Antenatal support thread for women who have chosen to terminate VI

[Coffeeandchocolate]

Time for a new thread, ladies. May it continue to give us comfort, and help us find a special, sunny place in our hearts, where our babies are safely tucked in. May it bring good luck to everyone who posts or justs reads.

And to the old-timers, it?s so lovely to still have you here with us, reaching out.

Coffee, Olivia and Allways, thank you so much for your kind words it does help to write about these things, but it especially help to know that others are reading and that you know the pain I'm speaking about. Thank you for sharing you experience with me, it does help.

And I think of you too Eavers, I haven't had the courage yet to put away the few maternity things I was wearing, they are just at the back of the drawer. Did you feel any better for having done it?

I am so amazed by the strength of all of you, the things its possible to get through. I have arranged to see a therapist, but she is moving and so it won't be till the 8th, I'm hoping she will be able to recommend someone for DH and I to speak to together - have any of you had experience of that? Did it help?

I got through DS's party, with only a few sniffles (fancy dress, so I got to wear a mask) I'm sure it was yesterday he was lying on the floor with the other babies, now they are playing musical bumps. I am grateful to have him, and know how precious he is.

Though its sad to know how many women are going through this agony, the virtual hugs do help, so I send them out to all of you as well

Hi Sarah, am glad you survived ds's party!

just wanted to say, I saw a counsellor on Tuesday, and I found it a tremendous help. I actually felt physically lighter when I had finished talking to her.

My situation is a little different, because I am in Ireland where termination is illegal, and where no-one ever speaks of terminating for abnormalities. The sense of isolation is immense - we had told literally nobody I was pregnant, and even now only my two sisters know about our experience.

It was a huge relief to me to hear that there are many women like me in Ireland. Of course because of our ludicrous pregnancy screening policies (there is none available, aside from routine ultrasound, unless you pay privately) and our general hypocrisy regarding termination, it remains hidden and unspoken of.

Sorry, I'll get down off my soapbox now.

Anyway, all i really wanted to say was that I found counselling to be hugely helpful - I think I sobbed right through the entire session, which was a relief in itself.

Thinking of you all.

Hi olivia I must say that your kind words were particularly welcome because I know how different your situation is, and I didn't want to seem ungrateful for the support that we have.

I lived in Ireland for 14 years and worked on the campaign for the right to information about terminations. I must say that I never really thought about termination for abnormalities at that time (the naivety of the young!)

So I'm really glad that you have a good counsellor who can offer you some break from that wall of secrecy.

You know that you made the right decision for your family and I admire you especially for being able to do so in such an unsupportive situation.

hope we can all sob our way to feeling better virtually together

I'm posting because I'm feeling pretty low at the moment. The weekend marked 12 months since my positive pregnancy test with the twins. Sadly 12 months on, the weekend also proved to us that the latest round of IVF had failed. It hit us much harder than we thought it would. I was so sure it would work; there was so much riding on it working. I had dreams of finally getting a May baby. When my period arrived before test date it well and truly took the wind from our sails.

Right now I just can't imagine ever getting pregnant again, ever being happy again. The feelings of loss, loneliness and despair are back. My sister in law is due to give birth in a weeks time. I?m so worried I won?t be able to cope (though I?ve lost all sense of what that means now) or share their happiness, bond with my new niece or nephew.

One positive that came from the weekend is that my husband agreed that we should see a counsellor together. I contacted the local charity here where we live that supports bereaved parents. We had reached the top of this in July, but my husband declined their offer of support. WE are back in the system, but there is a 3 month wait list at the moment. We have enrolled on their 'death of a baby support group', which starts late September. I wasn?t sure that he would be keen on a group session with other parents, but he has so we are going.

allways I'm sorry to hear that your IVF wasn't successful, it must make it so much harder that it should come at your anniversary point. its always amazing to me how much anniversaries matter. And so tough too to be dealing with other family members having children.

I hope that the group you go to with your DH will help. My DH was saying this morning that he can feel a layer of 'coping' forming over his pain, that is getting thicker, but he worries that the pain is just waiting and churning. I'm hoping we can start talking to someone while he's still aware of this. I think it is hard for men to accept emotional help.

I'm sure that you will be happy again, it does happen, but let yourself be sad too

Allways, I am so so sorry. I can't even begin to imagine how hard it is for you and your dh. Please don't worry about your niece or nephew, maybe it is just too early for you to be happy for somebody else. They should understand, they really should. In April, 2 months after losing Silvia, I didn't go to my niece's christening, I just couldn't. My dh went and found it pretty hard, so I was happy I stayed at home. Please just take care of yourself at the moment, shelter yourself from any more pain.

