Can you really be in a committed relationship yet still sleep with other people?

[notanumber]

I am a regular and I haven't namechanged, so it would me nice if we could sidestep any troll accusations.

I've been pondering this since reading the interview with George Michael in last weekend's Guardian.

Michael seems like a slightly troubled but very likeable man. He has been with his boyfriend Kenny Goss for a very long time and as such they are one of Celebrity Royalty's fêted couples.

However, Michael -in this interview and previously - has made clear that he routinely has sex with other people (clearly this is with Goss' consent or at least knowledge).

Now if they're happy, that's fine, I don't have a problem with someone having multiple sexual partners if that's their thing. I just find it very hard to buy that a couple can have this kind of understanding and for their relationship to be really truly committed.

It is hard work being committed to someone, and being sexually faithful is a big part of what makes it hard. The pay-off though (in my opinion), is a truly deep, fulfilling committed relationship. Basically, can someone be 'the one' if you routinely shag other people?

Of course, it's none of my bloody business what George Michael (or anyone else for that matter) does with his willy for fun. I'm not judging casual sex.

I would also like to stress that this is nothing to do with homosexuality for me - I'd feel similarly about a heterosexual couple who portray themselves as deeply committed yet regularly sleep with other people. I would be asking the question, well are you really that bloody committed then?

It really really isn't me being icky about anal sex. I don't get why someone would want a fist up their fanjo either, but this would in no way make me question their commitment to their relationship if it was something they only ever did with their partner.

So what do you think?

Yes I do think you can be in a committed relationship, yet still have sex with other people. At one time I would have said definitely no, but I find I'm getting more opened minded with age.

I know a few people in polygamous and polyamorous relationships and it seems to work for them. They all say the same thing, you have to be completely honest at all times and communicate. TBH the tri (1m 2f) relationship I know best works really well and they have no secrets and talk about everything.

It works for some but not for others.

DoesNotShareWellWithOthersTiggaxx

I have friends who are very open about the fact that they are swingers. Apparently it spicers up their love life. it is all done with consenting adults and they get a real buzz out of it.

They have been married for 15 years! Adore each other, do lots of romantic things togehter and then every now and then go to a club and shag strangers.

Doesnt really float my boat but I can see how people do it AND stay committed.

It seems to work for some people but would absolutely not work for me. I would not be with someone who needed extra sexual encounters outside of our relationship.

Men, in general, have a different view about casual sex than women anyway, not getting so hung up about it and able to seperate sex from love and see it as purely a bodily need rather than an emotional one.

I think that it is more acceptable and accepted therefore, in a male homosexual relationship than a female one or heterosexual ones.

Personally, monogomy is very important to me.

I couldn't, but other people clearly can, there isn't any one should really.

These people may well be able to kid themselves that they're truly committed to each other, but in reality what they are saying to their partner is " you are not enough for me sexually and I need sex with other people". If the partner can accept that then they must feel the same way or not be that into their partner.

It wouldn't be good enough for me, sex for me is a physical and spiritual bond that strengthens a marriage, it's made cheap and meaningless if you are sharing yourself out like a bag of chips.
The saddest thing I ever heard from a swinger was that the sex they had with their husband was always "vanilla" missionary because it was different from the DP/anal/kinky stuff they did with other people - that's just so grim and horrible.

These people must have pretty low self esteem if they are willing to accept not being quite good enough for their partner to stay faithful - it's still infidelity regardless of whether or not it's consenting.

It depends on if your definition of committed relationship includes monogamy.

I don't get it either.
Its having your cake and eating it too.
But each to their own I say.

There is an excuse that men use when they want to have sex with people other than their long term partners - that men just don't do monogamy, look at men in gay relationships, they seem to have several sex partners on the go at once.

I have 3 very differing responses to this amongst my acquaintance - one gay couple who have been together 30+ years and are completely monogamous and always have been, and one gay couple who have been together for 15 or so years who regularly shag around (in full knowledge of partner). Both couples appear happy with their lot.

The third couple have been together for years. One partner shagged around a lot in the past, but claims is completely monogamous now (could also be that he's nearly 70 and just can't be arsed ) His partner has never shagged around, and used to get very depressed when his other half was off enjoying himself.

I guess that doesn't help

The only way I see it really working is where the couple are both truly bisexual so they can have a bit of both.

Am I right in thinking that bisexual people normally "end up" with a same sex partner though, especially men?

Yanbu - sleeping around is not committment.

If both partners have agreed that the are sexually exclusive, then their commitment includes that.

If they have agreed that their sexual relationship will differ from the norm, and neither partner was under duress in agreeing to that, then I see no reason why it wouldn't be a bar to commitment.

The converse would be couples who don't have sex - I believe you can be committed and not have sex. Would so many people have a problem with that idea I wonder.

It is only where one person is going against what the other person wants, steps outside their agreement, does it in secret, that it goes against commitment.

I think that you would have to be very secure in yourself and your relationship for it to work.

I know that I couldn't do it as I could not bear to think of my man shagging someone else. No matter how 'committed' he was to me, I would always be wondering if he would find something better and then do the off. So an insecure person would end up a mess IMO!

