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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that good manners in children are overrated?

273 replies

mrsruffallo · 19/05/2009 11:01

Manners seem so important to some parents. Personally, I don't believe in forcing them to say sorry, please, thank you, hello, goodbye etc.
If it is a genuine emotion they say it naturally anyway
AIBU?

OP posts:
Stinkermink · 19/05/2009 20:29

My own father has terrible manners. He is privately educated the lot and yet it would never occur to him to say thank you for anything. It drives me nuts. These thing are not picked up, they are trained into you. An example, DS asked granddad to pass him the salad cream at dinner, DS said thank you granddad. Granddad said nothing. DS was waiting and waiting and I said, "Granddad? He's welcome isn't he?" At that point dad realised and said "oh yes, you're welcome." I have to say manners were never taught to me by my middle class parents, but my "working class" husband was astonished by my manners when he met me! So it is very important.

NeedaNewName · 19/05/2009 20:32

I have to say I too think YABU, I don;t think we teach our children manners enough these days (I'm not that old honestly!)

And its not jsut about please and thank you. I can't stand the way some children talk to their parents and get away with it. Hugely disrespectful and it does a diservice to the child too.

Now I'm also against forcing a child to say please and thank you, but if you start early enough (whats with this 4 - 5 years crap?), and before anyone starts of course I realise that a 6 month old can't say thank you, however you can say it on ther behalf so its a word they are used to hearing and as they learn to talk they'll have good manners

piscesmoon · 19/05/2009 20:37

It is just a question of being polite to your DC and expecting them to be polite back, -just do it in the way that NeedaNewName describes and it becomes automatic. I don't think that I know a single teacher who doesn't say that they are sometimes shocked by the way that some children speak to their parents.

Noonki · 19/05/2009 20:38

my DS2 hit me in the face today, and when I sad it hurt he said

''orry mummy'

It stopped me feeling cross and upset

he was two last week.

it's how society works

FrankMustard · 19/05/2009 20:59

Stinkermink I totally agree with you on the thank you letter side of things. I am tempted not to bother buying things for children who year after year don't even acknowledge the fact that they have been sent a present!

I don't agree with the posters who say that they hate hearing parents prompting their children to "say thank you" or "what do you say?" when they've been given something but not thanked the person for whatver it is. I have always said to my boys from being babies, "thank you" as I pass something to them or "how do we ask nicely ?" or "we're missing the magic word.." if they've asked for something without saying please.
I'd far rather hear a parent making the effort to help their child in future life by instilling manners in them than see parents, like some who've posted on here, who can't be bothered because they lamely think their children will automatically become well mannered just by chance!
Parenting isn't just about the fun stuff - we have a responsibility to help our children as they grow and become involved in society and the world.

nzshar · 19/05/2009 21:01

Have to say I am sitting firmly on the fence with this one. I am not into insisting that manners were used when ds was younger (2 or 3) but am starting to expect manners now he is almost 5. I think manners by example is very important. Whenever ds asks for something and says thank you after the fact I have always said "your welcome" this has now become part of his vocab. Please and thank yous were always encouraged but not insisted especially if to a stranger eg lady in shop etc. Hello's and goodbyes when arriving at someones house or when they are leaving our house have always been more important to me because they are truely a social grace in my opinion.

Thunderduck · 19/05/2009 21:04

YABU. Manners are extremely important, and there's nothing cuter than seeing a young child say thankyou to a bus driver when he gets off the bus. It's adorable.

nzshar · 19/05/2009 21:10

Sorry but thank you letters are just plain weird imho. Maybe that is a cultural thing having my childhood in a different country. When we were given presents by people we either said thank you in person or on the phone. I was always told that you do not give to receive I think that is better manners than to expect thanks.

chegirl · 19/05/2009 21:35

I used to be complimented on my DD's and DS1's manners when they were little. I didnt see what all the fuss was about. I had taught them please and thankyou etc from v.early. I assumed all children were like this. I couldnt understand why people kept commenting on my kids in particular.

THEN they started to have friends home after school. Good bloody Lord above The manners on these kids were bloody shocking! I was absolutly amazed at just how rude some of these kids were. It made them seem very unpleasant and socially inept. And I stopped inviting the rude ones round.

So who suffered? The kids not the parents who thought manners were overated

My DS2's manners are not brilliant as he has learning difficulties. I really struggle with how he may appear to those who dont know him. Even though he finds learning hard I still think its really important to help him by instilling good manners into him.

One of the best things we can do for our kids is to help them be likable. Its our job innit?

piscesmoon · 19/05/2009 21:49

'One of the best things we can do for our kids is to help them be likable.'

