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Original poster

Should this really have been shown on the lunchtime news?

156 replies

EasterBump · 05/05/2009 15:47

I was totally shocked & unprepared to witness those scenes of Marnie Pearce saying goodbye to her children on the lunchtime news today.

I have not followed her case in any level of detail, but surely there are no circumstances that can excuse putting innoccent children through that?

There's a link to the footage here.

Just as a kind of warning, I found it particularly harrowing. Not sure it should really have been shown on the lunchtime news without some kind of a warning really.

OP posts:
Morloth · 05/05/2009 18:51

I think you must have a vastly different experience of fathers than I do sachertorte.

The moronic part of my comment was to do with the complete and utter irrelevance of Greensneeze's comment to the thread being discussed.

BottySpottom · 05/05/2009 18:53

I don't have a problem with adults seeing it at that time if it raises awareness, but not children. Whether those children see their mother again or not, I hate to think of the damage done to them psychologically. No child should have to witness that.

HellHathNoFury · 05/05/2009 18:56

well actually DH and I both work full time and I'd be lying if I said I did the lions share of the work.
DH is bloody amazing and does virtually everything.

But I still know that if it came to it, chances are I'd be given custody, because that's how it works in the UK.

I feel terribly for the woman on the news. Just as I feel terrible for all the good fathers in the UK in a similar situation.
And there are a lot.

sachertorte · 05/05/2009 19:02

Morloth, the statistics show that a very very high proportion of Fathers have absolutely no contact whatsoever with their children within a few years of separating from the Mother..

I don´t deny there are good Fathers around. I´m married to one!

But if we split, I don´t think shared split custody is in the interest of the children, and his access to them would sadly but inevitably be limited. I think regular switiching between homes in term time is not in the kids interests. And weekend holiday contact (25 days/year?) is limited contact.

choufleur · 05/05/2009 19:11

i don't think father's contact with children in the UK bears any relevance to the OP. this mother will not be allowed to visit the country where her children live, she has no legal rights in that country (men do have rights here, although i totally agree the law favours women) and her ex-husband doesn't seem to be a reasonable man who will take his children to another counrty so she can see them and vice versa - i wonder whether he will even let her have nay contact with her children.

Notalone · 05/05/2009 19:16

I don't wish to debate this at all but my god I couldn't watch the end of that video. That poor poor woman and her children. It was traumatising to watch so god knows what she is feeling. She must be besides herself I tried to sign the petition but it won't let me. Does anyone know where else I can sign it or if it is closed now

sachertorte · 05/05/2009 19:19

I think Xenia moved the thread on at 17.34 to how badly done to men are in the UK in custody cases.

My guess is it´s certain the husband in the OP will deny his wife any contact with her children, completely unjustifiably, one presumes from what we know of the case.

Xenia then tried to compare the position of Fathers in the UK with this woman´s position. There is no comparison.

sachertorte · 05/05/2009 19:31

A few statistics for those of you who are interested,

in 52% of divorced families with children aged 11 - 16 the last contact fathers had had with their children was one or more years previously

25% of fathers had had NO contact with their children over the previous five years

Amongst parents separated for ten years or more, 64& of fathers had no contact with their children.

One in six childen had weekly contact with their father.

Contact has improved since the 1980s but the conclusion remains that over time the vast majority of children will have no contact with their fathers.

ChippingIn · 05/05/2009 19:34

What an utter, utter bastard. Hearing that little boy pleading with his father was heartbreaking.

If I was that woman (god forbid), it would have taken a lot more than that greasy bastard, and the woman, to get my kids in the car, a lot more. There is always somewhere to hide.

Off to find the petition...

Poor, poor little kids...

scaredoflove · 05/05/2009 19:35

I agree men have to face this everyday

I've been divorced 10 years and I know for a fact my ex loves our children as much as I do. Such a stupid statement to say men don't

If I stopped his contact you can bet you would hear that same gutteral cry from him

Longtalljosie · 05/05/2009 19:35

That doesn't actually prove anything though does it Sachertorte? Because those stats don't distinguish between the father who's fighting tooth and nail and is being denied contact, and the father who's not making an effort. It's just raw data. You could read it whichever way you like.

ChippingIn · 05/05/2009 19:38

Oh and BTW OP - YABVU. Of course it should be shown on the news - often. Anything that brings awareness to a situation that we can possibly help with, should be on the news. I, for one, am off to sign the petition. I don't watch the lunchtime news because I don't want LO (just 2) subject to what is on it (and no, let's not start that debate again!! Each to their own), so I didn't see it. You do have an off button if the kids are around...

sachertorte · 05/05/2009 19:41

Hi Longtall, yes, for sure there are fathers who will fight tooth and nail to get access to their children. And their are Mothers, who wrongly try and prevent the father from having access. Who else can be blamed if not the fathers, if the reality is that the vast majority of children of separated parents will have no contact with their fathers...

