to leave seven year old DD alone at home for short periods?

[firstaibu]

I've name changed for this as am fearing a flaming...

I'm not talking about leaving her for an evening or anything like that, but on several of occasions recently I've left her at home while I go to the supermarket. She didn't want to come with me, and I usually leave her sitting in the car reading when I go to the supermarket anyway. I lock the front door and she knows to ignore it if anyone knocks. She has the cordless phone and knows how to ring my mobile (she has repeatedly demonstrated this to me), and also how to ring 999. In an emergency, she could unlock the gate at the bottom of the garden to get out into the street. I phone her at least once while I'm out. She's seven and a half, and reasonably sensible; I'm confident that she just sits and reads, or plays the wii. I'm never gone more than an hour.

I know a lot of you will think I'm being very U, but is there anyone out there that does this too, or doesn't think I'm a horrendously neglectful parent?

Hmm by today's standards, maybe yabu.

But, when i was 7, I'd walk home from primary school alone and let myself into the house with a key that was attached to my school skirt with safety pin.

Nothing bad happened, even if it did, I would have known what to do ie phone police or relative. Suppose circumstancess in the family (which led me to being alone) made me very swtiched on and savvy. '

It wasnt great for me but there was no choice- so I guess thats different to the OPs child.

Either way- your decision really! Not sure why you are posting an AIBU thread on it...

7 is too young to be left alone. I don't even think there's room for debate on this.

There's no legal limit (though 12 is the recommendation) . You need to make a risk assesment - and if the child is considered left at risk - you're done for no matter the age. And of course if anything happened to your child not only would get be done for - you'll feel wretched (and not to meant how horrendous it would be for your child).
I personally think a child of that age shouldnt be left alone the way you're doing , sorry ! And as for her not wanting to come shopping - tough (to her that is). Thats life I'm afraid - kids go shopping with their mums and do various other unappealing things like tidy their bedroom (he he)
Please rethink your stance on this one - there's too many horrid characters out there. It just isnt worth it .

kodokan and ErnestTheBavarian it's interesting to hear about the different attitude in Switzerland and Germany; how wonderful that it's normal for children to walk around without the paranoia about abduction. There are several roads to cross to DD's school, and I'm not completely confident in her road sense yet; I watch her all the time to make sure she stops and looks, and she's good but not 100%. If I'm in the car in the morning then I drop her off and she walks the last 20m into school (other parents walk the child through the playground and into class), and I've seen other parents looking disapprovingly at me for doing that. I'm figuring she can find her way through the gate and into class by now! Takver it's astonishing how much expectations of children have changed over generations, isn't it. Even being a 'teenager' is a relatively recent concept.

DD has been getting herself up and watching tv/playing wii or reading for the last couple of years while I/we doze upstairs. She raids the fridge when she's hungry, which she learnt to do very early on - evidenced by finding teeth marks in the butter when she was 5yrs old..

Piscesmoon I do think it's sad that children have lost so many freedoms; I was recently reading about a book titled 'Last Child in the Woods - saving our children from nature-deficit disorder', in which he talks about the importance of children spending time free and unfettered in nature, and the damage to the psyche that can result when that doesn't happen.

ifancyashandy my DM told me when I was very young about flashers, and that the best thing to do was to laugh at them. Never saw one though! I think you're right that children learn how to judge and deal with risk by being exposed to it in manageable increments.

thesecondcoming that's a terrible story about your runner friend, but if my DD were fretting about where I was she would have rung my mobile, my DM or my DH.

I also wouldn't leave DD in the dark, or especially go out when she was asleep - what a horrible thought, to wake up and find herself unexpectedly alone.

"Not sure why you are posting an AIBU thread on it..." GiraffeYoga I did so because I felt a bit uneasy about leaving her, although on a logical level, the risks involved seemed incredibly small. I was interested to hear other people's opinions on it, and helped that would help me decide whether I felt comfortable to continue leaving her for short periods occasionally. I anticipated that a lot of people would think I was BVVU, but I've been really interested to see the debate that's ensued and how widely opinions differ, and also the wider questions raised about freedoms and independence for children.

