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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think that narcissism is the current MN buzzword.

192 replies

OrmIrian · 26/11/2009 16:57

Never seen it on MN until a few months ago. And now it's everywhere!

OP posts:
AvrilH · 28/11/2009 09:35

YABU, narcissism is an old word, and it helps people as MrsBean so eloquently explained. I understand a "buzzword" as jargon used to impress others, I don't think this one is.

And it does seem like this is a bit of a mean dig at a long running support thread

gettingagrip · 28/11/2009 09:39

For Jacey...and anyone else who may be vaguely interested..

Brain changes in psychopaths...the first one from 1995 ! So not exactly breaking news!

www.crimetimes.org/97b/w97bp4.htm

www.physorg.com/news168610123.html

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18327824

I am very sorry if I upset you OrmIrian. Just like you, I am very, very fragile. The slightest little thing...and over the edge I go.

I hope your father makes a full recovery.

Not sure whether I will ever post on here again though. Will aways now feel that there are many of you who are judging my feeble attempts to help people, and laughing.

Oh well, I am sure that will be no loss. So many of you are so knowledgable!

Skihorse...I have always read your posts with interest. I take my hat off to you. You will never get an N however, to accept any help. There is nothing wrong with them, they are perfect! That is why mental health proffs never see them. They see plenty of their victims though!

OrmIrian · 28/11/2009 09:48

Well gettingagrip, that would be a shame. If you are helping people who genuinely need it.

Why would it bother you what anyone else thinks though? The only people that matter are those who are suffering as a result of the condition.

I think you should carry on doing what you are doing. Ignore those of us who are crusty and cynical

Many apologies for causing upset to you, and those who suffer the results of the disorder.

OP posts:
Unlikelyamazonian · 28/11/2009 10:13

The counsellor I saw after my NPD now-EX husband abandoned me and our 6 month old baby, taking twenty grand and leaving me with no money, no job and a ten grand overdraft, to go to Thailand and spectacularly lie his way into a grand university job and shack up with a Burmese girl almost immediately ......said that without Ns she would be out of a job - meaning, it is their victims that end up in counselling/therapy.

I can only find about 4 threads on the main page in Relationships, that refer to NPD and two of those are started by the same poor girl who is desperately still looking for answers.

Let us do the maths:
4 x threads-on-NPD, divided by the number of mumsnetters (many thousands apparently) = Buzzword.

In RL I have only met a massive two people who know anything about NPD or have any experience of it. One of them was on the Women's Aid Pattern Changing course I did after H pissed off. The other is another poster on here who has become a firm friend.

But the fantastic thing about the internet is that it brings thousands of people together from all over the country and therefore, mathematically, it is more likely you are going to find others who have similar experiences. So, we have been able to talk the same language - call it cod psychology if you will - and recommend literature to each other and comfort each other.

It makes an incalculable difference to be able to 'label' what we have suffered, because living with a clever psychopath and narc, which is what my H most certainly was, is unlike any other relationship experience.

Perhaps because of the threads on MN that have been around over the last year-and-a- half and which have talked about NPD and its classic traits (idealise-devalue-discard for instance,) more people have come to recognise it in their partners, realise the awful truth about the condition and get out.

I had never heard of NPD until my H actually diagnosed himself with it in the days leading up to him abandoning me. Ns can have brief moments of illumination but then go straight back into denial - which is what he did.

When he had gone I read and read and read and read about Narcissistic Personality Disorder. It took me months of agonising over whether he was just a selfish bastard twat or had a mental health issue. Well, he was and he did.

Ns are selfish bastard nobboids indeed. They suffer from first class tw**ttism. But they are mad bad and dangerous fuckers too who will steal, lie and severely abuse to get what they want.

End of essay.

OrmIrian · 28/11/2009 10:40

Well I found 7 threads either on NPD or narcissism in Oct and Nov. AUgust and September - just one.

OP posts:
OrmIrian · 28/11/2009 10:41

Anyway. I am going to see my father now.

Many apologies for any upset I caused.

OP posts:
Unlikelyamazonian · 28/11/2009 10:45

My theory works then Orm! One or two posts have alerted others to the condition and have sparked more.

Hope yr dad gets well soon.

Besom · 28/11/2009 11:49

Gettingagrip - you'd be daft to flounce over this especially if you get support, as you say, from MN.

IMO the OP raised a reasoable point worth discussing about use of words and online diagnosis.

I don't actually think anyone is laughing at this. Some people obviously feel uncomfortable with touchy-feelyness/counselling/support threads and this comes over as MN bravado - stop whining, don't be a 'hun' etc. Some of the posts immediately after the OP reflected this. Some people don't think you should post personal stuff about your relationships. That's fine - up to them.

I always tell people to go for counselling, and then I see threads with people moaning about people suggesting counselling all the time. I'm not going to stop suggesting counselling if I think it's appropriate - it helped me. If people think I'm a whingeing hun, so be it. I probably am.

NanaNina · 28/11/2009 11:53

Mrs Bean - what a brilliant and informative post and a shame that no one has responded. Everyone seems more concerned with furthering the squabble about what OrmIrian mean or didn't mean and taking sides, with her or against her. I think you have hit the nail on the head about diagnoses and their accuracy or otherwise especially in considering mental health issues.