Genuine question btw. How do you read the stats? I just see the pattern.

Greensneeze · 05/05/2009 19:42

My comment was rather bitchy wasn't it, I apologise for it

I forgot myself because Xenia and I have sparred on these issues so many times on different threads and I know she doesn't give a fuck what I think about her anyway (and nor should she)

but it was out of order and I sincerely apologise, to Xenia and to everyone else on the trhead who read it.

Longtalljosie · 05/05/2009 19:50

Well, you can't read anything into them, that's my point - except there's something very wrong with the continuation of male parenting post-divorce in many cases. You'd need to see some sort of statistical breakdown of what effort they'd made. And that would be a hard thing to quantify.

lilymolly · 05/05/2009 19:57

Oh I watched this too today, and I was very upset.
I think their was a warning that their may be some harrowing scenes, but I felt compelled to watch it for some reason

It was horrific, but I do think it brings her case to the forefront of the media again, which can only be a good thing, as she has now been given permission to stay in the country to fight for custody, rather then be deported back to the uk.

sachertorte · 05/05/2009 19:59

Thanks LOngTall..

Green, that was a nice post.

katiestar · 05/05/2009 20:11

Ok so why is it that when apartheid was going on in South Africa ,sanctions were imposed on her.They weren't allowed to take part in the Olympics etc.Yet we do not impose the same conditions on countries that discriminate against women.
Why is race discrimination deplorable but sex discrimination OK ?

choufleur · 05/05/2009 20:42

oil!

Noonki · 05/05/2009 20:42

Shouts and appaluds Xenia.

Unfortuanatley though legally the situation in the UK is different to that which Marnie is suffering the end result for fathers who are denied access for reasons other than the welfare of their children is identical.

They do not get to see their children and their children do not get to see them.

I know two men that are good fathers have been completely denied the right to see their children because of issues the mother's have.

At the end of the day it is exactly the same for them as for this poor woman.

They never get to see their children for through no fault of their own.

Of course not all fathers should be given access the same as nor should all mothers but the starting point in a court of law should be equal instead of biased to the mother regardless of wether in the majority of cases the children should end up with their mother.

as for wether it should be shown on the news is difficult.

should any traumatic footage be shown? imo yes if the end justifies the means and in this situation it will as hopefully it will.

Last week the news showed a woman grieving over her dead childs body. Should that not have been shown, be pretty much weekly we are shown such footage?

Nighbynight · 05/05/2009 21:35

Could those of you who support Xenia's point of view, please bear in mind, that violent and abusive men like my ex, merely have to start crying that the wicked mother is keeping their children away from them and almost everyone who hears it, assumes it's true without any proof.
My ex has roped people into helping him kidnap his children and demand a RANSOM from me to return them, becuase those stupid people believed that he was one of these hard done by fathers.

redsock · 05/05/2009 21:55

Oh for gods sake what a load of old shite being posted.
I can tell you now, that no court will allow a mother to prevent contact for NO REASON.

Where a good dad has a bitch of an ex who wants him out of the picure..she can piss him about for a while so it keeps going back to court, but in the end, with persistence, and the backing of the courts, a GOOD father will gain the contact he and his kids deserve.. but the MAJORITY of absent fathers are absent for a reason - because they are total twats.. and either they can't be arsed, or their kids don't want to know them.

As for OP, that video was so so upsetting.

redsock · 05/05/2009 21:59

And another thing..it is quite common, for fathers to play the sympathy card as nightby says, so all their friends and family think they are the hard done by dad who is not allowed to see his kids.

When the truth is, he is actually a lazy,controlling selfish little runt who wants his freedom really andis not arsed if he sees his kids or not really but wants the world to feel sorry for him.

Morloth · 05/05/2009 22:00

I don't think anyone is denying that some men suck and should have limited (if any!) contact with their children Nighbynight.

But there really ARE good men whose hearts break just like this mum's did when their children are taken from them. They may not be the majority but there is definitely a parallel to be drawn.

I worked in a family law firm which acted as free legal counsel for the children of extremely messed up families. I can honestly say that the cases were split evenly between crap mothers and crap fathers.

As someone upthread commented, if I stole our son away from my husband I could easily imagine that cry coming from him. Not just at the loss of his baby but at the sickening betrayal of someone who had claimed to love him.

This sort of thing is vile whether it is happening to a man OR a woman and no sex has a monopoly on parental love in my opinion/experience. Men may express that love differently but they do feel it.

Sachertorte in our original post you mentioned all the things that mother's do to care for their children. What about providing for a family? You completely left that off the list, isn't making sure that there is food to go into those tummies worth any parenting "points"? (obviously am not saying that women do not work to provide financially for their families! just that it wasn't listed!)

Noonki · 05/05/2009 22:00

nightbynight - absolutely agree with you that some people should never ever be allowed near their children again.

red sock - of course courts can't but women can. And many men are being denied access to their kids for no good reason.

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