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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to regret giving my dd a gay packed lunch?

518 replies

pointydog · 30/06/2009 20:35

Dd1 (12) was off on a fun school trip today with a mix of kids from high school.

I suggested a few things for her packed lunch this morning and she went off happily with a peanut butter sandwich, a fruitus bar, a kitkat, some dried apricots, a tub of home-made muesli and a bag of chipsticks.

The tuff kids laughed at her lunch - snorting particularly loudly at the apricots - and called it gay.

I feel like the mum in About A Boy.

OP posts:
KittyBigglesworth · 01/07/2009 14:14

Morloth, just suppose one day (God forbid) you or a loved one lost their sight or became disabled, would it be much comfort to know that 'cripo' or 'shit-eye' was the latest in word? Why use a word that is offensive when you can rib using so many others

stillstanding · 01/07/2009 14:14

"Gay(or ghey as it is spelled in online games) is now an insult, the word has moved on. The kids don't care that you find it offensive and have all this background. They just don't care, neither do I and I don't believe that the majority of the population gives a fuck really either."

Morloth, what planet are you on? Only a very small (and particularly dim) proportion of the population would not know that gay meant homosexual. It is used as an insult by the ignorant and the prejudiced but that doesn't mean the word has "moved on". And any half-decent person who thought about this for more than 10 seconds would give a lot more than a fuck really. FGS

Fennel · 01/07/2009 14:15

Some people are pretty clear about their sexual orientations at 5, yes. one of my lesbian friends insists she always knew. Others weren't clear til later.

5yos can have quite strong sexual feelings. Not all, but some.

motherinferior · 01/07/2009 14:17

But how on earth do you explain - or explain away - your lesbian and gay friends and relatives, MissSunny?

MissSunny · 01/07/2009 14:17

Message withdrawn

MissSunny · 01/07/2009 14:18

Message withdrawn

Morloth · 01/07/2009 14:18

You can't fight it though. They don't care and the more we oldies waffle on about it the harder they are going to push and see just how offensive they can be.

Spaz was a common one when I was a kid, then I grew up. These kids will use Gay, then they will grow up and their kids will use something else.

You can tell your kids not to use and it and why and they will probably not use it again in your presence but you have bugger all chance of changing it long term.

seeker · 01/07/2009 14:18

Seeker -"But what the word actually means is a homosexual person" To you. To kids hwho may not even know about homosexuality, it means crap/naff."

Any responsible parent would, on discovering that their child was giving offence through ignorance explain, so that they would know not to give offense again.

MissSunny · 01/07/2009 14:19

Message withdrawn

Morloth · 01/07/2009 14:19

It doesn't help that both my younger brother and favourite nephew are both fabulous young gay things and regularly use the word themselves.

MissSunny · 01/07/2009 14:20

Message withdrawn

BalloonSlayer · 01/07/2009 14:20

Viktoria, Thanks. I hope you didn't think I was asking as a criticism. You'll see from my posts earlier I am frequently at a loss as to how to challenge "gay," and wanted to know whether I could use your ideas with impunity.

daftpunk · 01/07/2009 14:21

hey VM..no worries, it is hard when all your life you've been told that hetrosexuality is normal...you get married and you have kids..that's it...very black & white, "this is right, that is wrong"....no grey areas.

Morloth · 01/07/2009 14:22

MissSunny my DS is aware of gay relationships if by aware you mean that "Uncle Peter and his boyfriend are coming to dinner" means aware.

He doesn't care or give it a second thought. No idea that there is anything unusual in people of the same sex having relationships because there really isn't anything remarkable about it.

ViktoriaMac · 01/07/2009 14:22

LG, I'm not entirely sure why it's so out of control now, perhaps maybe that teenagers will always want to use insulting words that they feel belong to their generation and most other forms of insult are now deemed totally unacceptable. I was speaking to a parent of a Northern Irish friend some years ago who pretty much predicted the terrible racist attacks that are now happening in Belfast, thugs will always find a target. "Gay" as an insult will disappear once it is challenged enough, by EVERYONE, but something equally as offensive will come around and the whole battle will start again.

