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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

'why bottle might be better than breast' - GMTV this morning

409 replies

babyignoramus · 19/08/2009 08:15

Hasn't even been shown yet but can't imagine it's going to go down too well here!!!!

Anyone else going to watch - it's going to annoy the arse off me but I can't seem to tear my eyes away......

OP posts:
weegiemum · 19/08/2009 20:06

The statistics are on here cos someone asked for them. Simple as that.

I'm not smug - but I am glad I was able to bf my babies (and I got no support at all, I know I was lucky).

foreverchanges · 19/08/2009 21:01

second that weegie mum

DreamsInBinary · 19/08/2009 21:07

Nutrionally, FF is not as good as BF, and it carries more risks.

That is not smug; it is fact.

It does not help ff mothers to deny those risks. And it does not help anybody to blow them up out of proportion.

Posters are saying we all know the facts, but there are posts on here questioning that ff carries risks, which negates that.

All these very personal stories add little to the debate, imo.

mathshoneybunny27 · 19/08/2009 21:24

Mmmm. Statistics, as we all know, are only as good as the decisions made by the people who present them. I dislike the phrase carries risks* in this context because it's like saying driving carries risks, as opposed to walking everywhere - true but both impractical and nonsensical in the modern world. For these medical issues to be statistically significant is one thing (assuming this is the case - percentage or ratio figures are not particularly helpful here) but the context needs to be considered too.

I'm sure, as one poster quite rightly pointed out, there are risks associated with breastfeeding (who hasn't felt less safe a driver due to lack of sleep!) but the focus on breastfeeding as the healthy option means we don't consider these significant, rightly or wrongly. Society has created formula feeding as an alternative to breastfeeding - it is a necessary and viable one, and asking which is 'best' generally - without reference to context - is irrelevant unhelpful.

MaggieBeauLeo · 19/08/2009 21:30

foreverchanges, if you're going to quote me, don't add IN a spelling mistake. Thank you very much!

foreverchanges · 19/08/2009 21:40

maggiebeau never even heard of you nevermind quote you ffs

Olifin · 19/08/2009 21:40

But mathshoneybunny feeling too tired to drive safely is a risk associated with lack of sleep which can be brought about by having any baby, whether (s)he is being formula or breast fed!

DreamsInBinary · 19/08/2009 21:42

But Maths, driving does carry risks. We are all aware of that and it is part of the logical decision-making process we make when we get in a car.

Also, as far as I can see the research is very specific with reference to context.

I do (very much) agree with you on stats. And also that ff is a necessary and viable alternative. Nobody is saying 'good' and 'bad', but surely we can appreciate that whilst they are both healthy, nutritionally bf is 'best'?

foreverchanges · 19/08/2009 21:44

or maybe rein in your ego over something so trivial beaulion

gypsymoon · 19/08/2009 21:44

What are these 'risks' of bf of which you speak???

StealthBearWipesBumOnDailyMail · 19/08/2009 21:45

there;s a post further down about the risks

StealthBearWipesBumOnDailyMail · 19/08/2009 21:46

By scarletlilybug on Wed 19-Aug-09 10:13:19
Sorry, it;s miles down - didn't realise thread had got so big

StealthBearWipesBumOnDailyMail · 19/08/2009 21:46

what is wrong with my apostrophes ''''' that's better

gypsymoon · 19/08/2009 21:52

Noooo...that post is related to risks of ff. I know the risks of ff.

mathshoneybunny27 claims there are risks to bf - which have been mentioned??? Maybe she'd care to enlighten me?

foreverchanges · 19/08/2009 21:52

and as for sanctimonious whose being sanctimonious now

ElieRM · 19/08/2009 21:55

I cannot understand how anecdotal evidence is clouding the debate.
The nature of the debate itself is cloudy anyway. As far as I understand, five main points have been raised.

