How deprived do you have to be to move in a man into your home a day of ‘knowing’ him on Facebook? *[Content warning: concerns child abuse]

I was scared to click the link, and I kind of wish I hadn't. He's a piece of fucking shit. He deserves everything that baby went through, tripled, or more. I have a lot of empathy for a lot of people, never ever for this monster. Even an animal wouldn't do this.

I understand vulnerable women getting into very quick relationships, But
If he met her and moved in, in January (I might have the meeting date wrong?) She let him look after her baby after like, eight weeks, alone.

I think everyone's thinking the same as me, the mother must have been through some serious trauma/ and bad relationships to move a guy straight in after walking for a day on Facebook?!

not really much else to say, the mother sounds like she needs some help, not once did she ask the operater when the ambulance would get their or what she should do?? I'm so surprised so many instances of injuries were noted down before, and nothing happened. e

Then we have some of us on here scared to take our kids to A&E from falling off a trampoline or having one bruise from slipping. But we do anyway because we have nothing to hide. So, so tragic.

nothing to do with the choices made by the mother and murderer in the case in the OP - that was way beyond anything you experienced or described but I just wanted to say how much I appreciated your really honest insight into why a very young mother in vulnerable circumstances might make poor choices. I know you say that your children judge you for it. I hope they do this in a way that makes sure they will never put themselves into situations where they make those poor choices themselves. And children do judge their parents no matter how great we are. You sound really intelligent and gave a really interesting insight. Thank you.

Forget it OP. You cannot legislate against (or cure) stupidity.

Thank you so much. it was hard to write, a bit like a confessional but I felt I had some experience that might offer a perspective that people may be overlooking. I’m not making excuses but that was my genuine reason for moving quickly in relationships and I do think I can’t be alone. Im not naive though some single mothers won’t be thinking along those lines at all, far from it I know. Also i might be a bit out of date as I’m going back decades now. For the record my children seem to have broken the cycle of low attainment and young parenthood. My daughter is about to graduate and has had only one serious boyfriend who she met at uni and my boys haven’t got anyone pregnant, to the best of my knowledge anyway! All have achieved a higher standard of education than myself and all can and do cook decent meals for themselves ( I know how petty that last part sounds but it actually means a lot to me as at their ages I struggled with things like that, I mean I prepared food but they are regularly cooking decent meals from scratch :) )
Anyway I’m hopeful for them and think I eventually did something right. I have good relationships with them and I’m quietly glad they disapprove of some of my earlier choices as it means their heads are screwed on and I must have also had a hand in that (for better or for worse).

YANBU. I've been a single parent since I was 18 years old. 33 now and I've never had a bloke living in my home.

I don't have any sympathy for the mothers in these situations. The instinct to put my child first is far greater than the need to have a partner. Vulnerable or not, you are the adult in this situation, your CHILDREN are even more vulnerable.

Apologies for derailing slightly.
I’ve read the article, the mother was 30 so not a young mum by my standard.
Something has got to be up with her whether that’s mental health or drugs or low iq or even just sociopathy or a combination of the above I couldn’t confidently say. But I think most of us would get out of bed for if we heard a strangers child screaming out in pain, out of basic human concern, let alone our own child. Something is amiss.
This story is so shocking and I can’t imagine how totally abandoned and scared that little girl must have felt :(

Thank-you for your honest insight into why women allow men like this into their life.

Every time a case like this comes up I wonder why do we not have supported accommodation for vulnerable single mums.
A bit like sheltered housing for old people but maybe with a creche or something onsite so mums can get a break for a couple of hours.

Pre-Brexit I watched a new snippet of a mum who'd had kids taken into care, who went to France to give birth.
She knew her baby would be removed at birth if she stayed in the UK. But in France she was in supported accommodation.
Where she got support to look after her baby and they could keep an eye out for her child.

We know taking kids into care can damage kids even more. We know that many "looked after" girls will become very young mums without support. We know often the cycle repeats.

@RadiantFem I know what you mean I thought the same I was expecting the mum to be very young.
But she is reported to be a mum of 3 kids. And had a domestic violence worker who she'd never told about Beven.

I do think drugs must have been involved.

Are they assuming that Lola was screaming in agony? Could she have been in shock or unconscious?

@KettrickenSmiled 'it is MEN committing these acts'
Mostly yes but Star Hobson was murdered by her mother's girlfriend.

FFS with the whataboutery.

https://www.manchester.ac.uk/discover/news/findings-from-most-in-depth-study-into-uk-parents-who-kill-their-children
Overall, fathers were significantly more likely to kill their children than mothers, and were more likely to use violent methods of killing, have previous convictions for violent offences, perpetrate multiple killings, and have a history of substance misuse or dependence.

More generally, 97% of ALL UK violent crime is committed by men.
So your point is ...?