I am happy you can get counselling, although it's such a long wait. Are you receiving the ARC group emails? Maybe you can contact them as well if you need any support sooner, there are many ladies in there who are struggling or struggled with infertility after loss. There are also many positive stories. I also found SANDS a great help.

My heart goes out to you and I wish I could say more xxxx

Hi all

This thread feels quiet and sad at the moment. I just wanted to reach out to you all and say I hope you are okay.

Allways, it's so so hard for you with IVF on top of the loss of your girls. I agree with Coffee; I think people should/would understand how you feel. I really hope you can start another cycle soon.

All hectic here, but thinking of you all.

It's never been so silent here. I wish I felt the silence meant something positive but I don't feel it does.

Scrum, how are things with your DH? You've gone so quiet.

And Peanuthead, how are you doing - when do you plan your next IVF?

Olivia, Sarah, Eavers, you are all so newly bereaved; you must still be feeling raw. How are you all?

And oldies... Bee, Bezzy, Tree, Justa, I miss you all. I made the banana bread the other day that we were all making last summer and it made me remember all the banter... and Bezzy and Bee and Tree with your designer sheets and Molton Brown.... I miss you.

Hi can'tdothisagain sorry to be so silent, I felt I was writing too much, and I worried that I had made other's feel less comfortable.

I am still very raw, and in that very up and down state, this week has had the distraction of DS starting school which has been exciting and only made me cry a little, mostly I was just so pleased at him growing up. I also had my first session with my therapist. The interesting thing to come out of that was her saying how frightened she felt I was still - and that's really true. Its odd, the worst has happened, for Rosie things are done, peaceful. But for me my whole body is on alert for the next disaster. Noticing is the begining of moving on from it I suppose.

I do hope that Peanuthead and Scrum are ok, you both are dealing with so much at the moment. And Eavers and Olivia, hope you're moving forward too.

hopefully the thread will continue to be the supportive place it seems to always have been

Hi Sarah, I don't think anyone can write too much here. I've certainly written a lot, as have some other people (Coffee, for instance). I found it helped to put things into words.

I do understand the ups and downs, too. And the fear. I still felt afraid even when my babies were at peace. I am glad that counselling feels it might help.

Good luck to your DS, too. How has he coped at school? I imagine that must be an emotional stage to go through, seeing your child go to school for the first time. I hope he has enjoyed the new experience.

Hello,

This page was reccommended to me by cantdothisagain.

We said goodbye to our little girl Cara yesterday, 14 weeks+5 gestation, due to severe heart defects and turners syndrome. The most heartbreaking decision we have ever had to make.

Yesterday I was an emotional wreck. Today I am calm, and have no emotion at all. Is this normal?

I had a termination 12 years ago when I was very young and took that decision myself. I tormented myself for years over that choice and have only recently come to terms with it.

Now we have had to go through the same thing with our little girl, and I have not reacted at all as I thought I would. I have not cried once since the proceedure took place. The lead up to it, I couldn't stop crying and shaking, but since then, I have been so calm. I dont know what is wrong with me. And Im scared I will fall apart when my DH returns to work.

I have 2 little girls at home aged 2 & 3, who do not know about anything we have been through as we had not told them we were expecting.

I know it is early days, but I presumed these would be the worst. Why do I feel so normal? Did anyone else experience this?

Hi Natz, I am sorry about your lost baby girl.

I think feeling 'normal' is a coping mechanism because registering fully what happened would be too much. I also lost a baby to Turners at 13 weeks (baby was diagnosed as unable to live) and another at 20 weeks due to bilateral renal agenesis, a fatal condition. After the first termination, I got up the next day and went out with our toddler. There are photos of us laughing together. I can't remember the laughing but I remember the spooky normality of that day. I terminated on the Friday and returned to work on the Monday. I would have said I was okay if anyone asked. But when I remember that time now, I remember deep sadness. There was a toy my DD1 used to play with around that time, a musical pushalong thing, all the time. Now when I hear its sound in shops/playgroups etc, I feel the sadness of that period of my life that I almost didn't recognize at the time.

After the second termination I found it all much more raw and much harder. I guess the first time I just wanted to move on. The second time I felt like the whole horror had begun to define me and my life.