"I must admit I find this a bit of a bizarre thread." But susia you then went on to contribute some interesting points!

booyhoo I think you're missing an interesting debate then, and you wouldn't have found that I was just justifying myself.

you felt uneasy because you know it is unreasonable to do it. i am not missing anything when i know the debate centres on two opinions, i know which one i hold. i dont need to hear the other side of it.

Seven seems a little young, but it is not shockingly young. I am shocked by the mention of children of 9 or even 12 that cannot walk to a shop and pay for something, or children of 11 who are only allowed alone for short periods with all the curtains drawn. Very sad.

you leave her cos she "didnt want" to go to the supermarket?!?! Does she get everything her own way?! Is that a good reason to leave a 7yo at home for an hour, possibly more if you are held up? There are many things that could delay you from getting home.

You keep saying things like "she would call me", but has she ever been in any situation where she is possibly in a panic or frightened, and been able to remain calm and make a rational decision? Just because she is sensible from day to day in normal situations, that does not mean she will react sensibly when under pressure.
You also say she will not answer the door to anyone, which is good, except are you sure she is not sitting at home frightened? What does she do if someone does come to the door? Does she hide in fear? Does she shout, "I cant come to the door, no-one is at home?" cos thats not ideal.

Also, if she is "able" to be at home for an hour, it will soon turn into "she'll be fine for an extra 20 minutes", which then gets longer and longer....

I went off my head at my stepfather for leaving my 5yo for approx 3 minutes to post a letter about 10 doors along.

you leave her cos she "didnt want" to go to the supermarket?!?! Does she get everything her own way?! Is that a good reason to leave a 7yo at home for an hour, possibly more if you are held up? There are many things that could delay you from getting home.

You keep saying things like "she would call me", but has she ever been in any situation where she is possibly in a panic or frightened, and been able to remain calm and make a rational decision? Just because she is sensible from day to day in normal situations, that does not mean she will react sensibly when under pressure.
You also say she will not answer the door to anyone, which is good, except are you sure she is not sitting at home frightened? What does she do if someone does come to the door? Does she hide in fear? Does she shout, "I cant come to the door, no-one is at home?" cos thats not ideal.

Also, if she is "able" to be at home for an hour, it will soon turn into "she'll be fine for an extra 20 minutes", which then gets longer and longer....

I went off my head at my stepfather for leaving my 5yo for approx 3 minutes to post a letter about 10 doors along.

Start getting your shopping delivered - it's easier for everyone.

I'm going to re-post my earlier answer to some of the points made, as the thread is now so long that people aren't reading it all (understandably) and are asking the same questions.

"Whew, so many replies! I'm really glad that there's such a variety of views and experiences (rather than just outright condemnation grin ), and thanks to everyone for all your points.

To answer a few points...

Why don't I take her into the supermarket with me, but usually leave her in the car? Mainly because she whinges and asks for stuff the whole way round if she comes in - we have a particular 'issue' at the moment about her obsession with shops and buying things for the sake of it. I know that if I leave her in the car she will have her nose absolutely buried in a book. She's happier, I'm happier. Obviously I wouldn't do that if it were too hot in the car, and in fact the reason for leaving her at home on two of the occasions was that it was really hot and she wouldn't have been comfortable in the car. I acknowledge that there are small risks in her sitting in the car, but a supermarket car park seems a very unlikely place for the abduction of a very loud and confident child. I'm a fast shopper and would never let 'an hour stretch into two'. If she's in the car then I'd be a maximum of half an hour, if at home then probably more like 45 - 50 mins.

Regarding the boundaries issue... she doesn't get away with much at all! I'm very firm with her on lots of things (have to be grin ) and she gets told 'no' on a very regular basis - there are legions of things she has to do that she doesn't want to! I know that she doesn't feel scared to be left, as some of you were, in fact, she's always pushing to be left at home when we go out to walk the dog (the answer's always no), and to be allowed to go out on her own "on an adventure" or "to run away, but only for half an hour" (the answer's always no, although we did let her go to the local shop once, with DH following a bit behind her grin ).

She wouldn't make toast, so no knife in the toaster. I lock the front door with a key, so she couldn't open it, and she knows to ignore the door if there's a knock. As I said before, the layout of the house is such that she can exit into the garden from the living room and stairs. Her falling down the stairs is a good point, actually. Coll2010; you make some very good points, and this is why I felt uneasy about doing it.

