to think that encouraging your daughter to learn ballet is cruel

[morningpaper]

Because BASICALLY, ballet is all about body image and is a money-making racket to boot (silly costumes and unecessary shoes).

There just AREN'T curvy ballerinas. You have to have the perfect body - thin, willowy and in perfect proportion. I well remember when my 11 year-old best mate was rejected from the Royal Ballet School because her 'shoulders were too wide'. She cried for weeks. Ballet had been her life.

Basically, they either get sick of it themselves, or they stop because they realise that their BODIES ARE IMPERFECT. Either way, the time could be better used doing some sort of more useful modern dance that you can learn in £1.99 Asda trainers which isn't dependent on having a perfect body.

Please take your daughters to something more useful instead.

Well, my DM had no choice but to send me to ballet lessons as I nagged and nagged and nagged as much as humanly possible. I wanted to do ballet for as long as I can remember, and ended up doing it for 15 years (starting from the age of 4).

My posture is good: people have commented on me being very graceful (not all the time, but anyway). I used to get a LOT of exercise (which I wouldn't have gotten otherwise: school sports were pretty much running around a field or netball which I hated, particularly after breaking my arm when playing it). I have found as an adult: I build muscle incredibly easily. Although not as flexible as I used to be, I am more flexible than average. I am able to observe and pick up steps very quickly (useful in things like yoga, aerobics or whatever other classes). There's the discipline side which I learnt, because from about 12 onwards, you know that you have to work incredibly hard and be incredibly focused to get anywhere. You learn to listen to your body and be very aware of what you're doing. The other thing was confidence and being able to pretend to be confident even when I wasn't (it's not easy running onto a stage in little more than a leotard and some chiffon).

But I do have hideous feet.

YANBU I will never take DD to an ffing ballet class

My niece goes and loves it - she is now 15 and it has given her a good body image - she eats and trains like an athlete - i think it depends on the teacher and parental attitude.

however, my sister regrets her going as it has cost them so much money - shoes, costumes, tights, exam fees, let alone the cost of lessons. now that she is 15 each exam can set them back £150 in fees, costumes and shoes!!!!!

Top news boco

i agree with laweaselmys.

i think it's fine as a recreational hobby, but obviously only the very few are going to be able to pursue it professionally.

I studied it at professional school for 8 years and was convinced I would join the company. I had some measure of talent but my body type had other plans. By age 14 it was clear that even my budding eating disorder was not going to give me the right physique, and I was fed up with the pressure from my teachers to starve myself. (had been dieting since the age of 8, and this was way before that was common!)

Looking back, I think my mother should have been more realistic about my prospects and that maybe I should not have been encouraged to consider it professionally. I enjoyed it, but by the end I had classes every weekday, and rehearsals on weekends, so it was full on to the exclusion of any other activities.

but can also agree with tonybleh on the lasting physical benefits ...

Gosh, I wish I had seen this thread while it was current! I have read it all with interest and want to make a few points to try and maintain a balance here!! Maybe my comments will resurrect the discussion!

I am talking from a point of some experience as my daughter is starting a full time dance school in September. She has wanted this for many years and was lucky enough to be acceptedWho knows where we will go from here but we are giving it a go.

Ballet is good for everyone and anyone that wants to do it but this does not mean that everyone has to do it. It is a great way to exercise, encourages discipline and YES, you can spot a child that dances in a crowd of those that don't, but only once they have started to train seriously.

Yes, it is cruel to send a child to ballet against his or her will, just as it is cruel to send a child to swimming lessons, football coaching or any other non-compulsory activity against their will. To allow a child to participate in any activity that they want to do is being supportive.

There are good dance schools and bad dance schools, just as there are good and bad maths teachers/football coaches etc etc. Some do lots of expensive shows and festivals, some do not.

In a good dance school, there should be a good balance between fun and strictness until a certain level, then there needs to be more discipline. Ballet is hard and even dangerous if not done correctly.

No child should start serious ballet training before about age 8. Before then it is all about getting used to movement and doing a few basic steps.

It is not all pink.

Anyone can dance recreationally, regardless of body shape/size. It is true that only those with a certain physique will get a career out of classical ballet. However, this is not as rigid as many people believe and my dd is not an anorexic looking beanpole. There is much more variation in shape and size of professional contemporary or musical theatre dancers.

ifnotwhynot, I have only read your post. Will read the rest of the thread now.

What are your feelings if your dd does pursue a career in professional ballet?

I think generally girls give up after a year or two with no psychological scars and that this giving up can seem a cruel decision to the mothers.

Ballet is a good starting point for most tyoes of dance and for gymnastics.

Most kids enjoy ballet and gymnastics with no thought to competitive or career success so if it ticks the boxes of enjoyable and physically active then I think it is a good thing.

Trying and failing to get into the Royal Ballet school is only relevant to a tiny handful of children and no reason for the majority of recreational interest kids not to do it!

