Another MIL story...

[AJ123]

I don't know what to do...I am at my wit's end!! My 1st child dd is not even 7 weeks old yet and I have spent most of her little life arguing with dh over in laws. I've tried as much as I can to ignore the situation, and of course I've enjoyed her but it's coming to a point where neither of us can stand it anymore!

I have never had a good relationship with MIL. Not from want of trying on my part, and tbh i think she took an instant dislike to me (she also continually mentioned his ex not very tactful!)- we're far too different people but grated along because we both loved her ds/my dh. Anyway, after a while this culminated in her being drunk in her local and shouting in a pub at my much younger brother how she was going to hit him because 'yuk' he was related to me, her ds could do so much better etc etc.

This caused huge ructions, but eventually, I accepted that I had to partly forgive her and try and get on with things. I was still not fully accepted and relations were strained but we muddled along.

6 months later, I found out I was pregnant. My DH was happy but immediately demanded that his mother would be allowed to see the baby as much as mine, divided child care etc etc. Funnily enough my MIL was not my first thought!

We told his mother sooner than I'd have liked (after I found out that one of his mother's friends had found out via my pharmacist(!!!!!) and had told her children (one of whom was dh's ex) and they were taking it upon themselves to announce it to people ). She was overexcited.

Apparently all she'd ever wanted to be was a grandma. She was in my face 'dn't cut me out, don't cut me out' gave me presents etc. It was so wrong. I could understand that she was happy, but to force a relationship with me only to get to her GC I feel was wrong. I would have respected her more if she stuck to her guns, I would never have stopped her seeing her GC. Anyway, the undercurrent of dislike was still there. I had previously suffered from bulimia, and at a family dinner to celebrate our news, she read out a text from a friend to everyone saying 'oh congrats on becoming a gran. At least she'll have a reason to be sick now'... I couldn't believe my ears!

My pregnancy continued. She continued to make it about herself. She wanted to put pics of my Scan on her facebook. She wanted to be in at the birth, (my FIL offered to film it!). She bought us a fetal heart monitor but insisted that she listen to the baby first (before even us!) so the gift was evidently for herself not us. She wanted to buy a baby box, which was sweet, and she asked me to choose. So I did. She bought a different one, that she liked! Her house was filled with her own pram, her own crib etc...

Fast forward to the wonderful day my DD was born. They came to hospital. My MIL just got my FIL to take pics of her posing with DD. None of DD with her DS, none of DD on her own, none of DD with FIL (believe me I was not in any state to want to be photographed anyway!!) She then announced the birth of my daughter on Facebook before we got to tell our friends, and put up all of her pics of herself with DD on the same site.

The photoshoots have continued everytime she sees her.ONly herself with DD and all get put on Facebook. Now call me old-fashioned but I thought Grandparent took photos and put them up in their house, not all over a social networking site where you don't really have control over who is looking at these pics...(she was asked by DH not to after even more pics were taken, but she ignored him)

She wouldn't come around at weekends, because she caravans every fri sat sun mon, so I was asked to endure afternoons with her on my own immediately after DD was born. It was torture. And it was just one battle after another...why wasn't she allowed to have her on her own, why couldn't she take DD out for a walk etc. She is just waiting to have me out of the way!

Finally, we took our DD over to my ILs, when she was 3 weeks old. It was just a quick drop in for cuddles then home to feed her. (not comfortable about BFing at ILs.) MIL asked if she could walk out with DD (not in pram but in her arms) and take her over to the other side of her village to 'show off' to her friends. I said I'd rather she didn't (maybe overprotective but that's my right surely). She sulked, she may as well have stamped her foot. Ten minutes later, my head was turned in conversation with BIL and she ran out of the house with DD anyway!! She hasn't been around since then to see her. I put my foot down and said it was weekends only, when my DH is home, and I don't feel so vulnerable. It has been her choice to sulk at this, and doesn't want to come around when I'm here. (In fact she text my DH and said she wasn't coming round ever again, she knows I don't like her, which to me is just a ruse to get my DH to ship my DD over to her without me - She's too little!!! But my DH agrees with his MIL that I should be out of the way so his Mother can see GD. Who else lets their LOs out of there site at this age? Am I wrong?)