FWIW I think OrmIrian made an innocous slightly flippant comment that has been seized upon by some posters and distorted out of a ll proprotion. She has been accused of all sorts of really unpleasant things "mocking" and "sneering" etc etc. Quite why people assume that she is saying/inferring these things is quite beyond me. However I too have been in this position on MN and accused of all sorts of things I haven't said or meant. I have even been "diagnosed" by an irate MN as having PND! I have discovered that once the wrath of MN has turned on you there is nothing that you can say to try to explain what you meant. Indeed any further explanations just brings forth more insults/accusations and more and more unpleasantness. This is what has happened here and it has clearly upset the OP as she keeps coming back to defend herself. This is the donwside of MN and it's horrible.

I think you have hit the nail on the head about "diagnoses" especially in terms of some kind of mental health issue.

MaggieBelle · 28/11/2009 13:34

NanaNina, This isnt about OrmIrian, so don't put her up on the cross so you can be her saviour. That goes for everybody else who's raced to defend a well-known MN-er without really knowing anymore about the issue than she does herself.

I also like Orm, but the OP did hit me between the two eyes.

I see the problem as being the very opposite, but that doesn't mean I'm lining up to 'attack' orm, which isn't what happened on this thread anyway.

If the word is disorder is better known then that is good.

How does anybody know who genuinely had an NPD partner?. I wouldn't like to disbelieve anybody, so an advisable default would surely be to just not comment if you find it too far outside your own experiences to contemplate.

Orm, hope your Dad is ok.. I once posted something which got me into a lot of hot water when I wasn't feeling too emotionally robust. The 800 posts to pour every insult imagineable on me had me in tears, and no fucker defended me. I had to step away from tinternet for a while.

GibbonInARibbon · 28/11/2009 14:03

Maggie, sorry but your last post was a tad harsh. People are not rushing to defend a well known MN'er without knowing anything about the issue. If I were you I would not dare to presume what people know or don't know.

My father (who I have had no contact with for 15 years) has one of the worst cases of NPD you could imagine. People would not believe half of what I could tell them.

However I do agree with Orm. She was not denying the existence of NPD she was merely pointing out that the term is bandied about these days.

As I said I agree with her. I would rather the term was not used so casually and easily. I think doing that belittles the damage, pain and long term destruction that NPD can cause.

beanie35 · 28/11/2009 14:11

I thought the huge NPD thread on here started by therealme was excellent. It answered a lot of questions for me, as Im sure it did for others.

Whats important is that help and support is available for all victims of any kind of abuse, not names or terms of conditions. Thank God for those posters who are brave enough to share their experiences with us.

MaggieBelle · 28/11/2009 15:02

This is exactly what has happened gibbon. My perception of the problem is different from Orm's (a courteous difference of opinion is still allowed?!).

I don't mean to hurt Orm, or anybody, but it was a controversial thread, but I'm not criticising her for that more than once. It's a moment's work to crash off an ill-judged thread. We've all done it. Mine was far worse. I'll tell Orm about it if she's interested, I guarantee it would make her feel better!

The "problem" that Orm sees is overuse of the word Narcissist, whereas I bearly notice that, and wouldn't see it as a huge problem. That is the very OPPOSITE of the problem as I see it. THe problem I see is underuse, UNDER awareness. Victims of NPD can't say "narcissistic personality disorder" without somebody rolling their eyes at what they perceive to be self-indulgent melodrama..

I hope Orm is ok, as I know that when I started a thread that went pear-shaped, I took every single post as being a another bullet aimed at me. Even when some were just discussion.

Beanie35, yes it's a real pity that dropped off the radar. WE need another one. The beauty of that thread was that by some miracle nobody showed up on it to doubt us, our experiences or our 'labels'.

Unfortunately Narcissistic Personality Disorder has become my specialist subject. I could have chosen subjects I'd rather know a lot about, but it turns out that this is the thing that I've been forced to put my nose right in to, and navel-gaze, and research my way through it.

OrmIrian · 28/11/2009 16:48

maggie- please start another NPD thread. I promise to read it with sympathy and interest

OP posts:
MaggieBelle · 28/11/2009 16:58

I should do, but you don't have to promise to read it Orm! you've no obligation to take on other people's problems! especially when you have your own, and tbh, I guess it can be quite heavy at times.

Hope you're not too upset over this thread. 90% of the time, internet good but occassionally when you end up crying over it it feels like you've gone mad, as surely you can't be crying over the internet,,, I have been there.

Hope your Dad is ok.

OrmIrian · 28/11/2009 16:59

Awww maggie you sweetie

Da's is as well as can be expected I guess. Looked dreadful

OP posts:
Jamieandhismagictorch · 28/11/2009 17:36

Can we all have a group hug now ?

MaggieBelle · 28/11/2009 17:56

oh yes! comeerfuracuddle! all of you.

PerArduaAdNauseum · 28/11/2009 17:59

Hungover snogs all round [smooch]

GibbonInARibbon · 28/11/2009 18:07
petunia · 28/11/2009 18:19

But I didn't think MN did hugs

OrmIrian- I apologise for my ranting post last night. Through your later posts and those from others, I can now see what you were saying. I also realise now that it wasn't your OP but some of the posts at the start that made me see red.
Hope your Dad makes a good recovery and you take it easy as well. with lots of wine and chocolate!

Jamieandhismagictorch · 28/11/2009 18:57

My hug involves a sort of manly pat on the back .....

mathanxiety · 28/11/2009 20:46

(((((()))))))))

OrmIrian · 29/11/2009 11:26

Ahem! Well I think that's enough of that....

OP posts:
petunia · 29/11/2009 14:15