to feel deeply uncharitable, unchritian an a bit fecked off with the parent of the squalling brat at the carol service this evening?

[DisasterArea]

don't usually mind children in church at all. but....
if a small child whines, mons, cries and doesn't show any signs of shutting up or going to sleep during an adult oriented service, not a family or crib or nativity service would you think its mother wold perhaps take it out after the first 45 minutes it whining and moaning and crying?the church in question has a crech. it has a room with sound piped in for parents to use to enjoy he service while minding their own children. it has services which are specifically for families and children. and it has quiet, peaceful services that appeal to adults wanting a bit of peace nd contemplation without listening to someone elses over tired and miserable child.
AIBU? perhaps a little but do you see my point? and if i have a point why do i now feel unchristian and guilty for seding bad vibes he way?

What age, exactly, was this 'squalling brat?'

And what age are your children, Disaster?

It may be that: 1/ you have not reached 'squalling brat' stage.

Or 2/ you have forgotten 'squalling brat' stage.

Either way, it is naive and uncharitable to assume that the parents are to blame for the actions of very young children. Very young children are a force unto themselves; no more emotionally equipped to control their emotions than young dogs are equipped.

You are right to feel guilty and to question your own emotions. Any mother who refers to another child as a 'squalling brat' has got some shit ahead of her.

YABU. Did your priest/minister mind the noise? If not then why should you?

Echo posters who say that the parents may have needed the service- sometimes you do need the service.

Am thankful for my own church, lovely priest and church elders who encourage us to sit at the front not the back, and shake the childrens' hands, make them feel included, and make a point of telling me how well-behaved they have been (even if I am flustered because I think they have not!)

I ignore any vibes of annoyance from other members of the congregation tbh. I know my children aren't that badly behaved, they are just being children. And I am amused at the irony of people judging others in church tbh

Wouldn't you take a crying baby out of a family service? I think I would.

I think this is a tricky one. I don't like the OP's use of 'squalling brat' etc either, and I do think church is a plae for families, but also think consideration for others is important. I've sat with babies and toddlers in church, and if they whinge a little, cry for a minute, need a breast feed or whatever I dn't feel like I need to leave. But if they start to cry of fuss and wont stop, I leave (or DH does) so that others can hear the service. In the same way, DH left last week because he had a big coughing fit!

In our church there is a family with soe particularly desruptive (thought lovely) kids, who really let them run amok during the service - climbing over pews, shouting, squabbling...even bringing in noisy toys to play with! I've hear the parents comment on their childrens happy noise as if its a sweet thing, but to be honest it really does make it difficult to concentrate.

Having said that, I would rather they were there and felt welcome than not there, and so would never tut or comment, but what would be really great would be if they encouraged their children to play more quietly, brought in books instead of castinets etc!

Of course children should be welcome, and everyone accpets that they are going to fidget and make a bit of noise-however parents do have to be sensitive to others and exert a bit of control. I think the upsetting thing is seeing a badly behaved DC, knowing that you could sort them out in a trice (in a friendly way)and yet you are powerless! I have taken 30 five year olds-it isn't a problem, but you do have to set the scene for them first-they don't automatically know the appropriate behaviour.

Isn't it lovely to see the spirit of Christmas & being Christian to all is still going strong

What people don't seem to remember is our children are the adult congregation of tomorrow.

Did anyone think to offer a hand to the babys mother? Did anyone stop to think that perhaps she had no-one else to take the baby outside for a moment? Perhaps she needed to be at church for prayer & guidence & felt the only service she could manage was the carol service?

I'm sorry but a Carol service is all, children & old alike.

"how on earth is a Carol Service unsuitable for children?"

As a regular churchgoer myself, I decided that the carol service was unsuitable for my DS2 last night. How on earth? Well:

• DS2 is unwell and whingey

• DS2 usually crawls around our not-very-full church to amuse himself. This particular service would be full to the rafters and so this would be difficult.

• The service - like the OPs one - was an evening one, at the time he expects to be snuggling up for bed.

• He has been to two services recently where he has made a lot of noise and started to disrupt the service. In the last one we left after 5 mins. I think he knew what to expect and wasn't having any of it. I didn't anticipate any change this evening.

So if it were me in the OP's church I would have left. BUT I am lucky as I have DH there to supervise DD and DS1 and bring them home. Maybe the lady had other children there and no one to help.

Another mum from the school left one of our school services as she was unable to keep her twins quiet enough (she had decided). I had been at the point of asking DH to take DS2 so that I could offer to hold one of them for her, when I noticed she had given up and gone. That thought of offering to help did not seem to have occured to any of the other 250 parents without a toddler to contend with.

But, churchgoers, be careful with telling people that you have a creche . . . it can be interpreted as "your child should be in the creche and not in here."

I think I would be wary of trying to help-your motives might be questioned. I can imagine it being on the AIBU thread here if you offered to take a crying baby to give the mother a break!

well bAlloon slayer obviously if a child is unwell then that's entirely different. Thankfully on the rare occasions that one of my children has been ill on a Sunday they've either been with exH that weekend, or there's been someone around to cover for me at church (or someone at church has been available to come over and look after him for me).

I think the school seevices are slightly different, my older DS's know that if DS3 makes noise and a fuss at one of those then I will have to leave and go home. Thankfully (as yet) all of the service have been afternoon ones where he was asleep in his pushhair as it was his normal nap time. so not had to leave...........yet