To apologise for something that I don't want to?

[thoroughlypissedoff]

Sorry this might be long but I need to give a bit of background!

I have never really been a massive fan of my bil as we have nothing in common, and I don't find his jokes funny, he's arrogant, selfish, chauvinist and stubborn. But alongside this he has also treated my sister pretty badly (books holidays for himself and "the lads" without telling her until last minute (once when she was 8 months pg!), and she is constantly finding girls numbers and suggestive texts on his phone). I have never made my feelings about him known until very recently - they have been together approx 10 years and have a 2yo ds.

Recently she found that he had been on a dating website asking for no strings sex with an older woman plus various messages about meeting up- she was devastated and rang me up in tears saying that she was leaving, had packed up her stuff and was at our mums. I tried to reason with her and say that it could be a joke, or an explanation could be made so she must talk to him first. They talked and he said it would NEVER happen again and he was sorry so she went back home, but 2 days later there were more messages from a woman so she said that was definitely it and went to my mums again. I spoke to her and told her a few home truths along the lines of "you are too good for him, you can do better", and that no-one liked him. Wrong I know, but I was very angry that he had treated her this way. She moved back in within about 12 hours and they seemed to just snap back to normal which I found very odd and was worried for my sister.

I then got an email from him apologising for how he had treated her, but done in a very fascetious(sp) way and also telling me that I should have kept a lid on it and not twisted the knife in.

At the time I was literally shaking with anger so I replied telling him that he had no right to tell me what to do and that he was a philandering idiot and that my sis would have a queue of men lined up if he wasn't around.

Anyway this was weeks ago and there had been no direct communication since, however I keep getting my mum coming on the phone telling me that myself and my dp are not perfect and that she knows things about him (that I have told my sis in confidence, but she has now divulged to my mum in a tit for tat way).

I am getting married in 5 weeks and bil said he is not coming. So I texted him and said "Please will you come to our wedding for my sister's sake as she would be so upset if you couldn't be there, there will not be an atmosphere". I received one back saying he was not coming as I am a shit stirrer, a hypocrite and that I got involved in something I knew nothing about, and that he didn't have the time or energy to speak to me. I have apologised to my sister for the things I said in anger to her about him, and I have said I will be civil to him, and even act as though nothing has happened, but I will not apologise. Now my sis says she will not be my maid of honour anymore and is not coming to wedding either.

I had my mum in tears yesterday saying that she wanted to jump off a building and that her family was splitting up. She actually looked ill.

So now I am thinking that I should apologise to him, even though I don't mean it, just to smooth things over for my mum and sisters sake.

But I just can't stand him getting what he is demanding - I feel like I am giving in to a blackmailer.

If I was in his situation, I think I would be going out of my way to do everything I could to make my wife happy after the distress he's caused her, but he is just making her make a horrible decision.

So what do I do?

Sorry this is so long - thanks for reading!

I am so for you.
I think you need to ring round your family and ask them are they still coming to your wedding, my guess is your sister has been stirring and putting her own spin on it. I think you need to explain the truth

I think you need to tell your dad what is going on too, also I think you need to cut your sister out of your life, and when in the not too distant future her husband legs it and she is in need of your support stay well clear.

She sounds a sad cow who can't live without the drama of her husbands actions, also I guess she is cross with herself for letting you know she has a shame marriage

Yes def stop texting and get some proper conversations.

Horrible situation. You poor thing. You know you've done nothing wrong - you spoke out completely understandably given this scenario.
Obviously I don't know your family beyond what you've mentioned, so bearing that in mind, I think you should probably:

Try and get together with your mum face-to-face soon-ish (is it possible given the 400 miles?). Failing that, flowers and long phone call etc.

Discuss with your Dad asap. Perhaps play down that your mum wanted you to apologise to BIL - I don't know what your mum and dad's relationship is like, but maybe best not to fan the flames of any resentment there, as thet'll both be at your wedding.

re. DSis and BIL - send letter explaining that you wish you had not had to get involved in their troubles, but there is no way you would leave a beloved sister uncomforted in her hour of need. If this means that they will not be attending the wedding, that is their decision. (Leave two places free just in case, but don't tell them this).