As a side story, one of my best mates said that he could handle his partner cheating on him (they do not have an open relationship) as long as the other man is better looking than him!!! If the guy was ugly then he would be very offended and hurt.... wtf?!

I don't buy this rubbish that people who swing etc. are "secure", I'd say they are the polar opposite - vain, neurotic, always looking for the ego boost of someone fancying them - if that's security they are welcome to it .

Security means the knowledge that you are good enough to fulfill all your partner's sexual needs, why do people settle for being one of many?

Malificence, of course they are all that (imo), but if they reckon that they are in a committed relationship with someone they love, they must be secure that that relationship is a staple and they are not going to lose it. Therefore, secure in themselves that they are enough to keep each other, whilst fucking about and possibly stumbling across someone better (I am not very articulate and do not express what I want to say well, sorry!)

If they really do 'love' their partner that is...

I can't understand it myself, and I would be really hesitant to believe that a relationship is all that these people say it is if they still need to get kicks elsewhere.

I have pondered this one, mostly when trying to understand my gay friends! I have come to the conclusion that gay men are simply in another category. I have seen the most committed, loving, stable, long term relationships where they both sleep with others for fun and it doesn't seem to affect their realtionship. I have never observed this working in a hetero couple - as others have said there does seem to be insecurity involved in that case.

I am aware that I am generalising terribly! But a gay friend once said to me that gay relationships are different because it is what men would behave like if they really could do exactly what they wanted, without the "civilising" influence of women to spoil the party!

i think there must be something missing in your relationship if you need to seek sex elsewhere

does seem that gay men are more open/sleep around when in a relationship - saying that justin+colin have been together 20+years and never been unfaithful

It's a difficult one this though, isn't it?

Because I fear that I am treading dangerously close to saying that (some? The majority? The representation I see in the media? The small cross-section that I know personally?) gay men cannot have committed relationships. Or that these relationships are not as committed as monogamous (homo or hetero) relationships.

But then... I know that I am very sceptical of heterosexual relationships which include swinging. I just can't accept that real honest commitment involves anything other than giving yourself to someone totally and forgoing anyone else.

I mean, if you have sex with several people, what it is that makes your partner special and different? Sex is what distinguishes our partners from our friends. My closest friend has known me for years and is privy to all my emotional clutter. We laugh together, she's got me through tough times, I love being with her. My DH does all of these things plus I have sex with him - it's what makes him different from a friend.

I don't class myself as homophobic at all, yet it seems that this train of logic is pushing me towards saying that (some) homosexual relationships are not as...valid? not right, can't find the word I want...as heterosexual relationships (which largely, are monogamous ? or at least infidelity is not open and celebrated in the same way)

I feel as though it would be wrong of me to excuse (for lack of a better word) behaviour from the homosexual community that I condemn (again, for lack of a better word) from the heterosexual community. That strikes me as not only patronising but sloppy and lazy reasoning.

Of course, I cannot make sweeping generalisations about an entire minority group as though they all behave in identical ways with identical thought processes and relationships. I am very aware that there are certainly plenty of totally monogamous homosexual couples, and it is of course ridiculous of me to claim that they are not committed.

I have absolutely no idea what percentage of homosexual couples are not monogamous (and why should I? What they get up to in the bedroom department is none of my business) but it does seem as though this is far more prevalent and accepted than in the heterosexual community. And I have to say that I do find it hard to accept that this proportion of the community have relationships which I would class as properly committed. I certainly wouldn't dislike or denounce or make my feelings on this known to a gay man in a relationship who sleeps round (just I wouldn't about anyone's sex life, to be honest) but I do think that, if pushed, I'd have a hard time supporting the idea that an open relationship is just as committed as a monogamous one.

What does it really matter to me what other people do or don't do with their willies? Well not a jot really ? the only relationship that's of any concern to me is my own. But given the rash of 'homophobia' threads at the moment, I've been thinking about it and found that process interesting.

I'm very open to discussion about this, as it's the best way (for me anyway) to get things clear in ones mind), but I'd prefer it if it were reasoned discussion, not just shrieks of 'homophobe' as that is unlikely to move things forward and is just boring for everyone else to read.

I am in a committed relationship but I like snogging other women. I shall grow out of it one day, I expect.

I can see that it is possible. I could be perfectly happy, if my DH could be too, in that kind of relationship but he never could. It is very important to him that we are faithful so we are. I am totally committed, I am married. I'm committed to DH and to the marriage! It's not that I'd want to have extra marital affairs, just that I know it wouldn't be a problem for me to be in that kind of relationship and that it wouldn't lessen my commitment.

I suspect this is fine a lot of the time for Hetero couples too and it is just that they keep it a secret because it is more taboo for hetero couples. Doubt there's any real difference in percentages.

TROLL! Can't see it myself. To me it means that at least one of you is holding a part of yourself back, and using the other person for support, empathy, all the benefits of a committed realtionship whilst preserving a side of yourself away from them and sharing it around with other people. That may appear to be fine on the surface, but I don't remain convinced.