I'll be sending my SON as soon as possible.
I trained for 15 years, did me the world of good.

my mum encouraged me to do ballet as i was a willowy and weak child. i started when i was 4, the rigidness is a little initimdating to a small child but i still enjoeyed it. i stopped aged 12 in favour of horseriding... i then started again as a student. i have been dancing through my last pregnancy up until 4 weeks before the birth. it was so much easier giving birth than the first time (where i didn't dance) as i had great stamina due to the dancing. i'm not brilliant at it, but i still love it. people tell me i have the posture of a dancer. no other dance does that. ballet is the foundation of all dances. it shapes body and soul. i would recommend it to anyone. if i had a daughter i'd definitely try and get her to do ballet. you benefit from it for years to come!

The 3 year old classes don't do ballet, it's pre-ballet really, just a bit of fun. Lots of 'em love it, and you can't force kids to do it so the ones who do it enjoy it. it will only be half an hour a week so that leaves quite a lot of time left for free play!

Riven - my DD started ballet classes (at her request ) when she was 2.5. It's just an extension of play when they're so little and she has really enjoyed fluttering around. She starts school in Sept and it will be up to her if she continues or not.

My DD has done ballet for 6 years - she is now 10.5. I have never had to force her to go, it's one hour a week, she loves it. She wears a leotard and a skirt. As the girls get older they are allowed to wear dance trousers.

The ballet school does performances at the school summer fair and little end of term in-class performances for the parents, the teacher provides the costumes, no one is forced to do anything and body size/weight is never mentioned by the teacher at all.

I would prefer my DD did ballet than some of the modern dance that I saw at the town show recently - call me old fashioned but they were plastered in make-up from the age of 5 and thrusting and gyrating and grabbing their crotches to Michael Jackson. Is that more appropriate and less damaging than ballet do you think?

I'm sure there are pushy parents who will damage their children forcing them to do ballet/rugby or any other dance/sport form but if the child is happy and getting some exercise then that's surely a good thing?

i totally agree with the OP, not read anything else yet. I took my 3 yo to ballet,she loved it for a good while, then she got bored and stopped wanting to go. Brilliant, saves me a mint! I was at the competitiveness of it all - thank the lord she didn't carry it on. But what gets my goat the most is the MOTHERS they just seem to push and push. Each week there would be a little mite crying because she didnt want to do it - but the mums were pushing them through the door, fixed grins "you WILL enjoy it tiana". I would be and they would be "well, they have to learn commitment to these things" THEY ARE THREE FUCKING YEARS OLD!! DDs ballet school put on a show, i refused to enter her (mostly due to the extra money - with costumes (made by the ballet teachers mother), extra lessons and ticket prices you were looking at about £200 - i kid you not!). A lot of the little ones who did the show refused to "perform" on the day. There were to be two months worth of extra lessons - for, get this THREE HOURS on a Sunday. Three hours THEY ARE THREE FUCKING YEARS OLD.

I'm glad i took DD to ballet, she loved it until it all got too serious - then she got bored - phew!

podrick, i have to correct you there - the 3 yo class my DD went to, absolutely did do ballet and i think that was what bored DD in the end, all the practice - my DD just wanted to jump and dance around in a pretty dress

ifnotwhynot very best of luck to your daughter. I went to the RBS and had the best years of my life. I hope she has a great time!

Message withdrawn

Good post, dilemma.

Riven - I don't see what your problem is. My DD enjoys fluttering around the village hall for 40 mins once a week and it costs me £5 to watch her whilst nattering to other mums. The rest of the week she can play, play, play but she does enjoy the structure of the classes and the improvement she has made. She isn't going to be a professional ballerina but she has FUN.

This thread makes me really sad and also quite frankly horrified at the barmy ideas of it seems quite a few mothers.

I did ballet from the age of 3 until I was 18 and I adored it. I do not have any kind of a dancers body and was definitely of the sturdy/sporty type of girl. I also did swimming, athletics, gymnastics etc etc. Ballet was the one I stuck with longest and it has given me a lifelong love of ballet and other dance forms. I never once wore pink (much to my chagrin as all the other classes seemed to wear pink!)and was never under any illusion that I would be a professional. Similarly I never thought I would swim in the Olympics or manage a backwards somersault, I did the activities because I loved them.

If you are really worried that going to a ballet class once a week is going to destroy your daughters body image then you need to take a good look at your own parenting. What sort of values have you instilled in your child if she can't have fun dancing once a week without developing some sort of self esteem problem? IME the girls who did become obsessed with being perfect in anything be it swimming, ballet, acting nearly always had at least one pushy parent.

This thread is makingme really worried about a friend of DD's.
This morning DD and another friend mentioned that this girl hardly ever eats - she chooses salad at school lunch, with no meat, cheese or other protein. Then whenever they've eaten at her house she's pretty much refused her meal - 'but she's not anorexic.'
Reading this thread reminded me that she used to go to dance classes, so I asked the girls if she was still
going and they said yes (they're all aged 11).
She does have the longed-for physique, willowy but not tall, with elegant proportions and well-developed but long muscles (she also swims a lot), so she may well have been earmarked for future success.
I love the fact that ballet exists as an art form - it is beautiful and moving - but there obviously are these pressures on girls at certain schools and from certain teachers.
Now I don't know whether I should mention anything to her mum - it makes me feel sick that she's damaging her health to look good in a leotard.

I always wanted to learn ballet as a child, but my parents were against it, I don't know why. I did plenty of other things, but if my girls want to follow ballet classes, I will probably let them. I think all girls in our society are vulnerable to eating disorders, whether they follow ballet or not.