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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

.. to think it wasn't up to nursery staff to tell DD this?

226 replies

HollyCherry · 31/12/2008 12:16

Just interested in opinions really.

DD is 4.3 and last night gave me a big soppy hug and said, "I want to marry you when I grow up"

I told her that girls can't marry girls, to which she replied - "Yes they can - x at nursery says girls can marry girls and boys can marry boys"

I have a feeling I'm going to get flamed for even raising the subject - but I really don't expect the nursery to be filling a 4 year old in on these kind of details?

OP posts:

MillyR · 31/12/2008 15:38

Georgimama, I think you are really talking about an issue that goes far beyond gay relationships. We all struggle with (and I often get angry about) the difference between what we think is right and want our children to be taught and what the school and government wants to teach our children.

I believe the state has taken on far too much of the role of parent in teaching children about areas that should be taught at home.

But when it comes to gay relationships and gay parents, they are so every day that it would be impossible for every nursery class to avoid mentioning them.

Original poster

HollyCherry · 31/12/2008 15:40

solid gold - your posts are thoroughly offensive and I am absolutely amazed they are still showing.

It is a bit rich to call the likes of myself 'tight-arsed homophobic twunts', when you are clearly very bigoted in an anti-religion sense yourself. Why is it that those of us with religious beliefs (or 'imaginary friend superstitions' as you like to call them) are fair game for your highly offensive and equally ignorant views, whilst any other minority group is protected under the banner of equal rights?

As I have stated - I have no problem with same sex relationships or civil partnerships, and I have no problem with my DD knowing about these things - they are facts of life and if we had gay friends I would be perfectly happy for DD to spend time with them and know about their relationships - we live in small town, therefore we are not in that position.

From a religious perspective, we go to a fantastic church that welcomes single parents, divorcees, transvestites, mixed race couples - you name it - so am hardly coming from the perspective of some religion fuelled prejudiced nutcase.

I was merely interested to find out what other mum's would make of their nursery staff telling their DC's about something like this. My main point is that I would rather this was something I was able to deal with first hand as I believe that I am the best person to inform my daughter about issues (for want of a better word) such as these. And hope that in doing so I will raise an open-minded, tolerant young woman.

OP posts:

AMumInScotland · 31/12/2008 15:43

I guess the ideal is that issues are dealt with sensitively by someone who knows the child, and what they are likely to already know, and can approach the issue in an appropriate way. But as soon as we allow our children out of sight and earshot, we share the responsibility of that with their other carers. Hopefully we have chosen to leave them in the care of individuals who will approach issues with suitable care and sensitivity. But the fact is that no-one else will have the exact same set of values as each of us does - even people who believe broadly the same things can vary in the details. So, in reality, lots of issues which we might ideally want to tell our children about are going to come up when they are with others.

All we can do is choose their carers as best we can, and accept that this is the start of other people having some influence over what they know and believe - that's going to get a bigger and bigger influence as they grow up, and all we can do as parents is to tryto give our children the values which we think are important, and trust to them to develop into their own person.

DECKmuppetWITHBOUGHSOFHOLLY · 31/12/2008 15:44

Whilst in reception/nursery I have seen

A boy grab a girl by the throat and say his daddy said 'it was okay to hit women'

I had a boy tell me that his brother had stabbed him with a fork on his back the previous evening (this was the same boy who would tell us about his mother's 'friends' who would visit the house and he found it funny that one was in the hedge and couldn't get up -we think he was drunk)

I had a girl say that 'Mummy's baby died' during circle time....

You'd be amazed what children tell you/blurt out/ ask questions about that as a teacher you would never get time to inform all the parents as to what had been asked and what was the reply. I think once your children go into the care of anyone else you are going to have to accept that you no longer have full control over what they may hear, especially as a response to a question they may ask.

nappyaddict · 31/12/2008 15:49

Can I ask a question? If you get married in a registry office is that still a marriage or a civil partnership?

MillyR · 31/12/2008 15:50

nappyaddict, if you are a heterosexual couple it is a marriage. Straight people cannot have a civil partnership.

Claire236 · 31/12/2008 15:53

I've told my ds (3) that some men love men & women love women following something he said one day. He looked a bit surprised & dh had to confirm it was true but now he's accepted it in the way that young children do. I would be happy for his nursery to have told him the same thing & think he's at a perfect age to be told things like that as he accepts them as facts which no doubt he will bring up at a later date when he's ready. I'm a great believer in telling him the truth about things as & when subjects come up.

nappyaddict · 31/12/2008 15:54

Littleducks - you said you saw a civil partnership as different to a marriage cos the promises aren't made before god. i don't really get what you mean by that cos not everyone who gets married gets married in a church.

TLESinChristmasStockings · 31/12/2008 15:54

This is the exact reason that when my eldest ds was 4 I explained what sex was and about homosexuality. That way nothing was a shock when he heard it in the school playground or when explained in school.