@KettrickenSmiled the point is parents should be careful who they bring into their home men or women.

I agree with this. I am in a support group for people who are childfree and because of that decision have had something bad happen to them eg family disowned them/been fired/been raped.

However, outside of this support we do chat more generally and obviously sometimes those topics are also around being childfree and I will only give one example of a conversation but there are many which are similar- a woman had been abused as a child, her mother through neglect, her father through physical and sexual abuse. She has never wanted children particularly but has decided she definitely won’t have them as her childhood has left her with some issues eg poor impulse control, violent and depressive tendencies, lack of boundaries, lack of self care/household care and similar and she knows she wouldn’t be able to care for a child properly and give the child a good upbringing. She has been told countless times that she should definitely have a child because she will be ‘fixed’ as soon as she has a child/she will just know what to do and be able to do it/she will love the child more than anything and that love will guide her and similar.

I don’t understand why people do this, she knows herself better than anyone, why try and convince someone who says they will be a poor parent to be a parent.

@Amy1234567 ' I am in a support group for people who are childfree and because of that decision have had something bad happen to them eg family disowned them/been fired/been raped.'

Are you saying they got raped, disowned or fired because they want to be childfree or are you saying they chose not to have children because they are traumatised from rape, disownment and job loss?

Children's homes are not the answer. There is a great deal of abuse there too.

People who are childfree for various reasons have had those things (or other horrible things) happen to them because of their decision to be childfree.

The example I gave above the woman chose to be childfree in part because of the effects of abandonment, sexual abuse and physical abuse but she wasn’t in the group because of that (The conversation about why she’d chosen not to have children and her being upset by people saying she should anyway was just a side conversation.), she actually joined the group to discuss being fired from her job for being childfree which is why I used being fired from a job as an example of why people joined the group, because it was on my mind as I was thinking about her.

@Amy1234567 that's absolutely appalling. The world has gone mad!

she actually joined the group to discuss being fired from her job for being childfree

Really?
Where did this happen, & under what circumstances @Amy1234567 ?

When this happens (how sad that it’s possible to talk about it as a regular occurrence) I always wonder why the child’s biological father never attracts even a tiny share of the blame. He gave a victim impact statement in this case.

I didn’t want to derail the thread because it’s obviously a very important one, so sorry if I have.

@KettrickenSmiled it’s not an uncommon situation, a lot of people who want some support on the group need to talk about work issues. This woman was let go from her job after being there less than two weeks as she was asked about children and grandchildren and said she didn’t have any and was told they only hire people with a family as otherwise they don’t have an incentive to work and would call in sick more or leave for something else when they felt like it. My husband has actually been told at an interview they only take on people with children for the same reason. At least he was told at interview though and didn’t start the job!

Absolutely agree with this. The cycle just goes on and on, their children have no good role models and go on to live the same lives. I don't know what we can do to stop it.

It is relevant though. There were a spate of horrifically violent high profile child deaths around the lockdowns, which was an inevitable consequence of shutting schools and suspending SW visits.

The lockdown were a gift to abusers - children’s charities and domestic abuse charities tried to say this at the time but people didn’t care provided they got to continue WFH/living on furlough.

Yes, people behave like this regardless of Covid, but suddenly removing the all oversight mechanisms put in place to stop them was never going to help, was it?

Break the cycle.

Put these families into supported accommodation.
Actually support the mums to stay off drugs and alcohol. Parenting classes.
Try to break the cycle.

I have a family member who has a very chaotic childhood. 4 siblings, multiple dads, mum married about 3 times but to non of the dads. My family member was kicked out in yr 11 when her mum chose violent partner of her child.

My family member looked to be following in her mums doorsteps, children, multiple partners, abuse. Thankfully she recognised the signs when youngest was still reasonably young and decided to stop dating. To work on herself and her children. I think she was single for 10 years and only recently started dating again but has taken it very slowly. We really worried that she could end up as one of these stories and so thankful she saw the light. Her oldest child has been messed up though as they experienced way more of a chaotic and abusive childhood than siblings, but seems to be settling down a bit now they are an adult.

I think quite often it is because that is all they have known themselves.

I remember ages ago reading something about one of the Scandinavian countries where they take the entire family in to care to teach parents how to parent while keeping the children safe.

But as a country we don't want to spend money on children and families.

I agree about the supported accommodation, rather than them being put into social housing. Somewhere where they are taught to look after their kids properly, including learning to cook and taught so they can get a job in future.

Men would be allowed to visit, but no access to bedrooms and not allowed to stay overnight.

many men attach themselves to vulnerable women to get accommodation and regard the kids as a nuisance.

I know a couple of young women too are employed to teach young females and try to get them into employment, but they usually come from ‘families’ as described above so it is an uphill struggle. But when a 6 year old knows every swear word in the book and then spits in your face, you are probably wasting your time.