Amhlaoibh

[working9while5]

For a variety of reasons, if we have another boy we would like to give him this name.

It's pronounced Oh-lee-uv, and is the Irish version of Olaf. I am Irish and we have strong Norse connections, and this is a family name on my side.

However, clearly is it a NON RUNNER for a baby living in England, to be honest I doubt many Irish people can pronounce it.. so, we are trying to think of a way of incorporating it that will not lead to torture for any baby boy we have.

My granduncle Amhlaoibh had Humphrey as the English version of his name (back then, births had to be registered with an English name) and was called Uncle Free when the family spoke in English. Where they got Humphrey from Amhlaoibh I have no idea, but I'm not sure about it! Possibly thinking (randomly) James Amhlaoibh or Amhlaoibh James and we might do what my family did and call him James. It is common in both our families to have children known by their second name but have an alternative first name, so I have a nostalgia for this even though it makes sod all sense really!

Unless someone can think of a better alternative??

Of course it's belittling a name to say it looks like a bunch of scrabble tiles thrown on a table.

Of course I wouldn't care let alone be offended if somebody said my name looked like gobbledy gook as I'm not over-sensitive! We can't all like/spell/pronounce everybody's names fgs. This is why there are forums like these, to ask people's opinions & gain an insight into how people perceive a particular name.

SheCutOffTheirTails that is only my opinion! Surely that is what the op has asked people to give?

"you say 'unpronouncable' as if it is a property of the name. just because you cannot pronounce does not mean others will also struggle"

No, what I meant was that I wouldn't know how to pronounce the name unless someone had told me. And, yes, I do think that most people will struggle. I consider myself well educated and cosmopolitan, but have never heard of this name before. I would expect that this would be the case with most people, judging from the replies on here.

What I meant by the teacher not knowing is that if he/she was faced with a list of names to be called out and didn't know which name applied to which child.

You have obviously misunderstood my post completely.

I would have no idea how to pronounce that, and yes that's my problem. But, how many other people would know how to pronounce it?
Why gave a child a name that they will have to spell out to people every time they meet somebody who doesn't know how to pronounce/spell it?

Only ignorant monoglot arseholes have opinions like that.

There are languages other than English.

"Only ignorant monoglot arseholes have opinions like that.

There are languages other than English."

And there are more polite people who care about getting the pronunciation/spelling right first time. I know perfectly well that we live in a cosmopolitan country and try very hard to get people's names right, but I admit that this particular one defeated me. There is no need to be so rude about it.

working9while5 I love the name Finbarr.

There is only one ignorant arsehole on this thread bunbaker, but it's not me or you
It's quite rude and ignorant to belittle other people's opinions just because they are not the same as yours.

"We can't all like/spell/pronounce everybody's names fgs"

nobody mentioned anything about 'liking' the name, as you now i have i can only assume your dismissive and belittling attitude towards it is because of your dislike of the name. it's fine not to like a name, it's fine not to understand it, be able to pronounce it, or spell it. it isn't fine to assume your dislike of the name renders it 'a bunch of scrabble tiles' to everyone else that comes across it. it isn't. it is a name that you personally do not like.

"what I meant was that I wouldn't know how to pronounce the name unless someone had told me. And, yes, I do think that most people will struggle"

again, this does not make the name unpronouncable, it just tells us that you cannot pronounce it. others can which means it is pronouncable.

"What I meant by the teacher not knowing is that if he/she was faced with a list of names to be called out and didn't know which name applied to which child.

You have obviously misunderstood my post completely."

firstly, i dont think you understand what you posted yourself.
secondly, if that is what you meant i would ask to think about how much of an issue the problem you have highlighted is likely to be in the life of the person with this name? how often will this child be faced with a teacher that isn'tt familiar with the name? perhaps 30 occasions throughout school life? and of those 30 occasions, each teacher will spend at most 10 seconds establishing who owns the name, as it is an unusual name, it is very likely the name will stick in their mind and they wont struggle with it a second time. i hardly think this qualifies as a reason not to use the name you love. do you?

"Why gave a child a name that they will have to spell out to people every time they meet somebody who doesn't know how to pronounce/spell it?"

so what names are acceptable then? because there are lots of names with different variations on spelling that it would be almost impossible to find a name that every person you are likely to meet in your life will know how to spell.

Oi, no fighting on my babyname thread please!

I don't really agree too much with the teacher argument because well, working with kids myself, you just have to ask! I have had children with a range of different names on my caseload Antsohimbondrona/Mua'wiyah/Wojciech etc, some of which I initially I really hadn't a clue how to pronounce, but you just have to get around it, say "I'm not really sure how to pronounce your name, can you help me out with it?" and perhaps write it in a way that's meaningful to you. My experience of working in teams where we come across unusual names is that people rarely think twice about names that they see as "cultural" but often can be a bit rude about names that are seen as just "out there for the sake of it" e.g. Summer Rain or Leaf (which can be subject to some serious scoffing by people, even if they shouldn't).