I really hope you have a lovely day despite all this - the best answer to all the f*wittage is to glory in your special day.
The very best of luck to you.

I would apologise if you think it will smooth things over for the wedding and then once you are back from honeymoon, i'd tell him why you apologised and that you are not actually sorry. But I can't stand people thinking they have one over on me!

Even better, send him a postcard when you are on honeymoon retracting the apology, tee hee!

JoesMummy and Katisha - the emailing and texting to BIL was only done as he sent me an email and I responded, as if I had had to speak to him verbally I think I would have burst a blood vessell or something. He is very manipulative and interrupts constantly - it's my only way of getting my point across.
I have spoken to my mum and sister lots on the phone, but I only texted her yesterday as she was out with someone else and didn't want to launch into an argument. I am intending to speak to her later today.
KIMI - I really think you are right re my sister - she has told me a lot of bad things about BIL but she is afraid to tell him that she knows (because she's been snooping on his phone and in emails), so he is calling me a liar and she issaying she can't remember any of it!! !!
He has sent me the email below last night and I am going to respond in a civil way so any ideas what to say would be greatly appreciated. It does seem like he is trying to make amends although I am still fuming!!

thoroughlypissedoff,

what can we do to sort out this fucking mess we've got into, when i sent that email weeks ago to apologise for you getting involved i meant every word i said, i wasn't pushed or asked to do it, i did it for all of us. what happened between myself and sister is now in the past and that's were we all want it to be. thoroughlypissedoff i was upset to read your email, i never knew you felt like that about me, it came as a complete shock, i don't know what i have done to you but whatever it is it wasn't intentional. i honestly thought that we were close and we all had a laugh and a giggle when we got together. I'm not demanding an apology i just cant brush this under the carpet, you said alot of things that were true but you also said some things that are not, and i felt at that time you were not helping the situation, that's all i meant. as far as I'm aware you've said all this stuff about me and you don't want me to go to your wedding, so see it from my point of view, if the shoe was on the other foot, would you want to go to a wedding knowing that??? so at the present my situation hasn't changed I'm only doing what you want and what is best for everyone as there will be tension in the air and that's not fair on you, you know, even after all the nasty things you said I'm hoping that we can move on from this, if you really meant everything you said then i don't think there is any way back for us, but i just hope (I've got my fingers crossed too) you have said these things in the heat of the moment, to which i understand we all say things we don't mean at times, but at the same time once things calm down, we all say sorry and move on, and i want to move on but cant at the moment. you should be looking forward to your big day its only 4 weeks or so to go and i don't want any of this crap that's going on i just want us all to be looking forward to it, i didn't want any of this as you know, as it was on the last email the way i felt about this family. but WE need to put things right.

THOROUGHLYPISSEDOFF. I, BIL APOLOGISE FOR ANYTHING I HAVE DONE TO UPSET YOU AND JUST WANT TO MOVE ON

there its not that difficult, so its up to you, but there is 1 condition, i see you before the wedding for a hug to clear the air

hope to talk soon

bil

manipulative manipulative manipulative!! (him not you)
As one who has been in your dsis position and I know my sis was pulling her hair out much sympathy!
She will only leave when she is ready and anything you say or do will only push her away.....

That looks like an olive branch to me.
I would accept his overtures and say "yes, of course it was all in the heat of the moment, as I said before."

Then have the wedding.

Then afterwards - well it'll be interesting won't it!

Ok all, I have replied to the email - it was very long. I apologised for getting involved but did not apologise directly for what I had said. Told him that if he's going to act like that then he has to expect the repercussions(sp). But ended it by saying I hope they will be happy together.
He texted and said thanks and that as far as he is concerned it is all done and dusted now.
Thank goodness for that.
But sister is still being bit of a nut! After going on and on for me to apologise to him, I finally say I will smooth things over and she tells me just to "accept" his email and not to write one back!!!???????
So I'm afraid I then lost it a bit with her and said "i'm doing this for you, i'll say what I like, have some gratitude"

I think you have handled this really well. Thank goodness the wedding won't be a battlefield.
I very much doubt is is "done and dusted" though but at least you don't have to worry about it for the moment!