Not sure any of that made sense. I think all reactions are pretty much normal. And having small kids around makes it easier because you just have to be okay for them.

There are other people around who will say more, but I am so sorry you have had to go through this, and I am glad you are coping, however odd it feels.

Cant - Not been posting as don't rally know where to start. Can't move on as still waiting for chromosome results and to see another consultant about why the mc happened. I never didn't post on here but the mc wasn't related to the chromosomal condition the baby had it was a separate issue but we don't know what as the crappy obs consultant just saw there were abnormalities and referred us on to a geneticist which was all very interesting but not much use in working out why the mc happened so she had to refer us back which is of course another 8 week wait. We've got so many things to cope with in any future pregnancy - just getting pg, two types of abnormalities and now a possible incompetent cervix. I'm on the floor. Still waiting for counselling, not getting through the days very well. It's now the anniversary of Ben and I feel like I'm living through that time all over again. Hoping I'll feel at least a bit better after the anniversary of the termination which is in a couple of weeks. It's poisoning everything - DDs birthday was the day we got the diagnosis and I remember her party being pregnant and we'd just found out he didn't have a chromosome problem and I was so relieved - party is tomorrow. Am a nervous wreck - my emetophobia which I conquered about 10 years ago is back with a vengeance. And i'm on a high dose of anti-deps and they make little difference. As for IVF I'm desperate to have a timescale but can't until we get some answers. Plus I don't want to use the frozen embryos we have as the clinic is being taken to court for use of underage donors which is utterly horrifying - this has forced me to think about the whole ethics of egg donation which I've been hiding from all along. And we won't go back there now so if we do go again then I'll have to do alot of research to feel happy - and beg the grandparents for another load of cash as we have nowhere to get any any more.
I also seem to have turned into a nasty bitter person and can;t imagine ever being myself again. I have nothing to give anyone else and just compare every situation to mine thinking it's not as bad. It's horrible. So also not posting as I have nothing to offer anyone on here. There's nothing left of me.

Welcome Natz, so sorry to see someone new here. I apologise in advance for not having much to offer. I felt pretty normal after the termination - I think it is protective. I did fall apart badly when DH went back to work with my second loss - can you make sure there will be someone to look after your DDs the day he goes back then if you do fall apart you can let yourself ago.

Peanuthead
Bee here. I never post nowadays. But am just sending you big peanutty hug and an angry slap at the world on your behalf.
It is not fair.
There will be dark days and brighter ones. Let the terrible anniversaries pass; let the tiny moments of joy in without guilt for feeling them; find a new clinic (famous good one in the states and will find the details), beg or borrow the money. Treat yourself well; eat well, try and rest when you can. Depression is very tiring indeed.
Wish could hold your hand.
with love and caring vibes
Bee xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Love to Cant and Coffee.

Hi penut and Natz I don't know what I could say that would be any comfort to either of you, but want you to know you are heard.

peanut you have weathered so much it only makes sense you should be tired and angry, that doesn't make you not a nice person - even nice people are allowed to be bitter and angry when they are going through hell. Hope you can find the way through soon.

Natz everything you describe is how I felt when I recently lost our baby Rosie to Trisomy 9 ( we were originally told to expect Turners from the scan) I felt really steady the day after the termination - but I certainly have been up and down since. Don't criticise yourself for either emotion (or indeed any others that may well up).

Me I spent the day with a friend who's just coming on 11 weeks - with my head I'm fine with it, but I didn't enjoy her company like I usually do (finding fault in my head with everything). And I also feel worried for her, with no good reason, pregnancy just feels frightening to me right now. First period hovering, spotting yesterday and today I wish it would just come and be done)

take care everyone

Peanut, what to say? Your message so eloquently showed your despair, and I understand that that words can't soothe it at all. You're right, too. Your luck has been terrible. Your luck will change, but I can see why you feel as you do.

I agree with everything wise Bee said. And I wish things could work out faster for you. On a different note, I was interested in your comment about egg donation. I'd never thought of underage donors, or indeed in the 'other side' of fertility problems. God, it's a minefield. The US sounds like a sensible plan, though.

Sarah, being around pregnant people is exhausting after what we went through. You are a better person than me; I avoided it for ages....

