To think Auriol Grey being jailed is not appropriate.

Well it's not my choice whether to trust these people in the mental state they were in over two years ago.

What's happened has happened. Kids' lives are screwed up, people are being cared for after being taken away from bridges, etc.

People still encounter bikes on pavements but they generally react better than some of them did in 2020 I think.

In 2020 I don't remember there being stories of people potentially pushing others into busy roads, or at least gesticulating menacingly forcing others to do so. I remember there being some shouting and people choosing to move themselves into the road sometimes.

I'm still overly cautious about COVID and whilst mental health issues surface in a multitude of different ways even for the same conditions I can say I'd never have done what she did.

Overall though you're dodging my question. Would you want to risk being close to this woman on the street knowing she's already potentially caused one person's death? Its fine giving potential reasons but that shouldn't negate consequences when serious harm has been done

Grey is hardly vulnerable! Look at the strength of her! steaming down the shared pathway, cussing and arms flailing ..and she admitted to ''Making contact'' .?the true vulnerable woman, the killed woman, went flying.

Had Grey been innocent, she wouldn't be in ''Chokey'' now.

Well I wouldn't be riding a bike on a pavement to start with so she wouldn't be shouting at me.

And I wouldn't park my car to block the pavement, so she wouldn't be attacking my car.

And I wouldn't be stood 2ft behind her, breathing down her neck in the supermarket queue.

Etc.

I'm sure there would be no potential conflict between us because I try very, very hard to behave as I perceive is expected.

I'm sure there would be no potential conflict between us because I try very, very hard to behave as I perceive is expected.

As was Celia. Clearly she believed she wasn't doing anything wrong by riding on the footpath there. The issue is when someone else doesn't with you, do you deserve to be "punished" by them?

But there are people saying that was a shared path so potentially you wouldn't need to be doing anything wrong for her to attack you, not that any of those scenarios warrant someone losing their life.

Seems strange you hold yourself to a high standard of decency but you're willing to let someone who's done one of the most heinous things possible with a slapped wrist to potentially do it again.

I was just thinking. Take the death out of the picture.

If the incident had happened exactly the same except the car had been 50m further away then what would we think?

If the incident had happened but the cyclist had steered the 'right' way around the pedestrian then what would have happened?

We wouldn't be trying to attach blame would we?

The 'punishment' aspect only comes in if you believe there was a delivery action taken to cause harm. As far as I'm aware that's never been suggested by the authorities.

As I've said before. I have no strong position in this.

Well we'd probably never have heard about it to discuss it would we? Of course the death Influences things but if it had got media attention there'd still be people wanting there to be punishment but obviously the worse the Consequences the more likely people will want there to be suitable punishment.

You don't potentially push someone on a bike with good intentions. Do I think she meant to do an action that led to Celias death? No but that's also why she was charged with Manslaughter and not murder

Fine. Take the death out of it. Is it ok to take action against people you believe are in the wrong?

But, actually, you can't really take the death out of it because it is a direct result of someone taking action against a person they believed was doing something wrong. It's why vigilantism is a crime. You cannot go around "enforcing" the law as you see it.

There seems to be some doubt over what 'action' was actually taken though. To me a few harsh words and gestures are pretty low on the scale. Physical assault is something different though.

I was surprised by the sentence on first reaction, reading that she had (mild ) cerebral palsy and sight issues - I also thought it was illegal to ride on the pavement but apparently it isn't, even though this was a dual pathway anyway (but it's unclear on the video). But I think reading on here that she has never showed remorse, plus leaving the scene, is what gave her the sentence.

She’s an absolute horror of a woman.
Forcing the lady into a fuckin busy road that she could’ve seen and heard had oncoming traffic, shouting and swearing at her like some self appointed pavement patrol, seen a few comments saying Celia could’ve moved out of the way but the only direction imo was the road as AG was literally walking slap bang in the middle of the pavement. Then to just leave the scene and go shopping even though she knew what she’d done?!

The poor driver who has to live with this for the rest of her life, the witnesses who had to see it, poor Celia and her family. Not only has she shown no remorse she’s put several suffering and traumatised people through a trial and now will taunt them with an appeal.

She got off lightly with 3 years and I hope her appeal either gets thrown out or they increase her sentence. She’s disgusting and as another PP said, if it was a young male with a hoodie on in AG’s position there’d be calls for a murder charge.

As I've said before. I have no strong position in this.
@BrigitteBond I don't think anyone has a stronger position than you on this!
Arguing in AG (a killer's) defence across threads, finding excuses for her actions and seemingly defining her behaviours as understandable and that SHE'S the one who's been wronged!

Totally agree with this.

However I think people are more focused on the tragic outcome and the lack of care the pedestrian showed afterwards rather than the facts you outlined.

