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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to consider reporting friend to SS?

456 replies

sillysalley · 14/10/2009 22:42

I have a friend who's approach to parenting is just ... well ... worrying really.

Her and her husband have a crazy fascination with keeping the house like a show home and nothing else seems to be of importance other than that. I cant emphasise how much of a fascination it is, not just that they have a tidy house but things like
no baby gates allowed
children not allowed toys anywhere other than their bedroom
children not allowed to sit on the expensive leather sofa if they are wearing clothes with buckles and belts etc

Well i visited recently and their 2 year old is still not speaking (not even a single word, he makes very little noise)

Then she told me something that really worried me. Her 2 year old was really ill recently and she had to send for an ambulance because he could hardly breathe. She said
'I could hear him in his cot struggling to breathe, i was so panicked because it took me ages to get to him, trying to untie all the rope around his door handle to get into his room'

I presume the rope is to stop him going out of his bedroom in the night, as they wont have baby gates becuase they damage the walls.

Then she went on to say the hospital wanted her 2yo to stay in for the night but she refused and took him home.

I cant believe that HV or the hospital have not picked up on this, but I am truly worried. The thing is she isnt the kind of person you could approach about the issue. So all I can think of is an anonymous referal the SS.

Would that be unreasonable?

OP posts:
wannaBe · 15/10/2009 00:17

I think the fact that the parents in that story had IQ's of less han 66 means they were far more vulnerable and were perhaps given more lenient sentences. Clearly they had learning difficulties and lacked the capasity to look after their children properly.

I imagine a judge would come down far more harshly on a seemingly inteligent woman..

ABitBatty · 15/10/2009 00:18

For locking the door or letting them have matches and lighters stuffed under their pillow?

pigletmania · 15/10/2009 00:20

YAB a bit U, just because her parenting style does not agree with yours does not mean ss should be invlolved. They do not sound abusive, careless but not abusive. She just needs some advice. Mabey you could drop the rope thing in conversation with her, if you are truly concerned tell her about it in conversation.

UndomesticHousewife · 15/10/2009 00:23

I have a stair gate across ds's door (he's 2.5 yrs) to stop him wandering round in the middle of the night.
At least see out when he wakes up.
Don't really agree with tying the door shut (hope she can untie it a bit quicker if there ever was a fire, in the pitch black smoke...).

But actually I have a bit of an issue with the tidy house thing.
Now, don't get me wrong I'l love to have a house that was even half tidy but I have a 2.5 yr old at home with me all day and it's impossible to do a lot with him.
If I was to do all the housework I'd have to tie him up somewhere (with the door handle rope) to stop him moaning and whinging that I'm not paying him any attention and then creating more mess and destruction.

I always wonder what people with small children do with their kids when they're cleaning the house to such a standard.
And I think it's very hard for any child to live in a house like that where no one can move in it.

ABitBatty · 15/10/2009 00:24

I've just read the OP properly. Op is just presuming the rope was for keeping his door shut.
"I presume the rope is to stop him going out of his bedroom in the night, as they wont have baby gates because they damage the walls." So you are saying that it's okay to stop a child getting out of his room, as long as it's a stairgate?

However, more concern is shown over the 'crazy' fascination with housework

"Her and her husband have a crazy fascination with keeping the house like a show home and nothing else seems to be of importance other than that. I cant emphasise how much of a fascination it is, not just that they have a tidy house but things like
no baby gates allowed
children not allowed toys anywhere other than their bedroom
children not allowed to sit on the expensive leather sofa if they are wearing clothes with buckles and belts etc"

Come back and tell us what the NSPCC have said!

UndomesticHousewife · 15/10/2009 00:27

Also, how do her children play? Small children don't go off to their rooms to play on their own, they want to play where ever you are, so how do her children play?

And why did she want to take him home rather than let him stay in hospital, just out of interest?

ABitBatty · 15/10/2009 00:29

They don't. They are tied up in their room whilst the mum polishes her sofa

UndomesticHousewife · 15/10/2009 00:32

Abitbatty - I don't think it's particularly safe for my ds to wandering around the house in teh middle of the night, I sleep so soundly I might not hear him and he WILL go into bathroom and probably drown himself so a stairgate in my house, is the most sensible option.