Im so sorry to read about everyones experiences. My heart is breaking for you all. I wish I could take all your pain and sadness away and lift the dark cloud which follows behind. I still feel totally normal. I have even seen family and spoken about it openly and without any emotion.
My sister in law lost her only baby at 16 weeks and has been unable to conceive since, that was 7 years ago. She also told me that how I am feeling - or not feeling - is normal. She has also offered her support should I need it. My sister lost her premature DD at birth last year, and also is offering support. After what they went through in comparisson to what Ive been through, I feel as if I dont have the right to feel sorry for myself as I did not 'suffer' physically with a miscarriage or birth of a baby I then lost. I know many of you have had to go through the process of giving birth and losing your babies. My heart goes out to you all as that experience seems too cruel to be real. I dont want to use the word fortunate, but I didn't have to experience this, and for that I am fortunate.
Dont get me wrong, there was not one moment on Thursday that I found easy, it was the hardest and most physically and emotionally draining day of my life. But in comparisson to so many others, I feel a bit like a fraud being on this site.
I hope you all find peace, and heal from your experiences. Reading about all this pain and heartache is so difficult.
My mum is going to be on hand when my DH returns to work. My DD's go to pre-school two afternoons a week. I am worried about this when I have to be indoors on my own. I want to cry, I want to grieve, I want to feel something. I dont know if I am more worried that I will break down and have floods of emotion, or if nothing will happen at all.
Sending love & strength to you all x

Big sigh, so much sadness in here these days. Like Cantdo said, I did write in here a lot, daily, sometimes several times a day, just trying to make sense of everything. For many months, this thread has been my lifeline. For the newbies: I terminated back in February at 22 weeks, as my baby girl had severe brain abnormalities. I am now very lucky to be pregnant again, 16 weeks, and have my first anomaly scan next Friday.

Sarah, and all the others, please don?t worry that you write too much, this doesn?t put anyone off. We have different ways of dealing with the pain, some of us write and write and write, some others go into a shell ? it?s all ok. And I hope the posts in here also help those who just lurk, we are not alone.

Natz, what can I say except that I am sorry for the loss of Cara? Any reaction (or what seems like lack of it) is normal. We should not be here, it?s too much to take in, especially in the early days. It?s not normality, it?s numbness, the mind shutting down for a while. It?s awful that your sister and SIL went through something somehow similar, but this means that you will be surrounded by people who know what losing a baby means. You do have the right to feel sorry for yourself ? yes, the losses are different, but this doesn?t mean there is a scale which would entitle some of us to more sympathy than others.

Peanut, as usual words fail me when I am thinking about you and the hell you?ve been through. I feel as if I can?t really offer much support, as if anything I said, although from the heart, sounds hypocritical because I am in a different place ? although not out of the woods yet and terrified. But I am thinking of you and I think that if it helps you, you should come in here and talk to us. It is a support thread, and I hope it will support you. Bee has put it so well, as usual, there are so many non-dodgy clinics, and I?ve heard about many cases when women with an incompetent cervix had successful pregnancies. But it is an awful lot to compute and much time is needed, I hope it will all pass gently somehow and you will find a thread of hope to get you through these days.

Thinking of you all ladies. Bee, big hugs xxxx

Natz, thinking of you in these awful early days. I hope you've got plenty of support in real life and that you're able to find a way that is right for you to grieve for your daughter Cara. You sound very strong, offering help to others.

I'd say to all, that you can write as little or as much as feels right. I posted lots in the early days and came back when I was feeling low and posted some more. Now, I'm in a different place altogether and have kept my silence as my pain has very much turned to bitterness and anger and something I can't quite understand. I'm trying to access to some help. I hardly know or like the person I've become.

I think of you all often and hope that we all find reasons to smile, without guilt or fear.

Hi everyone, just letting you know I'm still around, always reading if not posting. We went to Melbourne recently to visit family, especially DH's grandad who was sick with cancer. He died yesterday, so I am so glad we decided to go when we did and that he got to meet his youngest great-grandchild. We'll be moving in the next month as the house we're in has sold, and the one we're building won't be ready until about Christmas, so have been busy packing yet again. Also, Bella hasn't been well - nothing serious, just a cold that seems to come and go, but ended up in a bout of croup a couple of days ago, which is very scary in the middle of the night. She's all good now though - almost 8 months old already!