I truly feel that my DD is a trophy to her. There is no kissing of baby or real genuine affection. And she isn't happy just holding her and interacting with her. It has to be about parading her.

It has got to the point where the thought of her holding DD makes me cringe. I truly don't think she's nice woman. She doesn't understand that she can't emulate my closeness with my mother just to have equal access to DD. It's just the way it is! (Before DD was born she said she didn't like girls, and anyway she just KNEW it was a boy and she has already mentioned since we had her that shes sure we'll have a boy...enjoy the GD you have!)

What do I do. This is tearing our relationship apart. On top of everything else I can't trust my DH to support me. I think her walking out of the house with my 3 week old daughter would be enough for anyone, despite everything else? At least it's going to take me a while to trust her with my baby, and I'm not sure that's surprising. My closeness to my mother isn't helping the situation as DH sees this and resents that his mother can't have the same. I wouldn't let someone I think is essentially nasty, manipulative etc etc have sole charge of the thing that is most precious to me in all the world....even if she is my MIL.

So....after this long post, am I being unreasonable?!

OMG! Am horrified by your story. As hard as it is going to be you need to set some ground rules as quickly as you can now as it could escalate. We know of a British family living in France who have the British and French police looking for them as the MIL, FIL and father left the village they were in with the child. The mother had popped back to UK to visit her parents and now doesn't know where they are. This, apparently, was all instigated by the MIL. My mother befriended the family and has had the police contact her to see if she knows where they have gone. Very distressing for all concerned.

Can't imagine how you are coping with all this as being a new mum is stressful as it is. Good luck with it all.

AJ - this is a terrible situation that you are in, I know that we all have our mil gripes but I also know that the minute I became pg my DH grew a backbone and his new family became the most important thing to him. This is obviously not the case with your DH and the situations he has put you in have made life unbearable for you and therefore have made you turn to the your family as a matter of support if nothing else.

I have to say in your situation I don't know what I would do, but the temptation to leave would definitely be there, you are pretty much a single mother as it is and I don't think that anyone would see that you were in the wrong in the long term. I hope that you find the courage to do the right thing for your dd which is obviously to leave this toxic situation. It doesn't seem that you are ever going to be allowed to be in the right!

Priorities here are to ignore your MIL and see if you can work out how it will work with your DH, but if he can't see past his mother then he is a selfish little boy. It seems that he has been overly spoilt by his mother and it has ruined him and the relationships he has had with women.

Women like your MIL reap what they sow! Am v sad for you and your dd, have no sympathy whatsoever with DH who is a grown man and should have his priorities straight. I know you weren't having huge problems before your DC but I think this certainly highlights to anyone with a relationship issue that having a child will not make it all better.

I am so sorry

I think I might start to be beginning to like my MIL just a little bit as she can be a little poisonous but I know that she would never do what your MIL has done for the sake of her son who she obviously loves deeply and who she would never want to hurt by me leaving him (if that makes any sense). That doesn't seem to be your MIL priority and though I have said she has spoilt him, I don't actually think she has his best interests at heart either. In many respects it could be better to get out now whilst your dd is too small to remember.

PS - well done dd 10-8 is amazing and the more sleep you get the more clearly you will function. Very proud for you!

as a neut i can see both sides
i'm not saying mil is blameless sounds like she has done some pretty nasty things but as far as the babys concerned she just sounds excited shes not going to harm the dd is she? the first few months are always hectic but you can get through it with dh i had a major problem with my sil in the begining and was constantly arguing with my dh about her one thing i have learnt is that the more i slagged her off the more my dh defended her thats just the way it is you can say what you like about your family but anyone else slags them off you get angry. i dont think its fair the mothers mother always gets to see more of the gc but thats just what its like i like my mil but she doesnt get to see my ds nowhere near as much as my mum ds is 4 months going back to when i hated my sil she knew i hated her and spent most of her life trying to wind me up because she knew it worked since we have been married she has completley changed and so have i its almost like i have won.... so now she gives up winding me up and i give up trying to fight with her and we do actually get on so sorry went on abit
maybe my advice is
try and be nice to her just for a couple of days dont say anything negative to your dh about her and just see if the mood changes as for facebook pics totally agree with you i refuse to put pics of ds but was annoyed other people put loads of him on there would like to hear what happens!