I've left her at home on three occasions. The first time was actually just to nip to a shop just up the road - I was gone for twenty minutes. I didn't have any concerns about leaving her as she was engrossed in a book and I knew she'd remain so. I still drilled her with all the safety stuff though. The other two times have been for me to go to the supermarket a mile away, and I chose to do so because it was so hot. Normally, if I take her with me to the supermarket (rather than going while she's at school), it's because we go to the library for her to get new books (parking in the supermarket car park), then I leave her in the car reading them while I do the shopping. I park near the store entrance, and tbh, if there was a problem, she would come into the shop and go to the service desk. I don't feel unreasonale doing this, but maybe I've done an aibu by stealth here grin grin .... aibu to leave my 7.5 yr old in the car with her nose stuck in a book while I go into the supermarket (weather permitting)??

Thanks Seeker, Cory and Piscesmoon for emphasising that it's not all cut and dried, and that whilst there's always the chance of something awful happening, we can't let our lives be ruled by the fear of it.

On balance, it's certainly not something I would want to make a habit of doing, and would probably only do it again if my neighbour were in and aware that DD were on her own (she'd hear any falls, thumps or screams). The supermarket car park is another matter though... grin "

Why do you ban the children from answering the phone by the way?

Firstaibu - I don't have an answer, but this is a most interesting thread that has made me question some of my own attitudes.

I have let my DD (10) walk by herself to a holiday playscheme 10 minutes or so away with a busy road to cross, and have let her go to the corner shop alone (on each occasion taking a phone with her) but have never left her alone in the house for more than 5 mins to post a letter.

I can't say I felt massively keen on letting her out by herself but DH is very pro-independence and she has got a real sense of achievement from it.

I guess I've never left her in the house because I felt I wasn't 'allowed' to, by custom if not by law, though letting her out alone is arguably a lot more dangerous.

I will ask her what she thinks about this. She put herself to bed last night as DH and I needed to finish painting a skirting board for new carpet arriving today. She makes a mean cup of tea (though I drove myself nuts with worry the first time she did) and has cooked us toad-in-the-hole. I often point out to her (usually when trying to get her to tidy her room) that there are millions of children in the world who have to support an entire family at her age. Maybe I have answered my own question.

WidowWadman I don't ban DD from answering the phone - she's on it like a cat on a rat whenever it rings!

"this is a most interesting thread that has made me question some of my own attitudes."

LadyWellian it's made me think about a lot of the wider issues around safety versus independence too. I'm really pleased that people have contributed such a wide range of experiences and opinions.

Didn't mean you personally firstaibu, I think you're totally nbu anyway. But there's plenty of mention of locking doors, drawing curtains and instructions to not answer the phone which just seem alien to me.

I'd feel much happier leaving her at home than in the car tbh.

I don't think being over protective and never letting kids out of sight is healthy for parent or child. they need to develop a confidence in their own abilities and an independence to function without an adult being constantly by them. I don't find that healthy.

"Why don't I take her into the supermarket with me, but usually leave her in the car? Mainly because she whinges and asks for stuff the whole way round if she comes in - we have a particular 'issue' at the moment about her obsession with shops and buying things for the sake of it. I know that if I leave her in the car she will have her nose absolutely buried in a book. She's happier, I'm happier."

she will not get out of this habit of buying for the sake of buying by sitting in the car. far better to take her with you and remain firm when she whinges. yes it is annoying but she has to face the situation so she knows how to deal with it. avoiding the shop just delays the behaviour until teh next time she does go in.

Shop on line and spend that hour doing something together instead and avoid all that angst.

We all consider leaving our children, but the stress of being away for one hour (or even more if anything goes wrong with the car etc) is not worth it.

10/11 is probably the time to start leaving them for very short periods this prepares them for the lone commute to senior school.

OP, i started leaving my DD and DS alone in the car while i went into the supermarket to do small/medium shops, into post office, running into work to collect papers etc, when they were... think it wass 9/7? the car was locked, and they never got abducted. i wouldnt have left them at home if i was leaving the street until the eldest was 10 though.
because at 11 they both started walking to and from school on their own. i met someone recently who was GOBSMACKED i let them do this. "what if something happened?!" she screeched.
"you do know that adults get abducted too right? and that 11 they both had their own phones and to be brutally honest, i had work to get to so they needed to learn i wasnt going to ferry them around everywhere, they needed the excercise and independance"
is what i would have said if i was feeling wordy. what i actually said was
"um, why would an abductor choose my crazy kids?"

not a proud response...