My thoughts have been with you all though. Always, I'm so sorry your last IVF didn't work out. Around the time you and Coffee joined the thread, i had downloaded the song 'Beautiful in my eyes' as it reminded me of when my 15yr old dd was born. Then, and each time i have listened to it since, it has also reminded me of you and Coffee and your girls. Don't be too hard on yourself for feeling bitter etc I dont think anyone could blame you for that. You so deserve that happy ending, as does Peanut, Scrum and so many others. Thinking of you all xxx

Natz, a warm welcome to you xx

Just need to discharge a little agony. There have been quite a few other threads dealing with high nuchal and cystic hygromas lately and I really want to post and let these people know there is hope because that's what I wanted when we were there, but I also find it hard because our hopes were dashed. And when I read about people who had similar nuchal to us and then went on to healthy pregnancies I really feel the need for Rosie's post mortem - we're still waiting and I have such a fear that they will say 'we were wrong, there was nothing wrong with her' I know that this is irrational, and its a strange mix of hope and fear, like I can't let go of the hope that she will be fine. Its all very mixed up, but I would have so much preferred to have the consultants appointment before her funeral. I know the funeral will help, but we'll be in limbo until the post mortem, I know it.

Must try to enjoy the sunny day and my darling DS enjoying his new scooter

Sarah - I think your fear is totally normal - if you can face reading back through here a bit you'll see that Coffee went through agonies over thinking they'd got the diagnosis wrong etc. She might pass by here and tell you herself. It's horrible waiting for all the final bits to come together, seems endless.

I never post on any of those threads as our outcome was negative and I don't want to give anyone the fear.

Allways - hope you're Ok - I can't face up to just how horrible a BFN would be after all this, after mentally preparing for another pregnancy. When we finally gather our resources for another go I don't even think it won't work. Hope you ahve the energy/finaces to have another go soon as you're able - it worked once, will work again. So many bloody hurdles.

Bee - thanks so much for thinking of me - I know you're out there struggling with it all, just hope it's getting easier.

CAn't - thanks for posting here - can't believe you ahve the time with a LO. You do remain an inspiration - it can happen twice and you can go on to have a healthy baby and the luck does change...

We got the results back from the geneticist - all clear as expected and again she said the 2 conditions were down to chance. Sigh... But that's good as we can start TTC naturally for what it's worth. Not much. I won't be moving to the ttc thread as can't bear all the pregnancies still. So that's step 1 out the way. Also found out we hadn't been referred on to the incompetent cervix guy but after a long chat with his lovely secretary we now are. God knows how long that wait will be. I still find it hard to accept that the mc wasn't caused by the abnormalities - I mean what are the chances of 2 things going wrong like that? But then what are the chances of any of the repeat things.

And gearing up for Ben's (the terminated baby) anniversary next weekend. I'd like to mark it but as we're going down to the inlaws will have to pretend it's not happening. I just hope things will be a bit easier after that. It's definitely been harder losing my "own" baby than the donor one but I suspect I hadn't actually come to terms with the whole donor egg issue.

Hi to everyone I've missed, Coffee and Mishta, Lisbeth and Monkey and Olivia. Hope you're all hanging on in there...

Sarah, Peanut is right, I agonised in here for ages about the possibility of the post mortem showing there was nothing wrong with Silvia. I even called ARC to ask if they ever heard of a case when the post mortem showed the doctors were wrong, and they said no, the option to terminate is never given lightly. We waited for 3 months for the results to come through so we also had the cremation before receiving them.

I also agonised in here about the cremation. I had always feared funerals and there were moments when it really seemed to me like I couldn?t get through it. But unexpectedly it was peaceful, although of course totally heart-breaking. It was a very important milestone in this horrible journey. The ladies in here were wonderful and I knew they were thinking of us and our little girl, it meant a lot, especially as dh and I aren?t from the UK and our families are miles away (and unfortunately not very supportive this time, I have to say).

When is the funeral, and did they tell you when the appointment with the consultant could be?

Peanut, you sound better, I am glad. I guess as you say, it is a step forward to know that you can start TTC. I totally understand why you don?t feel like posting on the other thread, and you don?t have to. Good news that you are being referred for the incompetent cervix , you need as much information as you can get. About the chances of having something so rare happen twice, it is something I find very hard to get my head round, especially as I am acutely aware that it might be the case for me too next Friday or if not then another couple of weeks later.

Can you get away for at least half an hour next weekend, be it only to say a few words to Ben if you feel like it? You will mark his anniversary anyway, even if you can?t show anything on the outside (so rubbish you can?t, though). It will be a special day in your thoughts.

Mishta, thank you for your thoughts, good to hear from you and that Bella is now better.

Big hugs to everyone else and sorry for not mentioning each of you. xxxx