I agree with trying to have a couple of days trying not to talk about MIL.

I do think much of this comes from your husband, tbh.

My MIL & I don´t get on.

That said,we don´t not get on, but we are completely different personalities.

But it is clear to her that her son is happy with me.

Undermining/upsetting me is not an option for her.

I don´t think your husband has made this clear, and I feel your MILs treatment of you-utter disrespect-is merely an extension of how your husband treats you,tbh.

AJ123 - Talk to your health visitor. You should not be under this type of emotional blackmail at the moment. It could have long term effects on YOUR health. You talk about you beautiful baby, but who is looking after YOUR needs? If you are breastfeeding, this type of stress could affect your milk, it could also affect your post-natal emotions. Your DH should be looking after you. To suggest that he gets you out of your house, away from your baby in favour of his mother is dangerous for your health, (you have just given birth!!) and for your baby whoneeds her mother's voice, smell, closeness and if you're feeding yourself, breastmilk.
Sooooo, here's what I'd do:
1 - Make an appointment to see your health visitor 1 to 1, you and her, NOT a quick minute as you get baby weighed at clinic.
2 - Tell your health visitor how your MIL ran off with your baby without your consent, (this is serious)
3 - Tell your health visitor your DH's plans to remove a new mother from the house and her baby in favour of his mother and tell her about the stress this is causing and your feelings about this
4 - Your health visitor must help you. Ask for an appointment where your health visitor can sit with you and DH and let her take the flack and tell your DH in simple terms how HIS behaviour is not acceptable and how HE should be looking after a very vulnerable YOU at the moment.
Good luck with all of this, let me know how you get on. You are worth so much more than this. Unfortunately, men do not stand up to their mothers, but at the moment, you are not strong enough to stand up to both of them - you should not be expected to!
Take care of yourself and congratulations on having a beautiful little girl!

AJ123 - can I say firstly that I am in agreement with most of the posters here and think that your MIL has behaved very badly towards you and that your H has just not supported you. I also agree that his first priority is you and your daughter NOT his mother. Your MIL is clearly the loser in this situation although you have suffered during the first important weeks with your baby, which should be a lovely time for you as a young family with your first child.

Now I am a MIL and a GM and have posted on other sites and tried to give a different perspective from a MIL's position. This has met with varying degrees of tolerance and intolerance and some DILS have in the past got very angry with me for even trying to talk about some of the feelings you have as a MIL and a GM. However I will give my thoughts on the matter though I do know there will be a HUGE backlash as there are some posters on here who will know me from other sites and will be only too ready to distort what I say, and discredit me but then we are all anonymous posters and they but lines of text on the internet.

I do think that you over reacted to your MIL "walking off" with your baby to show her off to neighbours. I know many posters think this was terrible and some have even talked of calling the police, which I think is a massive over reaction. When I read about this I was transported back in time (over 40 years ago) and my MIL did the exact same thing but when my firstborn son was 7 days old. In those days we stayed in hospital for 7 days and on the morning we were discharged we drove straight to the ILS to show them the baby and she marched off with him to show the neighbours WITHOUT asking (at least yours asked) and I was not happy about it, not at all and stood waiting by the window for them to come back. I can remember it like it was yesterday. However I didn't make a fuss when she did come back, just carried on with the conversation and I moaned about it after to my mom who said "Oh it's her first grandchild, she was just excited I expect" and that was the end of the matter. She did however continue to be a bit overbearing and was always telling me what I should and shouldn't be doing but I just didn't take much notice and in a few months she was fine. With my next 2 sons there were no real problems and we remained on good terms till she died quite recently.

Now I am not condoning what your MIL did - she should NOT have gone against your wishes and I would never dream of going against any of my dils (or sons) wishes about their children.