He can't get out, but he can still see out into the hall. It's not a blank door that he can't open. And if he does wake up he call s me adn I go to him.

Don't see anything wrong with that.
Much better than tying the door shut because I'm too worried about my walls

ChunkyMonkeysMum · 15/10/2009 00:37

I like a clean tidy house, and in response to the question asked about how does a mother with young children clean to such an extent, well I am lucky enough to have been blessed with 2 kids who don't demand my constant attention and are quite happy to amuse themselves while I clean, one of whom is only 13 months old. My eldest gets one toy out at a time and knows to put it back before getting another one. That's how I was brought up so that's how I bring mine up.

To the OP - Do you actually know for a fact that the children are not allowed any toys downstairs at all, or is that just how it seems when you visit? I always make sure that my house is clean & tidy with toys packed away before visitors come. Doesn't mean to say it's like that all the time.

Do you know for a fact that she does all the housework herself? Maybe she has a cleaner? After all, you say she's not exactly your friend and that you don't see her often so how do you know any of these things for definite?

ABitBatty · 15/10/2009 00:43

I had a hook latch thing on my ds2 door when he started getting up and down up and down out of bed. I took it off when he was asleep and had a stairgate on the landing myself. I have no issue with latches or stair gates. Yards of rope maybe I'm not in agreement with.

This friend of the OP might not even be tying the door shut, she just presumes as she says herself.
I find it interesting that she describes this womans behavious as 'crazy' regarding the housework but not about the locking the door shut. Says it's more about the house issue IMO

Hmm...I am going off this thread now. I've spent the first 40 minutes of my 32nd 22nd birthday stressing over the possibility of some rope round some random womans door. I will be dreaming of shiny sofa's

McDie79 · 15/10/2009 00:44

Disagree with the rope around door and think you should broach the subject....
Always wonder about immaculate houses though,this might come across as a bit judgy,but I'd much rather have my kids play near me,cuddle up on the couch with me regardless of wether they were wearing buckles than worry about the state of couch,a few scratches does not stop you sitting on it and god forbid if something happened to my kids,would I console myself with the fact that I had a scratch free couch to sit on??????sorry for going on but I have a bee in my bonnett about these type of things at the moment.

ChunkyMonkeysMum · 15/10/2009 00:45

UndomesticHousewife - DS1 had his bedroom door closed from the first day I put him in his own room at 4 weeks old. He was always used to being in a silent, dark room so a baby gate across his door when he started coming out of his room at the age of 2 would have meant that he wouldn't have been able to sleep and would have spent all evening hanging his arms over the gate before more than likely falling asleep on the floor behind the gate.
Therefore a hook and eye latch on his door was a much more effective way of keeping him in bed and getting him to sleep quickly. I only had to lock it for the first couple of weeks before he didn't attempt to cone out anymore and I always unlocked it when I went to bed.
None of us know if the rope on the door handle was just a temporary measure to keep this child in his room until he got used to staying there himself. We also don't know if the parents removed it when they went to bed. I think the OP has gone way over the top by wanting to call SS or the HV.

ChunkyMonkeysMum · 15/10/2009 00:48

Happy Birthday ABitBatty!!!

ABitBatty · 15/10/2009 00:51

One last thing... why didn't you at least just say ' What? Do you tie his door up?' and see what she said...rather than presume and then later report her to SS?!

Thanks ChunkyMonkeysMum

UndomesticHousewife · 15/10/2009 00:56

You'e very lucky chunky. Mt ds can and will amuse himself for about 15 minutes if I'm lucky or there's something extra good on the telly, but that's it really. Only really enough tim eto unload the dishwasher and get some wshing on.
I don't think my ds is out of the ordinary, all the other kids I know are just like him, just active and happy children who at 2.5 years don't like to be on their own for all that long, but then it doesn't really bother me that he's like that - I didn't have my children so I could plonk them in front of the telly so I can clean .

When someone comes to my house they have to accept that I have 3 children and there will be toys around and it won't look spotlessly clean - but if they have a problem with that then they can leave.