TPO If I were you I would keep the emails and texts he and your sister send you showing what a pair of idiots they are (who whole heartedly deserve each other) and send them to the whole family (by accident) the day after your wedding.

Oh yes have kept them all and will be presenting to my mum, but honestly, she is just as deluded as them most of the time - brainwashed I think.
At times I feel a sense of relief that I live so far away!

Do let us know how your wedding goes. xx

Sorry to resurrect this old post, but I have realised that I did not give an update on the wedding.

Things slowly smoothed over with sister and two days before the wedding I spoke to BIL to apologise again face to face for getting involved. Even though I had no desire to and didn't really mean it, I am all for smoothing things over, especially as I had more important things to worry about. He didn't take it that well, and kept trying to bring stuff up and slag off my DH, but luckily my mum and stepdad were there to calm things etc.

My sister told me though that he had felt much better after that about everything.

The day of the wedding came and he did not speak to me at all, no congratulations or smile or anything.

As he was driving, my mum had instructed him to take my DS in the car - something I was not happy about, but wasn't going to argue about anything else with her.

During the ceremony, my mother did not look at me once. I kept looking over out of the corner of my eye, but she was more interested on feeding sweets to sister's ds who was sitting with BIL anyway. I felt, and still do feel very upset about this.

My mum did not say congrats either, or that I looked nice, or anything complimentary at all.

To be fair, my grandad (her dad) was on his last legs in a nursing home, and she was very anxious about that, but I still feel she could have raised a smile for me.

The part that really angered me was that when all the speeches had finished, my mum stood up. I had no idea that she was going to do this. She started talking about sisters and how you have your sister for longer than any other person in your life. Then she said "I used to think we were a happy little bunch, but then one got married, and now the other one is getting married and I just hope we can all carry on being friends". So obviously at this point all the guests are going .
Then she says "I already have one in son in law, and if MrTPS can be half as good as son in law number one (BIL) then he'll be alright in my book".
FFS.
I was fuming. So was DH, and his mum and dad, and after speaking to them, all my friends.

Anyway the wedding went on, they all went home, and we had a great time.

After that, even though we were furious over all the goings on, we decided to not mention it, especially as my poor grandad passed away on the first day of our honeymoon.

Anyway, things with my sister were much better, spoke to her lots on the phone, sent BIL birthday pressie, all ok.

Then we went up to visit at Christmas.

Sister starts being all quiet for no reason the day before New Year, and then says, "Will you do something for me?" Me "Yes of course", Her "Will you apologise to BIL?"
Me
I told her that I had apologised to him twice already under duress, and why did I need to again?

Well she started going into it all again, how he feels, how she feels, how my mum feels blah blah.

I can only imagine it had been brought up as we were due to be having a family dinner the next day, and we would all be sitting round the table together, something that DH and I were perfectly fine with, but that BIL was obviously not.

Ended up having a huge argument with sis and my mum and they were just sitting there going on about how they would do anything for me and that they couldn't get over how I would not do this "one thing" that my mum had asked me to do - apologise to BIL.

Anyway we had the meal the next day, he turned up, was civil to me, but pretty much ignored DH. DH and I both tried really hard to be normal.

Thought everything was maybe ok, but haven't heard a peep from sis since - that was 2 weeks ago.

Sorry this is so long and rambling - but I just don't know what to do now.

My mum who normally rings every day has also been very scarce - I am just so confused and also hurt at this whole situation .

For god sake how much more apoligising (not that i think you should of anyway) do they want. How absolutly ridiculas!!

Your going to be constantly walking on eggshells around this man from now on if you keep giving into your families demands.

He's managed to turn the whole situation around to make you come out as the baddie and him the hurt party to take away what he's done.

I wonder if he is saying sorry every ten minutes to your sister for what he did like he is trying to make you do?

I would suggest a final disucssion, face to face if you can although over the phone if not, with both your sister and her dp on the line. Something along the lines of It was a horrible time for everyone, and you are sure that everyone involved has said things they regret and that you hope that you can all move on from this now.