  1. Not everyone understand the importance of breaastfeeding. 2)FF mums often feel guilty for not BFing for whatever reason 3)There is concern there is not enough support for those who wish to BF
  2. People may not be aware of any risks posed by FF, specifically those relating to poor FF.
  3. Women should be able to feel confidant about how they fed their baby. Anecdotal evidence is important because it has the power to support, or contradict any of the above points. Whilst statistics are, of course, relevant and prove a great deal, if we want to change things (and I assume we all do) it is the stoires of women who have had these experience that carry the emotional pull to orchestrate change, rather than statistics. Sending copies of statitics to your Primary Care Trust, or to the minister for health is unlikely to make much difference, as presumable they're ware of them. Sending your stories just might...
captainpeacock · 19/08/2009 22:09

Crikey, sorry lots of messages, haven't read them all. Would say two things, one I am the last of four children and the only one who wasn't breastfed as my mother had an abscess. I am 46 and perfectly healthy. I did not breastfeed my dd as I heamorraghed 4 pints of blood when I was giving birth, which wasn't picked up until they did a blood test on my leaving hospital five days later, then they very urgently called me back for a transfusion, however, by this time my dd had completedly chewed my nipple off in her desperation for some food. Obvioulsy this isnt the way I wanted it. Sometimes life sucks and you have to to with the blows. She is now 13 and perfectly healthy, just like her mum.

secretgardin · 19/08/2009 22:13

my ds was ff due to the fact that he couldn't latch on due to a problem with his muscles (which was diagnosed only recently). at the time i was beating myself up and felt like a total failure, especially through smug bf supposed friends and their 'friendly' advice once i got over them not backing me and not being able to bf, ds and i took to ff like ducks to water and never looked back. he is 8 years old now and although he has problems with his limbs, he rarely suffers from any colds and has a good immune system. when i had my dd i bf her and topped up with a little ff once she was a few months old. worked for me and for her and she was on both untill she decided at 11 months that she prefers the ff. she has had 7 colds at least up to now very different situations, but both has benefits and i wouldn't change the decisions i made as i felt they were right at the time. there is no right or wrong ... anyhoo, i more worried about feeding evil ham to dc now

DreamsInBinary · 19/08/2009 22:17

ElieRM, one example of anedotal evidence clouding the debate would be that there have been a significant number of posters declaring that they/their dc were ff but are healthy and/or their friend's bf baby is sickly and weak.

If we were to go by this small sample of anecdotal evidence alone, we could assume that the stats are actually reversed; that ff produces healthier babies.

From what little I know of decision makers in business, stats have a far greater impact than individual anecdotes. Perhaps not in media, though.

StealthBearWipesBumOnDailyMail · 19/08/2009 22:20

sorry gypsymoon, I am tired

gypsymoon · 19/08/2009 22:26

no worries dearie! I am too - time to get off this thread. It's been going all day and I've barely spoken to my poor DH since he got home...

Goodnight!

KittyTN · 19/08/2009 22:29

I remember a couple of dads-to-be at my NCT breatfeeding evening been very anti-bf. They were unconvinced by the benefits quoted and seemed to feel that there was some kind of conspirancy to falsely promote bf. Neither of their wives bfed. In fact out of 7 women (NCT attenders generally felt to be middle classish and a bit 'try hard') only 2 bf significantly and only 1 exclusively. None of the ff women said it was their choice but several were quite scathing about bf later.

At some point all the stats and professional support just isnt enough. Changing hearts and minds is not at all easy and unsupportive dhs must be very significant.

lola0109 · 19/08/2009 22:33

I know this is going off the topic, but beanieb i'll give you a wee story my HV told me when I had my weaning talk.

She was out visiting a new mum and the baby was feeding well (not sure whether ff or bf) and HV joked oh he'll be on to mince and tatties soon.

She visited new mum at 10 days and low and behold she had tried feeding baby mince and tatties! hmm

Now i know I shouldn't laugh at that as I did silly things with dd when i didn't know better, (too much clothes etc) but I think that was taking it to extremes

Just goes to show how overwhelming it all is at first!

secretgardin · 19/08/2009 22:42

my dh always supported me in whatever decission i made, as i am the boss of my own body. why do people feel they have to keep on making excuses for the choices they make? statistics mean nothing to me, more the individual and why and how they came to bf or ff.

MaggieBeauLeo · 19/08/2009 22:57

Foreverchanges, that's a bit rude! I was the one who said 'rein in the sanctimony' which was later quoted, with a spelling mistake. It's been cleared up now though..