I think so.
Mine have always been liked and welcomed into people's houses because they are polite.
It stands out a mile-just something simple like saying thank you if someone holds open the door for you. I have to say that I am saddened by the amount of adults who expect a DC to hold open the door but them don't bother to say thank you! It should work both ways.

ra29needsabettername · 19/05/2009 22:32

yanbu
All the other posters are weird...
manners help kids get by in the world (as demonstrated by weirdy other mn posters here) but that makes them helpful rather than worthwhile imo. I don't want ds to say sorry unless he means it personally and really please is just a WORD...
How anyone can judge children on these things is beyond me.

roundwindow · 19/05/2009 22:58

yanbu
I think consideration and kindness are important, of course, but manners in the way that other grown-ups are so quick to praise are too often too stifling and formal for children to really develop their own sense of empathy/social understanding. I'm not a big fan of learning parrot fashion

I think the main thing for me is to always try to speak to them in the way I'd like them to speak to others. It amazes me how children are so often expected to say please-thank you-excuse me when so much of what they hear addressed to them is 'mind out the way', 'come here NOW', 'put that down!' etc. etc.

The one rule for you and another for me thing isn't great for developing their self-esteem, imho.

FrankMustard · 19/05/2009 23:10

I don't think any of us who promote good manners behave differently from the way we try and encourage our children to behave, so it's not one rule for us and one rule for them.
As far as people judging children on their manners, of course people take a view on people based on how they behave - that's what human life and human interaction is all about! To believe honestly that whether people say please or thank you is irrelevant in how they will get on in life, is naive. We live in a society and there are ways to interact with others within society and having good manners is one way of getting along nicely with others and being respected and liked. No-one wants to spend time with people who can't be bothered to show politeness and if you honestly don't see that manners are important in life, well, as another poster put earlier, that's very telling......

roundwindow · 19/05/2009 23:15

I think manners are very important in life, I do my best to be a kind and considerate person amongst all I come into contact with and hope that my DCs will foster the same values. I just don't think that adults' expectations of children to say/do the right thing at the right time are always very realistic or helpful in developing a genuine sense of caring and empathy for others.

SOLOisMeredithGrey · 19/05/2009 23:18

ra29, people are judgemental.

IMO, without good manners we might just as well be dogs out in the street fighting over a bone, no manners necessary there...

My Dd is just learning to say excuse me instead of 'move' and I do wonder where she gets it from. I'd be horrified if she told my mum or dad or worse still, a complete stranger to 'move'. Move is an order, excuse me is a polite request.

busterhymen · 20/05/2009 00:03

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

Original poster
mrsruffallo · 20/05/2009 07:52

I would like to wholeheartedly thank everyone who posted on here.
I think has turned into an interesting debate, for which I am extremely grateful.

OP posts:
thirtypence · 20/05/2009 08:03

Over doing "sorry" for a child of under say 3 seems counterproductive and pointless. But Please and Thank you are essential.

messymissy · 20/05/2009 08:14

Manners are important, its these little gestures of acknowledgment and consideration that help foster good relationships and concern for other people, they are the building blocks.

it should not be forced however.

Children learn best when following the parents example, i always say please and thankyou when appropriate so my dd hears me and does the same. i say please and thank you to her when we are doing things around the house, and sorry when necessary, ie if i caught a tangle in her hair or so on. Subsequently she says these things to me and others without prompting and she is only 2. At a recent party, she was the only one to say thank you when handed her party bag!

sorry is not just a word, yes it is difficult to get a small child to understand the concept of regret for their behaviour, for any harm they have caused, that the word sorry conveys, but it is very important to teach them to apologize as their ability to understand increases with age - it helps them learn to take responsibility for their words and actions.

roundwindow, you are right - they need to learn genuine concern and empathy behind the 'manners'

sorrytonamechange · 20/05/2009 08:22

have missed everything and haven't disagreed with you before but on this one I think you are mad

as you were

sorrytonamechange · 20/05/2009 08:27

actually maybe some of those who disagree should try living in a place where there isn't even a word for please in the language

you say "give that to me" or "you do that for me now"

it's weird and hardening and not very nice

HopeForTheBestExpectTheWorst · 20/05/2009 08:44

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn on request of the poster.

Natt82 · 20/05/2009 08:55

I think YABU - I think manners are extremely important and I do teach my sons it.

My 2yr old says please, thankyou and sorry. He also says pardon me.

My 14mo's 1st word at 11months was Ta when handed his sandwich.

I feel really uncomfortable round children who have no manners at all, and snatch/expect/grab.

I dont think a child should be 4-5 before they are taught these words, IMO they should be an early part of their language.

Natt82 · 20/05/2009 08:56

teach my sons it? I meant teach them to my sons.

MillyR · 20/05/2009 09:04

I think manners are important, but I am quite surprised by how many other people on this thread feel the same way.

A while ago there was a thread about children's behaviour in restaurants, and many posters felt it was acceptable for children to get down from the table in a restaurant and start wandering or running around, playing and going over to other people's tables.

Surely knowing how to behave in places outside of your own home is an essential part of good manners?

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