I am more concerned as to what any potential baby boy might think of it, and who knows, I may never even have one! At the moment I have only a dot, not even a pregnancy I know for certain will be viable and it could be a girl. And even if were and I went on to have another 5 or 6 kids they might all be girls and I could be lying on my deathbed thinking, "isn't a shame I never got to call a child Ólaoibh!".

In some ways, I would prefer to go with something more unusual like Ólaoibh which is going to really stump people so that they have to ask than something like "Orla" which is always going to sound wrong to me when said in an English accent without an "r" but which most people probably feel they can pronounce. Like "Keogh", which is always pronounced kee-oh here when where I come from it's kyoh. I do like Irish boys names as a rule but God, why can't I find a single girl's one I like. Just one? That dh agrees on?? Aaargh!

I'm not belittling them because they are not the same as mine. I'm belittling them because they are stupid, ignorant and offensive opinions.

Amhlaoibh is a name entirely unfamiliar to me, and yet I can immediately tell how it should be pronounced.

Do you know how?

It's because I speak Irish, the language in which the name is written.

Does it annoy the fuck out of me when ignorant dicks make predictable, unoriginal jokes about how words written in my mother tongue are like random scrabble tiles?

You bet it does.

It's a totally dickish thing to say. Particularly when the OP explains where the name came from.

People who knew the name was in Irish still felt it acceptable to say rude things about how it looked like random letters.

Well it only looks like random letters if it is beyond your wit to conceive of letters being arranged in ways different from how they are arranged in English.

If I see a name I'm not familiar with, I try to make sense of the letters and find out what language it is written in.

I don't just dismiss it as a random bunch of scrabble tiles (which, as we all know, would spell "oxidize").

Because Irish boys' names are fab and girls' names all sound like a word for a body part or disease.

It's a cross we all have to bear :o

If I see a name I'm not familiar with, I try to make sense of the letters and find out what language it is written in
Well, so do I. I have no knowledge of Irish, so that method was no help whatsoever. Is that ignorance?- maybe so, I don't know what I don't know.
Hardly grounds to call someone an ignorant arsehole, was it?

Well obviously I think it was grounds, yes.

The OP told you how it was pronounced, as well as clueing you up as to the language it was written in.

Rude comments about scrabble tiles were entirely unnecessary, except to slag off the name in a culturally insensitive way.

I bet you're a barrel of laughs at parties.

Would you like some ketchup to go with that chip?

honey, why do you feel the need to use immature jibes? be satisfied that you can justify what you posted and leave it at that. posting silly comments like that just make you look petty and as though you aren't mature enough to have the discussion.

Look up the 'Sorcha' thread if you want a real chuckle about how chippy some Irish folks like to get over name prononounciation - some of them would start a row in an empty room!

and FWIW i think i understand SCOTT's 'chip' as you put it. the irish language was forcefully removed from so many generations of people in ireland by the english. native speakers feel very strongly that they should use their language and be proud of it and it hits a nerve when english people are once again belittling it and saying it looks like random letters.

nice ithaka. come onto a thread posted by an irish person, about an irish name, encouraging people to go and poke fun at irish people and irish names. that's just lovely.

Unless the A spelling has a particular resonance for you (and I think you said that you weren't sure how your family spelled it to start with?), then the O spelling would be more accessible. If that matters. It might not...

I know, my finger did hover over the post message button, but then, I thought, what the hell, and posted it anyway, in an I-give-up sort of way.

I never poked fun at Irish names or Irish people - just some Irish people who make themselves seem silly by getting so het up over a minor joke (not even insult!) about the pronounciation/writing of a name.

I am Scots BTW, so could play the 'cruel English destroying our culture' card, but when you talk to me of nationality, language, religion I try to fly by those nets

you mightn't have poked the fun, but you did come on here to encourage others to go over to that thread to point and laugh at the silly irish person. cant you see how that's a bit insensitive considering who this thread was posted by and what it's about? (BTW i dont know the thread in question or what offence was taken.)

Booooyhoo - do look up the Sorcha thread - it is worth it

I think it is the same 'silly irish person' (your words!) getting her knickers in a knot on that post as well, although I could be wrong.

Don't do nationalism myself, especially when it leads to name calling....

I love when ignorant, thick racists accuse people who take offence at their casual insults of other cultures as being "chippy".

People who go around making snotty jibes about "foreign" languages and ways don't even get invited to parties.

This is where the party ends, I can't stand here listening to you and your racist friend.

so now you want me to join in with the pointing and laughing? you dont see how posting here is insensitive? not going to acknowledge that at all?