Another point I would make is that if you and your H do separate then he will have as much right to your daughter as you do and you won't be able to stop him from taking the child to see his mother. If parents can't agree about the way the child will be parented, who she will live with, how much contact the other parent has etc, then the matter can end up in court and they will decide on these issues. I am an independent social worker and am often involved in such cases in court. Judges get very punitive with women (sometimes unfairly in my view) if they think they are not allowing fathers proper contact with their children. It is of course always best if the parents can reach agreement without going to court.

Is there any possibility that you can find some middle ground with your MIL for the sake of your daughter, as whatever happens she will grow up knowing about this conflict and this will not be good for her. I agree that the depression thing is probably an attempt to get sympathy and often women who can't get their own way will turn from persecutor to victim (and back again) as the mood takes them.

Now I will stand back and wait for the backlash but PLEASE remember that I am not condoning what your MIL has done, nor the way in which your H has not supported you and I DO feel for what you have been through.

It is possible in some areas to access family mediation and I wonder if this is something that you would consider. I know that you and your MIL are probably never going to have a good r/ship but for the sake of yur daughter it may be the way forward. Your daughter actually has a right to a r/ship with her paternal GM as well as her maternal GM and I think you maybe worrying too much that she is somehow going to harm the child. This seems to me highly unlikely and I understand how you feel at the moment but as time passes things may settle down for you all. I sincerely hope so.

crikey, i read the op and was absolutely horrified, i don't think you're being U at all, in fact i think you've got the patience of a saint!!
Have to say though that i think nananina has just posted a wonderful train of thought, well said to her for saying what she feels.
I really don't get on at all with my mil, despite years of trying we've just got to the stage of ignoring each other now, but my dh is fantastic. he maintains a relationship with her but she and i are in noi doubt whatsoever that me and dh are his absolute priority and always will be. your dh needs to grow up and bw there for you.
hope you can find some peace here.
xxx

sorry, meant me and ds are his priority!!!

AJ, really glad you posted again, was wondering how you were doing.

The MIL sounds absolutely awful still, and attention seeking in the extreme, but it still sounds like the main issue lies with your husband. At this point you are NOT obligated to deal with this woman, and you need to get things on track (or not) with your husband and then deal with his mother as a united front, or, in a worst case scenario deal with your husband as an ex. Until things are sorted out with your husband to a point where you are both in agreement I think any engagement with his mother will be counter-productive and unpleasant for all involved.

You're not being flip about the situation either, you're being very calm in the circumstances. These are not small, easily dealt with issues that will go away if ignored, and you're extremely brave and strong to be dealing with them now as well as you are.

yanbu stick to your own guns and have confidence in yourself here. remember you are responsible for your dd and you get to make the decisions, dont be bullied. i would say perhaps not now, but before long, try to get to counselling with your dh about this - it will not be easy for your relationship to stay as it was before through all of this.

AJ123 You are going through it at the moment and you don't need this . My advice is

Don't sit down with them when she comes back. Why would you do that? It sound like you have been summoned to the head for a talking to. Why put yourself through it. You really don't have to if you don't want to you know. Disengage.

Get some tlc for yourself. My hv always said a happy mother makes for a happy baby. So think about that and plan for it. Go to your mothers for a while to be looked after and tell him that is why you are going there because he clearly isn't.

I think blaming you for her depression/ melodramatic illness behaviour is silly. You can't make someone else be depressed. If she is depressed it's because she had unrealistic expectations and was forgetting she was going to be a grandmother not a mother.
It gives you an excuse not to leave the baby with her though as she is "ill".
I hope her trip to see you has a time limit on it, as if you are to build a relationship with her you have to take small steps. If she starts blaming you/ being negative about you I would leave, taking your child, or preferably ask her to leave saying you don't want to talk to her until she can stop criticising you. In turn you shouldn't criticise her and list all the things she's done wrong. Superficial pleasant chatting only initially and playing nicely with baby and no poking her if she's asleep or fighting over her.

