Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To make DH choose between us and old family?

589 replies

WashwithCare · 08/01/2010 21:39

DH previously had a 10 yr living together relationship with a woman who already had 2 kids from 2 different dads. Children were 1 and 3 when she moved in with DH. They do not see their own fathers and call DH dad.

DH left his ex when we met (bit of a whirl wind romance) and 6 mths later, we married. I'm expected our first baby this month.

DH tried to be reasonable, and let his ex-gf stay in his house. He is a super high earner, and also paid child support at well above CSA rates, and more besides. HIs ex is always demanding more money, despite the fact that he is not he kid's father, and they weren't married.

Last 2 years have been a nightmare re his old family. His ex turns up screaming on teh door step, kids scream abuse at me - and oldest has now started stealing stuff from our house. Contact is patchy, and mum either changes arrangemetn at last minute, so expensive hols, show tickets etc are lost or literally dumps the kids on our doorstep.

She hasn't worked in years, and has made no attempt to train or find work.

I have had enough. I am seriously considering telling DH (and I do love him so much) that it't either them or me.. Unless he evicts them from his house, has no further contact and stops any more payments, I will walk!

Am I being unreasonable?

OP posts:
thesecondcoming · 10/01/2010 10:37

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Judy1234 · 10/01/2010 10:42

The person who strays and leaves their responsibilities is the person at fault not the person they ended up with. But if a man bonds with chidlren from age 1 to 3 and then leaves you of course have to expect he will do the same to you when you have children with him so many women avoid such men like the plague if they have sense.

Harriedandflustered · 10/01/2010 10:50
Judy1234 · 10/01/2010 11:41

(Didn't see that at the time. Was too busy being a working parent but I saw the reports in the press. The best mothers work full time. We have the highest best, highest IQ and therefore also have better psychological skills in terms of knowing how to bring up children; the housewives who failed at work and never earned much and didn't get very good exam results at school not surprisingly aren't much good at bringing up chidlren either)

WashwithCare · 10/01/2010 11:55

Oh dear... it was a good plan, I thought.. but doesn't look like a runner....

H emailed his ex details of his proposals yesterday afternoon... not really expecting an immediate response, so not surprised to hear nothing....

Anyway, this morning she obviously opened it, and immediately phoned and left a 4 minute abusive ranting msg on DH's voicemail. In which she says, amongst other things that DH and I are trying to manipulate her, that he is forcing her out of her home, as he isn't providing the money to enable her to stay in it, that he obviously wants the kids to starve etc etc.

About 30 minutes later (without anything further from us) an email reply arrived - it was about 3 pages long. This was most impressive - perhaps she can get a job as a copy typist

This one said that she would be withdrawing the children from school and moving away to start her new life and he would never see the children again. Bizarrely it also refered to my DD as a "spoiled b**tch in training" - you'll remember she is only 3.

We were still reading it, when a mutual friend (more her mate tbh) arrived, very sheepish - said that DCs were crying and wanted the things that they had left at our house and that we wouldn't return WTF! DC have their own rooms in (actually, I know we are married - but it is MY HOUSE - I bought it with MY MONEY that I earnt before I even met DH).. anyway, I digress - they each have a room full of stuff..

So not wanting to seem unhelpful, we showed the friend up to the bedrooms, and asked what he wanted to take... I mean you would need a transit.. they don't exactly go short.. so it was surreal...

So I packed up a few bits and pieces that I thought they would most likely want, and he left with that....

Just feeling all a bit shell-shocked tbh.

I personally think she is just going for the full deal... she wants the school bills, the house and the spending money... and she is calling his bluff! DH is livid - I have never seen him so angry. He has just said - fair enough, if she wants no money and no contact that's her call. Don't know if he'll calm down later and think better of it.

OP posts:
bronze · 10/01/2010 11:58

wwc have been following the thread. I'm glad your dh has done all this. I could sense the relief in your post. I hope it goes smoothly from now on

StrictlyKatty · 10/01/2010 12:03

I can't help thinking this is very similar to the Jordan/Peter Andre saga. She was happy enough to have Harvey call him Dad and have no contact with his real Dad but when they split she won't let P.A see him as much as the others and he has no right over Harvey but still loves him and wants to spend time with him....

curiositykilledhaskittens · 10/01/2010 12:04

Macdoodle - I was talking about the impression the OP had given me about the XP in this situation. I never said anything about all women/men/XPs/singleparents/whatever other words you want to put in my mouth.

