in thinking that if we have monthly income of £3700 net we could spare £120 to spend on a cleaner?

[effedorf]

3+ years posting here, namechange for obvious reasons.

But, seriously, what do you think?

The income all comes from dh and I am sahm. We have two primary school age children. I truly hate cleaning and I do 95% of the food shopping and cooking and 100% of the laundry and 95% of all the other things that makes a family tick over.

Or am I being unreasonable?

Heathen- I think you may have misunderstood me. I thought your remark 'working as a cleaner is completely different from doing it for fun' implied that housewives were cleaning 'for fun'. Of course they are not because most people don't actually enjoy cleaning. I was just pointing out that most people who clean for a living or those that have other jobs are not doing it 'for fun' either but because of necessity. We all have to do things that aren't fun- it's just life isn't is?

It might all be relative, but 44K net is what, 70k gross? If you earn 70K gross a year and don't have 120 quid going spare per month (regardless of what it is for) you've got a problem. For one thing, interest rates are going to go back up pretty soon, the average mortgage will go up by a lot more than 120 quid.

I think lots of tasks can expand to fit the time available..... if you want to make doing the housework, shopping for dinner and eating your lunch fill the time while your children are at school, it's perfectly possible to do that.

On the other hand, it's entirely possible to do those things as well as both parents having jobs - any combination of full or part time.A lot of it boils down to time management!

Ah, I see what you mean now. I was kind of tying it in with my comment previously, about 'Not Doing The Cleaning' being an acceptable (fun!) hobby.

But I do have Ishoos with this, having watched my mum spend her life cleaning things that didn't really need cleaning IMO, for her thankless brood. Swore never to do the same.

I used to be a house cleaner. It is much more fun cleaning someone else's house rather than your own for some reason. It was easy money really and much less skivvy-ish than other jobs I've done (working in McDonalds for example).

I always find it a bit odd that so many people on MN seem to think it's the lowest of the low.

It isn't so much having it spare I bet Georgimama it is probably about spending it if you don't actually need to.

Ah Heathen, I see where you are coming from. I think it is the 'thankless' bit that is key. If nobody appreciates what you are doing, anybody would feel fed up and despondent and rightly so.

I completely agree with Violet about making jobs expand to fit the time available. The jobs on nostrilla's list really don't take v long at all- maybe a couple of hours a day and some can be done with children around like shopping, etc.

ROFL at Bonsoir's school applications being 'A LOT' of work!

I've never been a cleaner but I have worked in McDonalds and if there was a choice would be a cleaner any day. At least as a cleaner no-one demands that you "hustle" or shouts at you for not having all of your (at the time) waist-length curly hair underneath their silly red cap...

I think a point which needs to be made here (at the risk of being sexist) with regards to the DH and the cleaner is an awful lot of WOH men don't realise how much effort goes into keeping a house presentable - and assume that the bath just doesn't ever get dirty, and that the crud on the carpet just somehow vanishes during the day. So when their partner suggests a cleaner they're unaware exactly what it is their partner is wishing to outsource...

Time management and standards - I've lowered mine!

Mind you, even having a cleaner 4 hours per week doesn't mean neither of us ever lift a finger, the hoover gets put round at least twice a week by one of us, the cooking and clearing away afterwards, washing and ironing etc. 4 hours per week just prevents the place from looking like a complete shit pit, and conveniently it is done on a Friday so at least at the start of the weekend we're not contemplating spending all Saturday morning cleaning.

All this talking has made me arrange to have a cleaner once again.
Thanks OP!

Kitty -I also ROFL at that!

I was going to say, the day that researching and applying for my three children's school places becomes a full time job, is the day I know I need to shoot myself.

But then I realised my children would probably shoot me first!

I thought no-one would bring up the end result of the out-sourcing - other women having to clean. I am sure it is better than a lot of shitty jobs, but that doesn't make it great! I think there are of ethical issues around about paying someone else to clean up your own house. It's not a job that gives you company, benefits (like maternity pay, sickness pay - unless the employer chooses to do that), or skills you up for other jobs. It is convenient, cash in hand work done by working class, often (in London anyway) migrant women.

I ned to add, I have a cleaner and live with the guilt.... FWIW I think the OP should hire one too. My mum was a cleaner most of her life and was really pleased when we hired one. So am not being judge-y but interesting all these posts and hardly anyone mentioned this.

Some people really like convenient cash in hand jobs - I know I did. Hiring a cleaner doesn't have to be a way of exploiting immigrants.

And it does bug me how it's always the traditionally female jobs that always bring about this sort of hulabaloo when people wish to pay for them - no-one says "You want someone to wash your car / paint your windowframes for you? Have you no shame? It's just accepted that's perfectly fine if you've got the cash...

Now I'm ROFL again Violet!

I don't see any ethical issues with employing a cleaner who would otherwise be unemployed, or doing other work, if you can afford to do so. As SGB said, in the current economic climate there is actually a moral argument for those who can afford to do so in outsourcing as much work as possible to provide work for those who otherwise would have none. It depends on your view of cleaning. I don't see it as degrading or menial. It's work that people choose to do.

I side step any such issues by paying my mum, who is a pensioner. She is very happy to have 30 quid a week extra.

Well you know Longtalljosie men have much more important things to be doing.

I don't see any moral issues either. I need a job done, I have the money to pay someone for it, someone else wants the money, they do the job, everyone is happy - where is the moral dilemma? Assuming they are paid a fair wage for their work, there isn't one.

No different from when I am hired to sort out an office.

anniemac, I think somewhere up thread the OP said her disposal income was 400 quid per week - don't know if that has to pay for food as well or whether that really is 1600 per month completely up for grabs. In either case I reckon they can easily afford it.

I'd love a cash in hand cleaning job right now as extra to my other job (also cleaning) I could do with the cash and there are no more hours at work.

I'd have loved it even more when I was on benefits so I see no problem with hiring a cleaner, and can't see why anyone would.

home surgery where we squeeeze fanjo boils

damn, i missed that...[hgrin]

I am utterly and at this thread.

Reading between the lines, we should all understand that SAHM;

1. Have no say in how household income is spent, because they have not earned it. The main breadwinner has all the say.

2. Should not indulge in ANY luxuries (how many SAHMs on here can say they have NO luxuries - whether that is a cleaner, a takeaway or broadband.....)

3. Should consider getting a 'little job' to pay for things they want.

FFS,how patronising is it possible to be?

Firstly - it is almost impossible to get a job that is 9:30-2:30, term time only.

Secondly, perhaps a SAHM who gets a cleaner for a few hours a week may be able to get other things done, such as helping with reading in school. Doesn't generate an income, but isn't unworthwhile.

I HATE cleaning. I really really hate it. Dh hates the idea of a cleaner, BUT he is really good about helping with the chores. I would LOVE to have someone in once a week to clean the bathroom and kitchen, and hoover. It is benefiting them, as they would have some work, would relieve me of a hated chore, and would please dh as the house would be cleaner!

Women don't have to be martyrs you know - there's nothing in the rule book that says you have to do everything you don't like - if you can afford it, then get a cleaner!

Interestingly some of my family live in Singapore, where it is normal for a family to have a maid, and a nanny (if they have children). So my SIL with 1 child was a SAHM with a maid who did all the cleaning, ironing, laundry. The nanny was live in and did all the child care, unless they wanted to play with the baby.

That's the norm there.

I had a full time live in maid when I lived in Singapore and didn't have any kids at that point. I did get a job a bit later though.

When in Rome...