"I do think that you over reacted to your MIL "walking off" with your baby to show her off to neighbours"

No she didn't. It's horrible to sneak off with someone's tiny baby when they don't want you to. An over reaction would have been a refusal to never ever let her see the baby again. The op's response was normal, I question your response nananina because your relationship with your MIL isn't the same as this person's relationship with hers. Why should a new mother, newly disconnected from her baby be expected to act more reasonably than a grandmother? She shouldn't. Of course it would be best to find middle ground but OP you need to do this when you feel capable of doing it.

OP trust your instinct, you make as much or as little fuss as you need to. If you feel a sense of dread about this meeting then don't have it. You have more than enough on your plate at the moment and it's about time the people in your life started to recognise that. There's been a lot of unkindness towards you. Do what you want. Hey, it's your life and you can deal with problems as and when you feel able to and when you need support talk to your mum.

The thought of seeing her is damn right near giving me a panic attack at the moment, but I know that is a lot to do with the effect she has had on my relationship with DH - I totally resent her and do NOT want to see her.

But I'm compromising. I'm setting a time limit, and it's at our house, and I'm going to stay here. I'll potter about and put some washing out on the line, do some dishes maybe - it's better if I'm not sitting in there watching her.

I did lay out some groundrules to DH last night re the visit. An argument started again! Apparently he hates me talking about his DM that way but all I was saying was things like 'if she does not behave in the way that is expected in someone elses house, I will ask her to leave' I only wanted him to see that I was serious, and not to be walked all over.

It is things like the fact that she had made her very own (and utterly ridiculous) name that everyone should call her in reference to her as Grandma. DH told me last night that he told her that she was going to be plain old G'ma (as is my Mum, no favourites) and she broke down in tears again! DH is not on side with things like this - he feels the need to disagree - about his mother's photos on facebook, about what she calls her grandparents, about who I ask (only my Mum) to look after her for the 16 hours I'm at work.....Would you all say that these are a Mother's decisions to make? They're not about her upbringing as such, say which school she goes to - which of course is for both parents to sit down and sort out.

Milleniumbug - am definitely going to do this re HV, it means I can have someone who is hopefully as full of sound advice and as sensible as you ladies are, to tell DH the same things you are!

NanaNina - you shouldn't have had to stand by while your MIL walked off with your child either. Of course I'm unlikely to agree with everything you're saying - although I can see your point of view I suppose. But you do not know the woman. It has been said many times of this thread - being a grandparent is a privelege, not a right. Bad people become Grandparents too you know! Just because she is related to DD, does NOT mean I have to give her up to spend time with someone I do not trust. I believe that she should respect me first. She doesn't have the right to see DD on her own until she does. If I knew another selfish, manipulative bully, who played the victim, was disrespectful towards me, told my husband I was planning to leave him, and walked out of their house with MY child - I wouldn't be trying to build bridges with them, and I most CERTAINLY would not be letting DD within 100m of them!

Back to Saturday - give me strength! I really really don't want to see her, but I don't want her not to see DD for any longer so she can spin more crap about me to people. Of course in being depressed and inconsolable she has made herself beyond reproach, and I won't be able to lay the ground rules because she is oh so delicate at the minute!!

Print out this thread and leave it lying around.

Just remember, the masses of MNers who have been through this emotional blackmail with these freakoid women will be behind you, pulling cyber faces at the schtoopid old bat.

(is it a really bonkers popsy-dinkums kind of name she wants dd to call her? I'd let her get on with it, by the time dd is about 3 she'll be mortified by her g/ma.)

Just a thought, do you have a RL friend who can be at the end of the phone for you tomorrow? It might be stressful and just knowing you've got someone ready to listen afterwards (apart from us of course!) might make it easier on you.

Mum's offered to be there because she doesn't feel it's fair having both PILs and DH not on my side, puts me in a vulnerable position on my own home. I feel on tenterhooks about letting them hold DD in case they disappear on a whim!!

Popsy-dinkums - that about sums it up yes!! It's not just DD who has to refer to her as that, everyone does apparently! It's not going to happen.

I might print out some choice quotes from here in very large font and make some post-modern art of my own!

Lock your doors so that they can´t run off!