My house is clean enough, though not especially tidy, but it's the childen's home too and they should be allowed to relax in it to some extent.
I know people that keep their houses scarily tidy when they have small children and it's no fun for the mum as she was constantly stressing about them not making a mess and runing around cleaning everything as soon as something was out of place, and it's definitely not fun for teh child to live liek that.

elkiedee · 15/10/2009 00:59

I think there's a problem here and I can understand OP wanting to contact Social Services. And I'm saying that as someone who's had some very upsetting unwanted intrusion into her life by HCPs and Social Services recently. The stairgates don't sound like an issue of themselves, they're one way of managing things but there are others. The rope round the door is unsafe, and the first post described a child being brought up in a way which I find scary and upsetting.

I don't think all methods of stopping a child wandering out of bed and falling downstairs are equally awful - OP's friend has secured the door in a way which means she can't easily open it herself. That's what is unsafe.

UndomesticHousewife · 15/10/2009 01:04

Chunkymonkey, I have a stairgate because my dc's never had their bedroom door so they not used to it, but if your kids are used to it and nt scared then great whatever works.

I have a problem with op's friend not having stairgates etc because of damage to walls - agree with McDie79, will you say well at least I have nice walls if something happens to your child?

ChunkyMonkeysMum · 15/10/2009 01:09

No I won't say that because I do have stair gates, at the top and bottom of my stairs (one of them has actually popped through the shoddy plasterboard Walls too ). I was just explaining why I don't have a stairgate on the kids bedroom doors.

With regards to the kids keeping themselves occupied while I clean, are my kids abnormal then??!

UndomesticHousewife · 15/10/2009 01:17

Yep definitely very abnormal .

Actually I think the problem isn't that my ds doesn't amuse himself because he does at times, it's that when he does amuse himself I don't clean I sit down with a coffee and Now magazine....

nappyaddict · 15/10/2009 01:19

Maybe she would usually untie it before she goes to bed? If that's the case then YABU.

ChunkyMonkeysMum · 15/10/2009 01:26

Don't get me wrong, I don't clean every bloody day, prefer to spend time on MN when DS1 is at school and DS2 is amusing himself .

However when I know someone is coming round, I do whizz round downstairs, but I lock the stair gate and under no circumstances do I let them upstairs!!! Thank god I have a downstairs loo!!

nappyaddict · 15/10/2009 01:28

Actually thinking about it I have 1 friend with a DD who has GDD and 3 friends with autistic children. All of them have locks on the outside of doors because they have escape artists who don't understand danger and will climb on the banisters at 4 in the morning without anyone realising. 2 of them also have no speech at 3 years old.

Now presumably if she is your friend you would know if any SN had been diagnosed but 2 is early for a diagnosis and many parents don't realise their DC has SN at this age. (Not saying he has, just that it's a possibility)

differentnameforthis · 15/10/2009 01:36

Really...how is having stair gate the same as tying a door closed? A stair gate could be kicked off in seconds! I know I could do that, but I couldn't kick in a roped tied door! But saying that, I'd rather burn my legs on gate than risk 2 lives trying to free my trapped child!

If the child is in a cot, why do they need a rope to keep the door closed? Unless the child can climb, well then they just need to spend some time returning the child to a proper bed & not be lazy & lock him in his room! He isn't a prisoner ffs!

Dd is still in her cot but once she is in a bed if she is in-out-in-out we will put a gate across her door, not tie it closed with a rope!

At least a gate can be climbed over, a child lifted over...a rope that takes time to get thro could cost a child their life. I'd rather have a burnt child (on a gate, for eg) than a dead one!

At least the poster who used a carpet cleaner could remove it easily in an emergency!

differentnameforthis · 15/10/2009 01:38

Even a lock (that doesn't rely on finding a key) would be better, at least it is easy & quick to use!

ChunkyMonkeysMum · 15/10/2009 01:44

So could all the posters, including myself who have used a hook and eye latch.

My DS1 is autistic, isn't aware of dangers, was able to climb out of his cot from 18 months old so we put him in a bed. He then started coming in and out of his room. Couldn't put a baby gate over his door for reasons explained previously about him being used to being in a dark, quiet room (also worried he would climb over it). He could have scalded himself in the bathroom, climbed over the gates on the stairs, hurt himself on any number of things, so we felt we had no option other than to put some kind of lock on his door. Does that make us bad, lazy parents then ??