My point is that the situation appears to have been poorly managed by both the XP and the DH. The DH seems kinder than the XP but I'm sure that is because it is his wife who is writing about the situation. Neither the DH or the XP are the ones who matter in this situation, it is the DCs and, taking the OP at face value (which is all you can do) I can't see how the XP can be doing a great job at helping her children have contact with their fathers as the biological dads appear to have no contact or interest and she is poor in her relations with the DH (for whatever reason). I have not said she is a terrible person just that I think, from the information given, she doesn't really want the children to have a father.

I agree with dr and nikki. Just because someone has hurt you is absolutely no excuse for using (hurting) your children by speaking to the children in the way the OP has described and emotionally manipulating them in the way described. I think it is unnacceptable for the children to be abusing the OP and the responsibility for this can only lie mainly with the XP as she, really, is their only parent and maybe, secondarily with the DH for managing his side of things poorly.

It is completely pointless speculating how this would sound from the POV of the XP as this question is from the POV of the OP.

I have two children with a man who emotionally, psychologically, financially and sexually abused me for several years. My second child is the result of him raping me when I was refusing to sleep with him after I had caught him with the girl he's just broken up with. He was sleeping with her from when our son was 4 months old, he told her we were not together and I was a mental stalker who couldn't get over him and told me when I caught him that she was the same. He eventually left me for her (hoorah!) but in the process the police had to be called because he had started to be physical with me. I suspected he was cheating on me throughout our 'relationship' but found out later he had slept with over 20 people during 3 years including all my female friends bar 1 he had also stolen from my family and blamed it on me without my knowledge so that I had no relationship with them.

He used his family to abuse me too, during our relationship and after. After he left he used the police, his family, his friends and the court system to attack and intimidate me. I was frightened to leave the house for a whole year. He denied paternity of the second child, spent a long time and a lot of effort convincing everyone that I was preventing him from seeing his child and that I was a liar to the extent people would follow me shouting and swearing if I ever went into town to get shopping. I had to get shopping delivered and was too afraid to walk half a mile (in the opposite direction to town) to my mum's (started building the relationship after he left and we discovered the truth) so she had to come pick me up every day as I was also scared of being in the home he had left but couldn't move because of the old HB system and me being on benefits.

In the end I went to Sefton Womens and Children's aid who are most fantastic. Everything improved from there. They encouraged me to go to the police about some, what looked like but wasn't in the end, dodgy underage porn I found on his PC and about him harrassing me. They helped support me through court and counselling. In the end the judgement of the court was that the second child was proven to be his after a DNA test and that I had never been obstructive to him having contact and that the whole case was a waste of the court's time as it should have been dealt with in mediation which initially (while he was harrassing me) was innapropriate but after that he refused to attend.

I have only once told him he was couldn't come to see the children. That was after her had taken us through court for 2 years and still been unreliable in coming to his choice of arranged contact and had decided a couple of hours before pick up that he didn't want to have them overnight. I had not wanted him to have them overnight, he had pushed for it and I had been pushed into a corner by the court over agreeing to it. He had done it once and decided he didn't want to do it again. So I told him he had to stick to the order the court had made for contact and if he was choosing to break it I was not willing to make another one without mediation because I felt we were unable to sort out a satisfactory arrangement from the children's POV without help. This was basically the same as saying he couldn't see them because he flatly refused to comply with the court arranged contact and we had to wait for him to contact mediation as the last 2/3 times I had contacted them I had gotten childcare to go for the interview and then they had been unable to contact him to go for his interview - basically he didn't answer any of his phones to them or respond to their letters.