Would it be better if you went to theirs-so that you can leave when you´ve had enough?

Popsy-dinkums!!!

Agree with your Mum and Bucharest, you need your mum there to balance things. And of course to keep an eye on that door!

Part of me wants to say "let her be a Popsy-dnkums" but no. From my experience my mother started introducing herself as the "Second Mother" with backup from my Dad of course. It was a step too far over the line for me. I grew a backbone and told her she was important as Grandma, no more no less. Glad your DH told her. Good.

Will gladly pull cyber faces for you on sat.

I sort of feel more vulnerable at theirs - it was the first time we went round there since having DD that she walked off - and I know she'd been gagging to get her own way and do her own thing when she was over at my house.

I suppose this way I can get on with things in my own home and not be made to feel out of place. Plus, if I want to leave, I have to rely on DH wanting to drive me back and agreeing (I don't drive - it's better for everyone trust me!) so I'd be at his will too.

Haven't commented before, but have been quitely horrified on your behalf . I know I'm lucky in that, whilst I've had the odd issue with my MIL, I do know that she'd never intentionally do anything to hurt DH, DD or me - she can just get a bit over-enthusiastic... Your MIL sounds awful

Re. Saturday, the only thing that crossed my mind was that getting your mum over could be seen as a big affront - whilst it sounds like the best support for you she also seems to be (however unfairly) the centre of quite a lot of the controversy between you and your MIL. Is there a good friend that could "come round for coffee" (aka keeping you sane, provide moral support and keep a sureptitious eye on the front door ) instead? Not that I think you should bend over backwards to avoid making your MIL unhappy, but equally there's no point in being overly provocative if you can avoid it.

Fingers crossed for you that things go smoothly (or you find a way to get out of the visit entirely)

I know this sounds awful, but ask her or your DH how she would feel if DH and you were to split up over this issue and you got full cutosy of your DD, plus the right to restrict who sees her.

My friend was in a similar situation, and she said this to her DH afetr a particularly harrowing experience. Her DH got the point and realised who his priorities were. She hasn't had a problem since.

TBH though your MIL sounds like a nightmare! And no YANBU... its an awful situation to be in.

Obviously I meant custody not cutosy.

Personally I think having your mum there would be best as you definitely need an ally. A strong one you can depend on. If it looks like it's getting out of hand she can step in. I don't think a friend would be able to do this.

Also the MIL's focus appears to be the comparison between her role and your mum's in the baby's life. If you allow her to dictate whether your mum can be there you are feeding this irrational competition.

Don't entertain any demands from her. Don't take any responsibility for her emotions. You look after you and the baby.

Don't get me wrong - I can see lots of reasons why your mum being there would be a fantastic thing for you. But I also suspect, from what you've said, that her being there would be seen as a big slap in the face to your MIL. If you've agreed to this meeting because you want to try and move things forward and get things on a more positive footing, how is doing that going to help? Even if its just to try and stop things getting worse? I just think that all your other compromises will count for very little if your MIL walks in and see her arch-rival (in her eyes) there.

To me its not about letting your MIL dictate terms (we already know that her version would be your DD at her house and you no-where near, afterall - plus I'm assuming she doesn't even know about your mum's offer, so she's not saying she "can't" be there), its about trying not to make a bad situation worse. But it does depend what other support you could find - I also wouldn't want to be heading into Saturday with no-one beside you!

As to whether a friend could intervene more easily, there are so many variables - given the friction (at least on MIL's side) between your DM and your MIL I can see this as a situation where the right friend would find it easier to deal with things...

(btw AJ, I'm of your DD - mines 2 1/2 and STILL has me up twice a night...)

Yes it's a hard situation. I think in my eyes I almost thought it would be worse bringing a friend into it - it's someone so removed from the situation that MIL, DH etc would just put up their fronts for an audience and nothing would get sorted! I mean Mum offered, and we've since discussed it, and I completely see that it is starting up for a confrontation. (MIL and DM have never met! Wedding was abroad on our own!!)

I just wish that the person there on my side was my DH!! But we all know that's never going to happen!!