If pushed further simply say that you reacted in a way that should be understandable when seeing a beloved sister in so much pain.

what I do with my sisters boyfriend is side step the whole issue act friendly but never apologize and make it clear I am no fan of his whenever i get the chance. It has worked so far.

Wow that is all so hard. Rationally you should not apologise. You already have and your mum milked it all at your wedding (though I understand she must have been hurt and worried). However it depends on how you feel alienating tham for a while?

Perhaps you should start calling the shots and say that if they want you in there lives they are just going to have to drop it?

Up til now perhaps you have just been too nice?

I have just read all this for the first time and am speechless. You seem to have tried so hard, and for your mum to say all that at the wedding is appalling.

I would walk away. what Theochris says.

Walk, walk, walk... all they are doing is giving you grief, your family is DH and your DC, although it would be ideal to get along with Dsis, she is causing you more harm than good now.

Am them taking the fuckwits side

You don't need the hassle

Thank you for your replies.

There is so much more that has happened, little things, for example that when I thought everything was back to normal pre Christmas, I stupidly naively told my sis about an argument I had with DH's ex, and asked her not to tell my mum as I didn't think she needed the stress of it, and have since found out that she told her.

Also after the argument at New Year, I texted sis to say I was sorry for having a rant, but that I was just frustrated with the length of time this has been going on for (since June!). I also said that I never ever meant to hurt her and that I loved her. She completely ignored it.

I know that I am no saint, I passed comment on him, and probably did say some hurtful things, but I have apologised to him and to my sister, and to my mum for not being able to do the thing she asked of me (even though I did in the end).

You are right MsSpentYoof, I don't need the hassle.

I haven't made any effort to contact them since Christmas, but I can't help but think they will all be bitching about me, and saying things like "I can't believe she's not phoned, that's out of order"

I have just red this whole thing for the first time and I am gobsmacked. What do these people want you to do - write it in blood?!?!

Personally, if my mother had stood up and said such things at my wedding, that would have been it for me. It's one thing to have these arguments in private but to attempt to humiliate someone in the middle of what is supposed to be the happiest day of their life...? What kind of person does such a thing...?! And your POOR DH, to have to hear such an insult at his own wedding

You really need to step back from all this and leave them to it. You have done more than enough to satisfy your own conscience and you are bringing nothing but stress to your lives. If they love your BIL so much, leave them to enjoy each other's company and I would simply refuse to discuss it any further - no emails, no phone calls, no texts. Everything is simply more fuel on this fire

I have also just read this whole thread, open mouthed with outrage.

You really should not have to apologise AGAIN for something that really didn't warrant an apology in the first place.

Why is your sis (and mum) bringing this up now, 6 months later? Why do they want you to apologise again? Do they think your apologies back in July were not sincere perhaps (well we know they weren't but then how could they be in the circumstances)?

I agree that this man is somehow manipulating your mum and sis against you. It must seem very easy to do since he lives in their pockets and you are so far away. It's all part of his little power game really - and quite sad if this is how he gets his kicks (when he's not looking for casual sex on the Internet that is ). I also agree with what somebody else said - that he is using the argument with you to deflect from his own blame and guilt over what he did to your sis.

I think you need to stand firm now. State (in a letter maybe?) to your sister and your mum that you have said all you are ever going to say on the subject, that you have moved on and thought everyone had. Tell them you love them very much and that even though you have also been massively hurt over the whole issue (cite wedding day issues) you expect no apologies from anyone, just for everyone to move on from it all, as you have.

Totally agree with Squitten and MrsSawdust. I'd also state in the letter that your actions were motivated by nothing other than love. Then ask the question about BIL's motivation for doing what he did (without which, let's not forgot, none of this would have happened).

What a total wanker. I think you might have to play the long game on this one - your sister will wake up to his shortcomings properly at some point but it may be years down the line.

I've only read the first and last pages so sorry if someone has already suggested this. Is there any chance that you have become the common enemy needed to patch their marriage up? If they're busy bitching about everything you've done wrong they'll be too busy to focus on BIL's behaviour. That's why they're not keen to let it srop. Not sure why your mother is behaving like this tbh, sounds pretty nasty.