I have always tried to facilitate contact with his children and to make it a good experience for the children too. I have done my best to help him to provide something stable for them. I had to put my feelings about him and his new g/f (who he has just split up with) to bed for several years as the children loved her and she very kindly cared for them while she was with him - which I appreciated. After we had split up he had egged her on to pretend to drive her car at me when I was crossing the road with DS in the pram 5 months pregnant with DD, so I had a lot of feelinggs about her caring for them initially and she had to prove herself. The things he did to me/said about me and the children were truly awful but now 4 years on we are able to get on well, I have found myself feeling sorry for him and the help and leeway I give him over the children comes more naturally now.

You don't have to be bitter, paranoid and hurtful just because someone has shat on you from a great height - pardon my french! Lol. It is much harder to be forgiving and kind but it is what you should do for your children's sake because they are likely to love their other parent just as much as they love you. To me I see it as a success that they love their dad they way they do, I don't want them to hate him, I don't want to hate him even though we all have reason enough to. Things are relatively harmonious now, I have married someone new and we have 9 week old twins. XP has been diagnosed with BPD and is struggling but I don't mind helping him to keep his head above water. The children are happy and secure in all their relationships and even though they only see XP for 2 hours every month or so atm they still call him dad and not my husband who has been around since they were 1 and 2 (3 and 4 now). We have spoken about DH adopting them, he is keen, and XP is not against the idea as he doesn't want legal responsibility for the children but wants to be sure DH is sticking around before he signs them over. I will never deny XP contact, even if DH adopts them eventually, they'll always see XP.

nickschick · 10/01/2010 12:07

Xenia .

curiositykilledhaskittens · 10/01/2010 12:13

xenia - 'Didn't see that at the time. Was too busy being a working parent but I saw the reports in the press. The best mothers work full time. We have the highest best, highest IQ and therefore also have better psychological skills in terms of knowing how to bring up children; the housewives who failed at work and never earned much and didn't get very good exam results at school not surprisingly aren't much good at bringing up chidlren either'

Are you being serious?

StrictlyKatty · 10/01/2010 12:15

What does 'Highest best' mean?!

acatcalledfidget · 10/01/2010 12:15

WWC - Ugh, what a horrible weekend for you and the kids, you have my total sympathy. I hope DH stands his grounds so that this woman realises that you can not be bullied. I also hopes she realises that damage that her manipulative behaviour is doing to her DC.....though it sounds like she won't....being as she see's that being given a house rent free is being driven out of it!?!

WashwithCare · 10/01/2010 12:15

Xenia - I assume you are joking?

I'm not aware of any correlation between IQ and a mother's working hours. Tax credits make it possible to pay for formal childcare on very low wages, whilst other lowly paid mums make use of free informal childcare.
Most of the professional women I know choose to work part-time.

Evidence suggests that a well educated mother who works full time is unlikely to be as much of an advantage to her children as an educated mum who works pt or is a SAHM.

Maternal education tends to be a key determinant for many "good parenting" skills - e.g. if your mother is well educated, you are more likely to get more qualifiacations youself, and less likely to be obese etc. However, studies show that once little children (under 5s) spend more than 40 hours in formal childcare, the benefits that should come with their educated mother are eroded...

The same is (interestingly) true, in that if you place a child with bad parents in nursery for 40 hours plus, they are better off than they would be at home.. So nursery is a great leveller -

So the inverse of your post is true - if you are a well educated Mum, it would be best for your children if you work a few hours or not at all. If you as thick as a short plank, and live in a household afflicted by drugs, alcohol or violence - get your LO in nursery fulltime...

Oh dear - I think I am hijacking my own thread.....

OP posts:
curiositykilledhaskittens · 10/01/2010 12:45

WWC - lol at hijacking your own thread. Sorry for her response too and sorry for hijacking also!

I hope it works out but I suspect she's trying for the money she's used to. She may relent and let the DCs see DH but she may just move on to someone else. At least he can still provide a place for them to come and some money for their support. I think if I was him I would be tempted to make sure I explained those two things - that they knew where he was and that the door was always open no matter what.

WashwithCare · 10/01/2010 12:48

Better add, before I get flamed to a crisp - it has to be a really, really dysfunctional home before nursery is better than staying at home with Mum!

