous. Even in Eire they rarely do that. Tell him to grow up.

DP not DH

Oh god, someone used the term Eire.

Sound the klaxon!

Basically she would sound like an ambulance siren.

this made my day.

If he's Ó then baby should be Ní. It's only if he's Mac that it changes to Nic. Just so that she doesn't have something nobody has in Ireland either...

The baby doesn't have to be anything though, especially living in the UK.

So, say for example the OP's partner is John O'Brien- that's the same he goes by in the UK and not Seán Ó Briain. They plan on calling the child Áine after his mother. He wants to call the child Áine Ní Briain, when he's John O'Brien and his partner is Sarah Smith.

Nothing necessarily wrong with that but even Irish people don't do that except if they go to an Irish speaking school.

I get that he's an expat who wants to pass on an important part of his heritage but his actual surname should be sufficient. And I say that as someone with an O'xxx name, inherited from my father who was an O'xxx. The only time I use the Ní was when I was speaking in Irish.

WhatLoveInTokyo said!

If you got married and took his name, what would it be? Is there a different thing for "wife of"?

Bean Ui XXXX = wife of XXX

Open to correction. My Irish is long gone

Mine is very rusty too Nose, but that sounds familiar to me.

Be traditional. Give the baby your name. If you get married later, you can change it whatever you/your husband want. That will a) buy you time to convince him and b) ensure that the baby’s name match’s that of one it’s parents which seemed to be your concern in your OP.

I'd just say any child can have DP's current surname as it is (if you intend to marry) if not I'd wonder whether it is ok to let the name go. Many Irish don't use Nic, it isn't unreasonable at all to have this slight and usual anglicization.

Only go with his dead mothers name, if you like the name.

After reading other threads today consider marriage for long term
financial security.

So, say for example the OP's partner is John O'Brien- that's the same he goes by in the UK and not Seán Ó Briain. They plan on calling the child Áine after his mother. He wants to call the child Áine Ní Briain, when he's John O'Brien and his partner is Sarah Smith.

I think the OP did say that her partner uses the fully Irish version (i.e. Ó Ceallaigh rather than O'Kelly). In which case his daughter would be Ní Cheallaigh.

Which I don't see a problem with, if it's what you want, OP. But it doesn't sound like it is, and his "The only name I like is my dead mother's one" sounds hugely manipulative and just generally arsey.

“Until you are a family unit, you need to represent your own interests.”

^ this ^

I am very, very glad I held out and argued for DS to have a double barrelled sir name, in spite of the plan that we’d all have the same sir name when we get married so what was the point blah blah blah...

The marriage never happened, and DS would have been left with a completely different name to me. As the man has since completely abandoned his innocent little boy, it’s not just passport control that it’s important for. Poor DS would feel very alone if he wasn’t clearly connected to his only family left - me, his mother.

I'd call your DD 'MIL name - Middle Name You Pick - Irish Ni Mouthful - Your Surname'

Assuming you like MIL name.

I have to say that it's hard becoming a parent when one/both of your parents has died. It opens a can of orphan feelings that you might not have been aware of previously. So I do have sympathy for your partner, but your child is not there to fix his grief. They are THEM, a brand new person, not a repair for the past.

@noseoftralee

Thanks for the clarification, I didn't realise that it was tradition to all have different prefixes to an Irish surname. The Irish families that I know all have the same name and prefix. That must be more common perhaps due to ease of travel etc.

Bean Uí XXX is even more unusual- I'm the only person that I know of that's chosen to use it.

Very annoying, as when I use my name in Irish people think I've just spelt Ní incorrectly.

Things change.

I got stuck with traditional name from a country DF was very involved with and his ancestors came from. He turned down property in said country and we never went there because he was busy doing other stuff and there was never any money My middle name is that of a beloved Great Aunt and not really any better.

I have been on holiday there once as an adult.

I would much rather had a traditional name from the place where I was born, where my mother was born, where most of my relatives are, and where I would like to go back to.

My DSis (DC4) got the pretty names from there - DF's obsessive influence had waned by then, and DM had grown balls.

Give her names that you like. Give her your surname for now. It is simple to change it when you get married (but not if you don't).

Why not give your surname as one of the middle names? It'll be there on the passport but it won't be making the everyday surname any longer.

Oh and to make matters worse, I end up having to explain the name to people over and over and DM registered me and spelled it wrong LOL

God, why should anyone have to argue to have a say in the name that is given to their child? The child that comes out of their body in great pain, that they are going to look after every single day?

Say no to your husband. You've compromised on one aspect of the name. You have a say on the other. If he is adamant, then you can be too.

I have a friend who has the Ni prefix, I really like it. I think in context it is lovely. Might you move over to Ireland at any point ?
I can see why your DH is so set on this. As an Irish person who has lost his parents young, and is an ex-pat, the sense of himself as Irish is something he wants to pass down to his children. I’m not English and I understand that feeling of identity and wanting your children to feel it. In my case we moved back to Wales when we had children, but if we had stayed in England I know I would have wanted to preserve traditions from my culture where possible.
I would use the Ni or the O’ depending on sex.

Also might you marry and take his surname ?

Just to complicate matters more, if you did marry him (and using the Irish version of the surname O'Sullivan as an example), the surnames would be:

Him: Ó Súilleabháin (son of Sullivan)
You: Uí Shúilleabháin (wife of Sullivan)
DD: Ní Shúilleabháin (daughter of Sulllivan)

My mother gave me her surname when I was born and then her and dad changed it to his surname when I was 3. I can’t tell you how much of a faff it is on official documents!

You have to produce the documents with both names and some forms ask for any previous surnames. When explaining the previous name people assume you’ve been divorced. When I married DH I have now added a 3rd name to my list!

My Dad is Irish and I’d never heard of the surname variation for sons/daughters.

A friend of mine has children with a different surname to her and her new DH and they always get questioned at airport security!

If I were you I’d compromise with O’xxx and pick a first name that you can both agree on.