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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think that a lot of parents mistake a confident outgoing toddler for a bully?

137 replies

2pt4kids · 06/02/2009 19:25

I've seen this a few times before, but today just takes the biscuit and I'm having a bit of a rant!

Ds1 is 3.4 yrs old. He could never be described as shy! He is very outgoing and will talk to anyone.
He is at the age where he just LOVES playing with other children. Of course I play with him, but when we are out at play places he just really wants to play with the other children.

Today at a soft play place (a very small local one, all on one level) he was off playing. I was in the netted off baby section with DS2.
I could see DS1 at all times and hear him most of the time.
First of all he was on the slide with another little boy a bit younger than him. DS1 obviously thought they were playing 'together'. The other boy wanders off and DS1 follows him and starts chatting to him. The other boy seems a bit shy, looks a bit unsure and goes off to another section with his Mum. DS1 follows again and chats to the boy asking him if he wants to come on the slide with him. The boy turns to go back to his Mum instead in a shy way and in doing so slips over then cries.
I could hear DS1 saying in such a sweet voice 'You ok? Did you hurt your leg?' and trying to see why the boy was crying. The boys Mum just glared a DS1 and turned her back to him picking up her son.
She then walked away and Ds1 started to follow her so she snapped at him 'For Gods Sake just leave him alone!'
She threw me a glare too as if to say 'why arent you keeping your child in check?'

I didnt say anything as she was very pregnant and I didnt want to start an argument tbh. Ds1 wasnt upset, it all went over his head so I just left it, but it breaks my heart to see poor DS1 so glared at for just wanting a friend

After that I saw DS go up to two other children with parents with them and ask them if they wanted to play with him. Both parents just looked at him like he was being really intrusive and herded their DCs away.
I did go up to one of them and say 'is something wrong, I saw my DS approach you, did he misbehave?' and they said 'No, its fine, my son is just a bit scared of older children and a bit shy'

Why on earth cant an adult just say to a 3 year old 'I'm sorry, my DS doesnt want to play today, he's a bit shy' instead of glaring at him!!!

Is this normal? Is my DS not normal? Why do people seem to hate that he approaches other children?

AIBU to let him do this?
Should I tell him off for trying to make friends?

It makes me soooo mad

OP posts:
queenofbeas · 08/02/2009 20:20

So Fairynuff - you don't actually know if your children have beenn rebuffed 3 times in one morning as you don't go to school with them, do you?

Minxie1977 · 08/02/2009 20:23

Well said queen - behaviour in children is nurtured by the parents - someone said earlier their child was not that social, just like them Children follow the examples set to them and react based on the reactions they witness.

Compare my DSD with my closest friends DS. I have always forced insisted my DSD says hello/goodbye to everyone, greets new children and thanks people for their hospitality. My friend has not, she justifies his behaviour by saying, "he's a bit shy/moody/tired/hungry... today". DSD is well liked, friendly and always make friends wherever we go. Friend's DS sits with us most of the time, always cries when we're out - about ridiculous things- and most people dislike his company. It is sad but true, and breaks my heart. I think he would be a much happier little boy if his behaviour was challenged not accepted!

Fairynufff · 08/02/2009 20:24

queenofbeas - Good point. But I've read their school reports and talked to their teachers and had them described as: 'a joy to teach' 'a good role model for other pupils' 'a pupil I shall miss next year'. I'm not blowing any trumpets. My kids are dead ordinary. But they are respectful of others.

Minxie1977 · 08/02/2009 20:26

Nikos - how are children who speak to people the odd ones? Human beings are naturally social! Do you smile at people in the street? Monies on NO

Thunderduck · 08/02/2009 20:27

I would expect a child to be polite, though at 3 their social skills won't be up to par of course.

However there's a difference between expecting a child to be civil, yes, no thankyou, please etc and responding when someone talks to them, if only briefly, and expecting/forcing them to play with someone they'd rather not.

nikos · 08/02/2009 20:29

All of us with more than one child know that is just so not true minxie. All of my three have very different personalities and some of them are more naturally outgoing and others prefer smaller groups and take longer to warm up. Many, many parents will testify to this. You are being far too simplistic about the whole thing.

nikos · 08/02/2009 20:30

I said talk to strangers. Why on earth would you think I wouldn't smile at people in the street? Can you not have a discussion without getting offensive?

