to not allow my child to do a reading in church?

[GooseyLoosey]

Dh and I are atheists. The dcs attend the local school which is C of E (although wholly state funded). There are no alternative non-C of E schools locally.

The school tends towards being very religious and there is a special Easter service in church for the school this week. Ds (5) has been given a reading to do at this service. It includes many "Praise God" and "God is good" type statements.

I don't wish to over react but getting ds to actively participate in an act of worship may be a step too far for me. AIBU to object and to consider telling them to get someone else to do this?

Justaboutback - to be fair melanie did say 'to grow up' a believer not to become one...

I don't think it should be that complicated to tell a child about Easter. You don't have to explain any of the complex meanings. Schools teach 5 year olds science but we don't expect them to understand it at degree level, and most parents and non-science teachers don't understand it at degree level. You can teach about frogspawn without teaching molecular biology or systems theory in ecology. Surely it is the same with Easter?

I do know the cultural stories of Christianity fairly well - the bit I have problems with is the theological explanations of the nature of the Christian God. I am very keen on culture and tradition so the dcs are told "cultural" stories often. However they are as likely to hear Finn and the Salmon of knowledge as they are the Good Samaritan.

But the good Samaritan involves no supernatural component, as opposed to magical salmon.

Oh I see GL, well 5 year olds dont need theological explanations do they?.

Well, there might be an argument for saying St Paul's conversion on the road to Damascus was a bit spooky

Hello GL. What a can of worms you have opened! Done any work today yet?

FWIW, my opinion is that if you feel this strongly about it, you of course should not compromise your beliefs (a belief in no god) which is as valid as any religious affirmation that a god does exist. It may be that there is a less controversial reading ds could do, or would you object to any participation in a church service?

I can explain the Trinity to you or ds if you like - maybe in person though, in case I am shouted down here on a public site!

justaboutback - it seems to me that adults convert for many different reasons, mainly some kind of gap in their lives, need for consolation etc. All of them seem valid and reasonable to me. Less so when the faith has just always been there. As my DD grows up (5) it is clearer and clearer to me that what parents say, or don't say has a huge impact on the belief and moral understanding of a child. One of the reasons being a parent is the most important job in the world.

salome64 - that makes me think of rugby...

Purely to answer the OP, I think that the public speaking is a good learning opportunity, he doesn't need to believe the content any more than a Grimms brothers' tale, and he'll be part of the class more comfortably than if you withdraw him from specific stuff over the years. I don't think he is being forced into an act of worship because obviously it isn't actual religious adoration on his part if as a family you are regarding it a load of hooey: the school or church can't own his "soul" if you like- it might look like worship and smell like worship, but unless he actually believes it all, it isn't worship. It is just participating normally in a class activity.

Unfortunately for you, there will be moments you will feel uncomfortable with some school activities. Personally, I'm not fond of SATS, or reading teaching methods, but I've got to lump it, because that's the system. As an adult there are loads of times I've got to pretend wild enthusiasm for something as part of my job, but the reality is I couldn't give two shits. That's life, IMO, and perhaps it would be best to just view it pragmatically like this? As long as you nourish his enquiring mind at home, he will be able to hold his own views as he gets older, and all the school stuff will just be part of a cultural background. He's not likely to become too indoctrinated if you discuss stuff at home anyway, so I think you are worrying too much.

Let him do the reading, it won't kill him, and the performance/speaking aspect of it will probably do him good.

"Would those of you who are Christian really not object to your children standing in a Mosque and praising Allah as the one true God?"

i am catholic and i really wouldn't mind.

the Allah of the Muslims is the same God I worship as a Catholic.

yes, op is a tad unreasonable for lots of reasons already stated.
jsut as how many children travel to go to c of e or rc schools, so can athiest children travel, no?

eek! I am dim! Explain!

Can i just say that whilst this thread is a bit heavy for a Monday morning, I've really enjoyed reading it and have learned lots!

To clarify - I know the "facts" of Easter as the Bible presents them. I know about the crucifiction and the resurrection. What I do not understand is the theology - how the death of Christ redeemed mankind from its sins and why a death was necessary to obtain forgiveness from a loving God. As the words DS has to say involve this aspect of Easter, this is what I would need to explain to him and I cannot - not in anyway that makes sense to me.

Millie - take your point about the Good Samaritan. How about the loaves and fishes?

OP, if you decide to withdraw your child from religious worship, I think you can get template letters from the Secular Society.

Hi DG - not done nearly as much as I should have done. Face to face explanation of trinity would be much appreciated!

Turning wine into water? very, very useful, I must say. My kind of wedding guest.

"Could those of you who are Christian and objecting to the OP take a moment and think about if the only state education available to your child was 'atheist' education.

The imagine that an accepted part of this atheist education involved your child having to stand in an assembly and outline the rationale behind the idea that there is no god. Celebrate the fact there is no god and sing a song about the fact there is no god. In the long term it might not affect their world view on religion, but it would probably not sit well with you."

Already covered that. Private education. But i keep being shouted at for saying it, so not sure how to answer you.

GL - does your DS understand the meaning of sacrifice and consequences though - it could be explained in those terms.

I think it can be explained quite easily (its easier than the concept of infinity and space for example) - its just that you dont want to which is fair enough.

Foxy - would you mind if they stood in a Hindu temple and recognised the Hindu gods as the true gods?

Private education is a red herring, GM, and you know it. It might be your choice but rather irrelevant to the debate at hand. Which is about dealing with the state system as it stands.

Really interesting thread.
I sympathise Goosey we have been in the same situation ourselves.

but they wouldn't be. they'd be reading something that says that.

< puts hand up gingerly >

Am I too late to the thread for my post to have been useful? Because I think that might be one of the longest posts I've ever written, and I will feel childishly upset if it gets totally ignored, even if people think it's garbage Ahem. As you were.