Sunny - I am referring to teenagers, but if I had younger pupils I would simply say that gay people are boys who love boys or girls who love girls and that it's silly to call a bag (or whatever) "gay" as bags can't be in love. But then I'm not primary trained and have no contact with little ones.

Rhubarb · 01/07/2009 14:24

Not read the whole thread, just the OP and first few posts.

Just wanted to say that I work in a primary school and the word gay doesn't necessarily mean homosexual. It's now used to describe something or someone that is naff.

Also, my dcs take healthy packed lunches to school, full of fruit and veg, no crisps, no fruit juice, no chocolate. dd has put up with some comments and now gets called 'the fruit and veg girl', but she isn't bothered in the slightest.

MissSunny · 01/07/2009 14:25

Message withdrawn

seeker · 01/07/2009 14:25

"Well then there must be an awful lot of irresponsible parents in this country because a HUGWE majority of kids in certain areas use the word gay!"

Yes, there are.

I am surprised that reception children use the word"gay" as an insult - I thought it started later. But if they do, they should be told not to. I stopped my ds using the word "fuck"

According to your theory I shouldn't have, because the meaning of "fuck" has moved on, and it now just means "oh bother" After all, they are all saying it.....

stillstanding · 01/07/2009 14:25

Morloth, I do understand what you are saying about it being hard to change teenage lingo but surely your view on this is too pessimistic?

As a child/teenager I knew (having been taught by my parents etc) that some words were just out of bounds. I would be appalled if my DS used gay as an insult and he would never do so in my presence. It's true that I wouldn't be able to control what he did when he wasn't with me and that he probably would use it at some time or another due to peer pressure or whatever but I like to think that he would be a bit if he did.

The point is though that you can't just ignore this and say "kids will be kids". They need to be pulled up on it.

MissSunny · 01/07/2009 14:26

Message withdrawn

motherinferior · 01/07/2009 14:27

Well, presumably all the reception age kids at my daughters' school know, because one of the lesbian parents rather tragically died recently.

At my nephews' school the head teacher had what was by all accounts a whale of a civil ceremony recently, so it's hardly going to be a big secret there either. And in any case that school's packed with lesbian parents too.

GetOrfMoiLand · 01/07/2009 14:27

Dd and her group of friends call each other lesbians as a form of mild piss-taking - possible like calling each other divs or saddos.

I didn't have a clue until one of her mates came round, they were in the garden and I heard dd's friend say to dd 'oh shuddup, you lesbian'.

I spoke to dd about it - she seemed to think there was nothing in it. I was not happy for the reasons that LeninGrad says above. My mother and one of my aunts are gay, mym mum has been out for about 25 years, my aunt 18 years or so.

I asked dd (13 btw) what she thinks her nan and aunt would say if she knew that she was using lesbian as an (albeit mild) insult. I asked her how hurt they would be.

DD knows what I feel about it and knows absolutely not to use lesbian, gay, poof whatever as an insult. Funnily enough Ithought she would have worked it out for herself.

I do think that she and her friends say it without thinking and she wasn't being malicious, but also I am sure that back in the day when people used insults like mongoloid, spastic etc they weren't being necessarily hostile, just thoughtless and ignorant. Doesn't make it right, though.

Morloth · 01/07/2009 14:28

I don't see any reason to bring up the subject out of context to be honest MissSunny, it will come up in any case, then your reaction and explanation matters.

But I don't get why people think you need to bring it up. I don't tell DS about lots of stuff, cause he hasn't asked and it hasn't come up.

Rafi · 01/07/2009 14:29

Miss Sunny - I can understand it not coming up without a context

Rhubarb - I heard a child at my DD's brownie pack saying, "Well, you like CAULIFLOWER! Obviously meant as a pretty deadly insult.

ViktoriaMac · 01/07/2009 14:30

@ Seeker. Another one I will not tolerate without questioning.

Pupil: "Agh, look at these fucking chips man."

Me (walking past, craning neck to look at chips): "Really, chips having sex? That's amazing, let me see."

Maybe I intervene too much, but I do think it is our responsibility as adults to drum into pupils what is acceptable and what is not. They are children (even at 16) they need guidance. Teachers and parents who turn the other cheek are advocating such behaviour.