OP posts:
WashwithCare · 10/01/2010 12:50

Curisoity - that's a terrible time you've been through too - I'm really sorry - it sounds like you have behaved bravely though, and it is paying off for you! Assume that your new husband is much nicer than no 1!

Onwards and upwards eh!

OP posts:
curiositykilledhaskittens · 10/01/2010 12:54

WWC - New husband is the best husband and father anyone could ever imagine. It is paying off, onwards and upwards is right!

Lol also at 'flamed to a crisp' - not sure they could do any worse than they did at the beginning! You're fairly brave to still be around and pleasant in your responses!

bronze · 10/01/2010 13:09

Oh Xenia, how I have missed you.

Harriedandflustered · 10/01/2010 13:16

ROFL at WWC assuming Xenia is joking. I too have missed you, Xenia.

diddl · 10/01/2010 13:55

OP what is your husband going to do?

eaudevie · 10/01/2010 15:12

Cripes! ExP sounds somewhat unhinged - how is in the best interests of the children to remove them from school at which they are presumably settled and away from the house that they are used to living in?

She's cutting off her nose to spite her face, and it could all backfire spectacularly.

As someone pointed, your DH has no legal responsibility for those children. He clearly feels an emotional tie to them after 10 years of parenting, but he has no recourse to the courts to make her come to acceptable contact arrangements and any financial plans he puts in place are voluntary.

I hope she comes to her senses, as if she really hasn't worked, then she's going to be hard pushed to find a job in this economic climate, that will enable her to continue to live in the way that she has become used to.

I'm not sure there is much that you can do - you've got a baby on the way, a small child to look after, and that's stressful enough in itself.

The settlement that your DH has proposed seems very sensible, (and generous), so I'd encourage him to stick to his guns. The children need some stability and boundaries; they sound unhappy enough as it is.

KerryMumbles · 10/01/2010 15:14

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

bronze · 10/01/2010 15:18

km no she didnt, tis sorted reasonably
just leave it chuck

catsmother · 10/01/2010 15:43

Looks like Curiousity's post at 9.32 has been somewhat borne out by the exP's kneejerk reaction once she read WWC's DP's proposal ..... which any normal person would think considerate and generous.

Totally agree with Curiousity ..... unless there is actual danger to the kids should they continue seeing their dad, a responsible mother does NOT obstruct contact, bad mouth the father and tell lies, regardless of the issues between the 2 adults. I'm glad you were big enough to think of your kids 1st and ensure that their self esteem was maintained. IMO, kids set great store by how their parents are perceived and telling them their dad is a shit will make no difference to him being a shit (or not) but probably will make the kids feel shitty and upset about themselves - what child wants a "shit" for a dad after all ?

The ExP is showing her true colours I think ..... her stance now, taking them out of school, disrupting education, moving away (from friends and the area they know) and presumably preventing them from seeing the man who brought them up for years (so dad effectively) is going to do them huge damage. I'm guessing that HE will be blamed for HER decision if she sees this through, and she, and her kids, will be cast (by her) as "victims". She has obviously already started to look for sympathy by lying to mutial friends and saying that the children have been prevented from getting their things. Chances are the children have been lied to as well and no doubt told that the man they thought of as dad doesn't care etc etc.

Seems to me that what SHE cares about is handbag spending money. Why the hell she can't work, even part time, if she's able bodied and her kids are in FT school, to pay day to day bills when she has a home rent free (oh sorry, I forgot about the £1 for a moment) and her kids are getting a private education she doesn't have to provide a penny towards.

Sorry, her reaction - which is going to have huge effects on her kids, is totally indicative of her using her ExP for all she could get out of him. The kids don't seem to be her 1st concern at all.

2rebecca · 10/01/2010 16:00

I still wonder where these kids' real biological dads are though. They seem to have got off lightly, or have been chased away by mum.
The main problem here is the kids' lack of continuity with their real dads, and a man who does have parental responsibility looking out for them and staying in their lives.
If my husband and I split up then my kids wouldn't be without a father figure because they know who their dad is and he would still be in their lives.
This shows the folly of pretending a stepparent who you don't even marry is the same as a biological parent.
If the relationship breaks down it all goes very pear shaped.

Swipe left for the next trending thread