Fairynufff · 08/02/2009 20:31

Minxie I do agree with you that even the shyest of children should learn the social niceties and we force my DD to say her Ps and Qs and speak to people who have spoken to her (even to the point of tears sometimes) otherwise it is not shy is it rude. So (also queenofbeas) from that POV I agree with you. In a soft play area I would weigh up whether the child was just being 'normally' sociable and friendly and tell my kids to get on with it or if the other child was being a bit overbearing but generally good natured I would grit my teeth and ignore it. But there is a fine line for children - they turn off very easily from children that are in their face and make them uncomfortable.

queenofbeas · 08/02/2009 20:31

fairy - the teachers are not there following your Dc around at break time, so you don't know do you?

queenofbeas · 08/02/2009 20:35

Nikos - I have more than one and yes they are different but we as parents have done everything we can to encorage them to confident, sociable, polite, nice and outgoing children.

queenofbeas · 08/02/2009 20:38

TBH I have only ever come across a couple of people that I would class as 'shy/ignorant', one is now an adult and he does'nt speak unless you speak to him and then grunts - weird, the other is friend's DS and he is a very strange boy but that is defintley his parent's doing.

SweetAudrina · 08/02/2009 20:42

My kids have totally different personalities. I don't 'encourage' my eldest to be unsociable, he just is! That is who he is. Unlike youngest who is very much like the boy in the OP.

But personally, if I saw my kids following someone else around when the situation was clearly stressing them out, I'd step in.

queenofbeas · 08/02/2009 20:45

Why would it stress them out? How very odd. It is not normal NOT to respond to other human beings. We all need human interaction.

Minxie1977 · 08/02/2009 20:45

nikos - I don't feel I was being offensive! The 'smile in the street' was a gentle joke - hence the smiley. I would hate to offend. But maybe we can have a discussion where you accept other POV's without assuming you are right and they are wrong.

"All of us with more than one child know that is just so not true minxie" - All of you? Is there now a more than one child joint conciousness? While I totally accept all children are different that doesn't mean we shouldn't try. Of course they can take time to warm up but they should be encouraged to. I thought most of this was about the behaviour of the parents not the DC's.

Fairy - I agree, if the kids want out that's up to them. I draw the line at DSD being dragged off by another child, that's when I step in

Minxie1977 · 08/02/2009 20:47

Exactly Queen

queenofbeas · 08/02/2009 20:47

I agree that I would'nt let my child be dragged off.

SweetAudrina · 08/02/2009 20:48

It would stress me out if I was trying to see to my crying kid and someone elses kid was under my feet. And, it would have stressed DS1 out to have some kid following him around like that, the lad was clearly trying to escape from the situation.

But then, I have the patience of a spitting cobra.

Minxie1977 · 08/02/2009 20:54

Sweet - "He's not shy, just not sociable. Like me" and "I have the patience of a spitting cobra"

Maybe your eldest learned it somewhere

SweetAudrina · 08/02/2009 21:04

He probably did! maybe youngest takes after his dad

Leo9 · 08/02/2009 22:42

Neicie, just wanted to point out in case you're still reading, I did not say you DID class a confident child as a bully, my post was not saying that at all, you have misread

mm22bys · 09/02/2009 08:35

I don't know how anybody can say that behaviour is "bullying", he sounds like a lovely caring boy.

What does annoy is other parents who accuse their non-DCs of not being "team players" when they run away after being sick of trod on, eg, when trying to play ball....

Niecie · 09/02/2009 10:03

queenofbeas you definitely have it in for shy children - what is your problem?

People are all different. It takes all sorts. Teaching politeness is one thing - ramming children into a model of how they should be is quite another - you are a child you have to play with anybody who asks - I don't get that at all.

I don't understand parents who have outgoing children who think there is something wrong with other children who don't want to play with them. It smacks a bit of 'me, me, me' tbh. It wouldn't be by chance your PFB we are talking about would it? Heaven forbid that your DC doesn't get his own way.

My shy child is fine at school actually. He isn't forced to play with anybody by the teachers and can move at his own pace and he will join in with other children when he is ready. As I have said he is a popular and socialable child when he is allowed to go at his own pace (teachers appraisal of him not mine - I'm not there).

For what it is worth I have a DS1 (my PFB ) who is perfectly happy to speak to anybody although he doesn't bother on other children much. He would rather read a book. That is fine, that is who he is. He is perfectly polite if he doesn't want to play with somebody and has no qualms about saying 'no thank you, not at the moment'. Mind you, he has AS and probably wouldn't take no for an answer if the boot was on the other foot and he was doing the asking. That social skill is harder to teach.

Leo - why mention me and Nikos in the same sentence as people who believe a confident child is a bully. To paraphrase, judging by my post and Nikos's some people think a confident child is a bully. Read it again and you will see why I think you are accusing me of something I absolutely did not say.

queenofbeas · 09/02/2009 10:06

My problem is the demonising of this little boy and I doubt very much there are many truley shy children just pFB parents!

queenofbeas · 09/02/2009 10:09

Oh dear you are very PFBish are'nt you Neice? And defintley Me,me,me. I can't stand po faced little brats who hide behind mummy, such a shame for them.

queenofbeas · 09/02/2009 10:12

As I said I have only every met a few children who are 'shy' and find their behaviour weird and more to do with the way they are parented than anything else.
And often the parents of these children so not understand children who are outgoing - prehaps they quite like having clingy children who need them 24/7? Odd.