Also people are assuming that jurors make their decision only based on ‘all the facts’, they can also be swayed by the arguments of barristers. Perhaps this lady did not have a good defence.

Ultimately had she immediately stopped to assist the victim and shown remorse, she'd have likely not gone down for this.

It's very difficult to convince a jury someone's death by way of a tragic accident you didn't mean to happen when you literally watched them die and then walked away calmly. It's even more difficult if you then take the stand and don't show remorse for your actions.

The facts of the case are.

The woman unnecessarily (as in, was not forced to, had no actual need to) approached the cyclist shouting and swearing

The woman made contact with the cyclist to one degree or another, resulting in the cyclist taking an evasive manoeuvre/being pushed into the road. this is the only slight contention in the facts as presented.

The cyclist went onto the road and was hit by oncoming traffic. She died.

The woman walked away and continued her day without coming to the cyclists aid or offering assistance.

The woman, whether intentially or not, caused the death of another person through her intentional actions. Similar crimes can have similar punishment.- Death by dangerous driving is a good example where stupid actions having unintended consequences may well result in jail time.

but lobbing yourself into traffic because of that is hardly a proportional, predictable or understandable response.

Of all the victim blaming on these threads this is the coldest. I’m sure the cyclist would change her response if she hadn’t died.

Poor woman and her family.

There are lots of cases of manslaughter caused by people (usually young men) unable to direct their anger/anxiety and overreacting to the situation. For example, a single punch in a pub fight causing the death of the other person. Those people are in prison. I think you are trying to excuse this woman because she is an older female - are you also calling for all the young men in this situation to be excused the consequences of their actions?

I wonder what people would say if she had pushed a 7 year old into oncoming traffic because ‘cyclists shouldn’t be on the pavement’.

It was a vulnerable elderly woman, cycling at a slow pace on a shared path with plenty of space. You can see clearly from the video that AG had a lot of space to her right if she wanted to move over and create even more distance between herself and the bike.

Shocking that anyone can even attempt to defend AG particularly all that crap about it being the pandemic.

During the worst of covid yes people did behave differently, and if they felt vulnerable, they were the ones most likely to step back from others/ cross the road etc. That could not be more different to this scenario:

AG walks quickly towards the cyclist, swearing at her and gesticulating aggressively
AG makes no attempt to move to her right where there is clearly space to pass
AG admits she made contact with the cyclist (who the fuck wanted to touch a stranger during covid times?)
AG went off shopping while the woman lay dead/ dying and the car driver (who it appears had her young child with her) was traumatised
AG lied in police interviews (presumably she didn't realise the whole incident had been captured on cctv so thought she could give the police some bullshit)
AG showed no regret or remorse

How anybody can defend or even try to find reasons for the above is ridiculous.
And aside from everything I've summarised, the judge and jury will have heard extensive evidence, and the conclusion is that AG is guilty of manslaughter. Her actions have caused someone to die. A horrible, frightening death.

I hope AG's appeal is thrown out. Ideally she'd be in prison far longer than the paltry 18 months or so she'll probably serve.

they can also be swayed by the arguments of barristers. Perhaps this lady did not have a good defence.

Well yes, that is a barrister's job and the entire point of them being there. Still, I would dispute that Grey was not very ably defended.

If nobody had been hurt I’d still think yelling, swearing and waiving your arms about next to a busy road was dangerous and unacceptable. Your argument is very much like seeing dangerous driving that doesn’t result in an accident. Of course people judge.

Your posts on here really exaggerate how common this sort of overreaction is. I didn’t scream at anyone during Covid and didn’t personally see it either. I heard about it, sure, but I didn’t think it was reasonable or justified at the time. There is a minority of people who can’t or don’t control their reactions. See also fights breaking at in sales, road rage and so on. It’s not reasonable and when it results in injury or death it is rightly punished.

She made enough physical contact for the older woman to fall off her bike in the path of an incoming vehicle and die

It’s proper AG was jailed. She should have got longer though.
3 years for causing someone’s death is ridiculous.

She pushed her into traffic. She admitted making contact with her. What’s not appropriate? The fact she should have been given longer?

Yes, that post is awful, as well as aggravatingly pompous. It conjures up an image of a reckless cyclist riding along at high speed and putting the fear of god into innocent pedestrians. Whereas what the video shows is a pedestrian acting in a very threatening manner and reacting completely unnecessarily to something that posed no threat at all to her.

As for all the ‘control of her vehicle’ and ‘situational awareness’ nonsense, I imagine that if I was faced with something similar as a fellow pedestrian I might well have stepped out or fallen into the road - you’d hardly have time to weigh up all the different options as a much larger and visibly furious woman marches up to you. All very well pontificating about how this should have been handled when you aren’t faced with an angry and aggressive stranger.