'why bottle might be better than breast' - GMTV this morning

[babyignoramus]

Hasn't even been shown yet but can't imagine it's going to go down too well here!!!!

Anyone else going to watch - it's going to annoy the arse off me but I can't seem to tear my eyes away......

I have never seen it here tbh.Don't think either term is dignified or neccesary.

Cyradis- couldn't agree more. I also think the point FF mums have made about feeling bullied (by and large) is refering to fee;ing bullied when BF isn't working- ie bullied into continuing without appropriate assistance. bullied into continuing despite feeling hopeless and exhausted, terrified your LO is not gaining weight- lots of things.
If the HV or MW helps provide a workable solution and is kind and sympathetic. whilst encouraging mum to continue with BF thats fine. If guilt tripping and bullying is used to make mum continue, that's not right. And I imagine that's what many mums are referring to, rather than claiming they were bullied into BFing in the first place.

Yes, ff mums generally acknowledge that bf is best but it is often not acknowledged that by bf mums that sometimes it is not possible/best for the baby in all circumstances. ff mums do feel bullied into continuing regardless.

You're right about the help and support as well, although I think I would have needed a permanent midwife living with me to have continued with my 1st

We are told BF is best and it is to a certain extent pushed at us. However BF mums are given grief at baby clinics up and down the country as their BF babies do not gain weight in the same way as FF babies and with both my BF children I was threatened with if you don't get the weight on you will have to top up with FF.

In both cases my children were well, gaining weight (albeit slowly), reaching their developmental milestones on time or early and were happy contented children.

This is bullying but from the other side.

Those who choose to BF do not always have it easy you know. They are glared if they dare to feed in public, admonished if they BF a toddler (obviously this is only for their own benefit not the childs ), asked all the time when will you be stopping feeding, asked when will you FF so (insert name) can feed the baby and so on.

To be honest to BF can be a bloody nightmare with all the flak you get given so can we not all just cut each other a bit of slack and get our babies fed by our choice and respect each others choices.

I BF by choice, I want to do it but do not think that I have not felt bullied by the HCP or those who have FF that look down on me as that lentil weaving, yoghurt knitting, lactivist, breastfeeding nazi, insert your own deragatory term there are many on MN.

I don't think anyone doubts that there are valid reasons for ff when the support from HCP is so crappy.
And every mother has the right to choose whether to bf or not.
It doesn't mean that there aren't risks associated with ff.

I think if more people understood these risks then there would be greater pressure to support mothers properly.
Including ensuring that mothers who are ff, for whatever reason, were doing it properly.

exactly - before anyone will put any money into support for bf, there needs to be a general understanding that to do so would benefit health and save money. not just by mothers, but by every voter. Otherwise "breast is best" will carry on being trotted out with the underlying subtext of "but formula is just as good"

I was never bullied by anyone as a bf mum (and I bf 3 children) but the first time I ventured out with dd and a bottle some judgeypants on another table made loud and horrible comments. I had to leave. (after I informed her dd couldn't bf because she was brain damaged) but I didn't go out for along time because of the bottle

How is anyone supposed to know the contents of the bottle any how. Without close up examination on colour texture etc a bottle is just a way of delivering the nutrition. I know some Mums who are BF who do not feel confident when out as have fussy feeders or just do not like being on show that use EBM when out. Tis their business. I shall not judge.

A bottle can contain formula, EBM or juice. Although I would hazard a guess if it looked purple in colour I would think it might be Ribena or orange might be orange juice.

Riven good on you for giving them their change.

well i am doing something practical about it and have trained to be a breastfeeding supporter and am about to start volunteering at the local maternity ward when all the damn CRB checks have been done. Its not one or the other, im giving my time (to those that want it - i wont be looking down my nose at anyone who chooses to ff) but also i feel i have to say something when anyone says "there is no difference between ff and bf". since doing my training i am even more aware of the subtle signals women get that ff is the norm and perfectly acceptable - i looked at teh collage i made of all the "yey baby" cards we were sent and about two thirds had babies bottles on them. Many will think "whats the problem?" but it all feeds into the idea that ff is normal and therefore just as good for mother and baby as bf. Its not - and im trying to help those who want to bf and like me, are finding it difficult.

propoganda in the sense that there ARE other factors besides nutrition in people's decision as to whether bf or ff.

I bf myself, but fgs, rein in the sanctimony and spare a thought for people who are reading this feeling bad they didn't/couldn't bf.

Well said Maggie.

The anecdotal stuff totally gets in the way of the facts, IMO.

On threads like these, there'll always be the 'My DCs were BF but have a raft of health problems' and 'my DCs were FF and are healthy as can be' precisely because these are the exception to the rule. What we never hear is anecdotes about children who were BF and in perfect health (like mine, touchwood) and the FF children who suffer health problems, presumably because these are the more normal outcomes.

...Sorry, by 'normal', I mean 'usual'.

rein in the sanctimony = stop talking about the benefits of breastfeeding

it seems to be the same thing in so many people's eyes

I have to say that there was a brief moment after my failure to bf fully when I read mumsnet and felt guilty, defensive and angry with some of the posters and points made.

But I soon realised that the only person making me feel bad was ME. The facts are out there, saying breast is normal is not an attack on formula feeding, it is a simple statement of fact.

'reign in the sactimony '

breast is best for a simple fact - its what nature intended

all i would like is to see better support for bf mothers from nhs

ff read the instructions

humpreys corner at least you tried which is more than some -you prob werent given enough support to continue ...

humpherys whatever.....
dont feel bad bout not making it through bf
nhs support is lacking to say the least
i bf againnst nhs support (who just told me to ff)
but what do we expect of the nhs ?

reiGN

I knew that

Oh I don't feel bad now.

In fact, due to the successful feeding of dd, I am about to train as a peer group supporter I think it is truly down to the information and perspective given to me by the ladies on the feeding topic, so it makes me cross when they are attacked.

Noooo....I think rein in.

And I'm an English teacher so if I'm wrong about that, I will die of shame.

God almighty...some of the attitudes on here. I tried in vain to BF my baby and it didn't happen, mastitus and thrush in both boobs to start with, milk not comingin for 9 days, baby had 'teeth' buds that were taking two little chunks off my breast everytime she latched on ( and yes she was latching properly ) I was totally exhausted and think that more harm would of come to my baby if hadn't given up BF and gone on to FF.

I don't think people need advice on FF, it's totally simple, you do what it says on the tin. If someone didn't read English I'm sure they would ask for help and not just guess how to do it.

People shouldn't need telling that they shouldn't give chocolate to babies, it's common sense and it says in every book going that babies on need milk for the firts 6 months of their life.

I just feel a few of you are bit OTT on the BF what with all the statistics and bloody figures getting put on here, get a grip!! I also think it is insensitive to go on about 'I'm putting my baby at risk when FF' I cried my eyes out for days when I gave up and it broke my heart to see her rooting, but hey, bully for all the smug BFeeding mothers!

I don't think there's much evidence of smugness on this thread Gillyan Where is it?

Sorry BFing didn't work out for you when you clearly gave it your best shot. You did the best you could and then, when you couldn't continue with it, you gave your DD the only suitable alternative there is. Nothing wrong with that, as far as I can see.

rofl at the thought of a 'new baby' card with a big pink nipple on it....

..it could say inside 'welcome to your beautful new baby, now say goodbye to your beautiful pert boobies...'

Yes I realised I was right the first time.

I am a teacher too, just a very very tired one