I have many Homosexual friends male and female, my brother is homosexual and has a wonderful partner they have been together 10 years, I can honestly say I can put my hands up and say they have a better relationship than many hetrosexual couples i know. And they have been together longer than my relationship lasted with ds1's father.

At the age of 5 ds1 was in attendance when my brother and his partner got married, and it hasn't scared him in anyway.

The way I look at it is if you want your child to learn things first hand from you then tell them before they start nursery/school.

Blu · 31/12/2008 15:54

AMIS - yes, exactly.

I do understand about wanting to broker the way our children larn about the world - but values are the most important thing. I would be furious if a query about a two-mummy family was met with an evasive 'oh, well, you'll have to ask your Mummy about that'. But we weathered and survived the enthusiastic christian nursery teacher - a wonderful wonderful teacher in so many ways - who told DS at 4 that the sun wasn't shining because god was cross with us...and though I feel strongly that Ds should ideally read the book before seeing the film where any serious writing is concerned, i have no doubt that Iwill be over-ruled in may cases by DPs family and sheer circumstance, at other people's houses, etc - and DS will still enjoy books.

MilaMae · 31/12/2008 15:58

I think the staff were totally correct,they told the truth and as a parent I'd be furious if they didn't.

My dc live next to 2 married men, so they would have informed your dd anyway as I'm sure other children will do as she gets older.

I think you're dd will probably not care 2 hoots anyway,my dc are only interested in the fact that one of the lads living next door to us a policeman and they get to see a police car up close on a regular basis

chocolateorange · 31/12/2008 15:58

How odd. I'd be annoyed if staff told my child that women CAN'T marry women.

TLESinChristmasStockings · 31/12/2008 16:04

Oh and we went to church as children through to our teens and my brother is still homosexual

MilaMae OMG SHOCK HORROR A Homosexual POLICEMAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

MilaMae · 31/12/2008 16:05

BoffinMum · 31/12/2008 16:14

I can't understand what all the fuss is about. Marriage is for heteros, civil partnerships are for gay people, the two institutions are different things with similar outcomes. End of story. No big deal. I think mine could have understood most of this at 4, but they seem to have always known what 'gay' meant anyway.

TLESinChristmasStockings · 31/12/2008 16:18

Mila I was

MilaMae · 31/12/2008 16:22

MilaMae · 31/12/2008 16:25

Sorry flitting in and out,reading quickly

TLESinChristmasStockings · 31/12/2008 16:26

Mila its ok lol

Next I will be shocked that there are gay priests, teachers, doctors etc

littleducks · 31/12/2008 16:31

nappyaddict- i cant have a civil partnership with my dh, a same sex couple cant have a marriage.... thats the way i always saw it and felt that the two were similar but not the same

i was surprised that others felt their own marriage was the same as a civil partnership and suggested that perhaps a reason for this was that their marriages were registry marriages and so are more akin to 'registering a civil partnership'

Flihgtattendant · 31/12/2008 16:35

Isn't it called a civil partnership when you do it at a stately home or summat?

LadyMuck · 31/12/2008 16:37

I'm intrigued that we seem to be reaching a consensus that knowing gay parents is part of normal life in the UK (especially since there are still some areas where being say black or mixed race would be rare). Other than on MN I'm not sure that I know any (and I live in London, or at least a London suburb). To the best of my knowledge there are no openly gay parents at my dcs school, nor have there been at their nurseries. Whilst dh and I obviously know gay people, this is usually in the context of work relationships and so our children do not know any gay people. So I think that it is fair enough that to have this issue first raised would still result in some discussion with children of this age. FWIW when children I know have 2 daddies, one of them is usually a step father. We know plenty of children with 2 mummies or 2 daddies, just none with only 2 mummies or daddies.

So how many of you (who aren't gay yourselves) know one of more sets of gay parents (well enough for your children to be aware of their relationship)? And where in the country do you live?

Thunderduck · 31/12/2008 16:38

Really the difference between a marriage and a civil partnership are very few. There should be only one term for the lot imho as civi partnerships are as legitimate as a marriage.

I see no reason why churches should have a monopoly on the definition of marriage.

DECKmuppetWITHBOUGHSOFHOLLY · 31/12/2008 16:42

Ladymuck -I taught a child who had same sex parents, my SIL is gay although it is not dicussed in our Il's family though we are happy too when the time comes with the ds's.
We had neighbours who were same sex and in a relationship and have a couple who we see when we walk the dog. I don't think I live in an area that is oustanding in it's differences? I would say we represent all areas of society...

LadyMuck · 31/12/2008 16:46

I'm not saying that the existence of gapy people is rare! My question was more are your children aware of any gay parents? From your answer DECK I would deduce not?

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