Hi,

my initial reaction to this thread was that you are being very very unreasonable, but that was based on me rather than you iyswim.

My dd is 5yo and I admittedly am very precious and overprotective of her and my ds (nearly 4yo) and I can't imagine myself leaving her in the house alone until she's about 10, at least!

But as others have no doubt said - you know your little girl better than any of us and only you can make the call whether you leave her alone in the house or not. But what would your reaction be if something happened, however unlikely the situation.

I don't think you are neglecting your child, and I don't think you are a bad parent so please don't feel that. At some stage we're all going to be faced with this decision and its not easy.

My sister and I were left on our own from quite an early age and we generally just watched TV and dressed up in our parents clothes . However something bad did happen once (something really bad) which would not have occured if an adult were present. Even with this in mind I think bad stuff like this is very rare. I also think that each child is different and you can't put an age on maturity - they are ready when they are ready. Perhaps your 7 year old is ready when some 10 YOs are not.

without reading all the posts - in lots of other europian countries it is absolutely normal and common to leave children of this age at home for even longer periods then a supermarket trip. just hope nothing ever happens as then i think you might be sued for neglect in the uk. so i do not think YOU are beeing unreasonable, but general thinking in the uk IS.

I think that you are the only person to know your daughter and know how she is likely to behave. My brother and I were left in the house alone from around that age, and TBH, far safer to leave one child than two - the things we used to get up to!
I was left in sole charge of a riding school on infrequent Saturdays by the time I was 15. Nothing to do with age, all to do with experience and capability. Some seven-year olds will be perfectly responsible, and some won't, that's all there is to it.

Have only read about half the thread, but I agree with Oblomov and Seeker: YANBU.

You know your own child.

At 7, ds (an very sensible boy) was being left on occasion while dh came to pick me up from work or drop me off at the airport - probably a 40 minute round trip. Ds was left watching CBBC and with the front door locked (Yale, so he knows how to get out) and instrctions not to answer the phone unless it is us or his aunt.

He is now 9 and we will now leave him for longer periods - especially whe we go to Homebase (his particular pet hate).

Next step is to teach him how to unlock the door from the outside , ie how to use a key.

He started walking to school on his own when he was 7, although at that time we used to follow him 80% of the time. It's a 10-15 minute walk. This year he has been walking to and from school on his own (beacsue he no longer goes to After School Club) and when there are after school activities, this means he is crossing some roads wthout a lollipop man. He is also now going to the local grocery store on his own for messages (Scottish for "a small amount of shopping").

It's all a gradual build up.

He is now desparate to cycle to school on his own - but has to tolerate us cycling with him until we are confident that he is sufficiently safe on the road (in particular, looking over his shoulder before positioning to turn right) and can lock the bike up properly himself.

Our role as parents is to teach them the skills to become independent. I try to give ds the same opportunities I had when I was young in the 60s - which included going to ballet classes on my own by train from age 9. Unfortunately, society's expectations no longer allow him all the freedom I had - but I do my best.

I agree that it is far safer to leave one than 2.

MillyR said
'Seven seems a little young, but it is not shockingly young. I am shocked by the mention of children of 9 or even 12 that cannot walk to a shop and pay for something, or children of 11 who are only allowed alone for short periods with all the curtains drawn. Very sad.

and I agree fully. Many 7 yr olds are simply not ready-you know your 7 yr old. However it is really sad if an 11 yr old can't be left or sent to the shop. Certainly by 16 yrs I would be very worried if they got spooked. I used to babysit as a job at 16yrs and if they were going to be very late I stayed the night. With parental consent they can be married at 16yrs-not something I would recommend but I have a friend whose parents were married at 16 yrs and had three DCs by 20 yrs-all are sane sensible member of society and the parents are still happily married.
People need to get a sense of proportion. If they can't go shopping by themselves how are they going to get 2 trains, involving a change to go on a university open day? If you decide they can't possibly handle this-you will have to take them-you have to bare in mind that they will be alone and coping in a strange city 12 months later! All too little ,too late IMO. Start with popping around to a neighbour for 5 mins and not taking them -and work up.