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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to feel deeply uncharitable, unchritian an a bit fecked off with the parent of the squalling brat at the carol service this evening?

159 replies

DisasterArea · 21/12/2008 19:45

don't usually mind children in church at all. but....
if a small child whines, mons, cries and doesn't show any signs of shutting up or going to sleep during an adult oriented service, not a family or crib or nativity service would you think its mother wold perhaps take it out after the first 45 minutes it whining and moaning and crying?the church in question has a crech. it has a room with sound piped in for parents to use to enjoy he service while minding their own children. it has services which are specifically for families and children. and it has quiet, peaceful services that appeal to adults wanting a bit of peace nd contemplation without listening to someone elses over tired and miserable child.
AIBU? perhaps a little but do you see my point? and if i have a point why do i now feel unchristian and guilty for seding bad vibes he way?

OP posts:
ThomcatIsForLifeNotJustForXmas · 21/12/2008 22:09

Yeah you can be a bit pissed off that the service you want to listen to is being disturbed so much, sure, I get that. I don't get the feeling of venom towards this family and their child. Way OTT. It was one service, one time.

ThomcatIsForLifeNotJustForXmas · 21/12/2008 22:11

What leaves me cold is the squalling brat references etc. That leaves me cold.

NorthernLurkerwithastarontop · 21/12/2008 22:12

Christmas isn't for kids - it's for all mankind - including the noisy, smelly ones with runny noses.

tiredsville · 21/12/2008 22:13

Nah, I can handle squaling brat references. Don't worry Disaster, I will not be calling social services.

superfrenchie1 · 21/12/2008 22:14

well, i wish i was brave enough to take the dcs to church. i don't take them for the very reason that i think people will disapprove if they make a noise.

i tried to take dd to an easter service (daytime, lots kids there) when she was about 18m. we lasted the first hymn and then as soon as everyone went quiet she started fussing and whining and i was so embarrassed i just ran for the nearest door and left. felt so bad about it and not courageous enough to attempt to take the dcs to church since then.i feel like everyone else's kids are so much better behaved and can sit still and listen and behave appropriately!

so basically if that had been me i would have removed the offending baby at the first sign of a whinge, for fear of upsetting others and ruining the service for others. maybe i am too charitable. sorry that was a bit rambly

lenny101 · 21/12/2008 22:15

So... consider this SunnyD, She's had a belly full herself, she's got a cancer diagnosis, her dad died a few days ago, the kid has an incurable disease... and she wants to spend an hour in church. Far fetched? What do you know... jack shit, you're intolerant, unchristian. Consideration? Judgey actually. You know I'd love to "inflict" my "Squalling brats" on you, you "miserable cow".

NorthernLurkerwithastarontop · 21/12/2008 22:18

superfrenchie - when the boy Jesus was taken to the temple he embarassed Mary and Joseph by asking incessant questions and then bunked off back there and later and scared them witless! Children belong in churches and a church that doesn't make you all feel welcome in the family of God is a cold and heartless place. Give it another go. You're not in York are you? I can suggest a couple of places

goldFAQinsenceandmyrrh · 21/12/2008 22:18

I'd love to invite you all to our 10am service next Sunday, DS3 will be in attendance, there's no Sunday school next week (held in the hall usually away from the main church building) for someone to take him down there to. So next week there will an a 19 month old eithe whinging/crying/shouting/playing, or running up and down the aisle - (or maybe a combination of both).

piscesmoon · 21/12/2008 22:18

I think that you should choose your service and it isn't very fair to take them to an unsuitable one. Our church has a lovely crib service especially for the tinies, the right time and the right length-it seems a bit unfair to ignore this and go for readings and carols which is adult orientated, too late and too long.

NorthernLurkerwithastarontop · 21/12/2008 22:21

Yeah pisces - but that only works if you know about all the services and of course these people didn't go expecting they were taking a noise bomb with them in the pram? Nobody's perfect - except Jesus - which brings us back to the reason why maybe they felt they should be in church come what may.

goldFAQinsenceandmyrrh · 21/12/2008 22:22

how on earth is a Carol Service unsuitable for children?

our church was packed tonight couple of hundred people in there. a large proportino of those were children.

abraid · 21/12/2008 22:25

Of course you should choose your service. Of course you should be considerate to those around you. Do unto others, etc.

NorthernLurkerwithastarontop · 21/12/2008 22:26

Yes abraid - and 'doing unto others' includes not tutting them out of church because we don't think they belong there at the time.

paolosgirl · 21/12/2008 22:32

No-one tutted them out of church. They stayed there, to hell with the rest of the congregation.

In all this, I'm surprised that no-one has given any thought to the poor child who cried and whined for 45 minutes. If that's not a cry for help I don't know what is.

piscesmoon · 21/12/2008 22:33

You choose the carol service! In my village, if you wanted one for everyone, not too long, there was a community one in a hall. If you wanted quiet and reflective there was a candlelight one with readings. No one minds with the first, people go to the second for peace and quiet. I think you have to be a bit sensitive-not just barge in saying 'it is my right'! There is no excuse for anyone not to know-leaflets were delivered to every house in the village with all services for all churches and denominations.

goldFAQinsenceandmyrrh · 21/12/2008 22:35

ahh well that's perhaps because some of us have a child who whinges/cries for a full hour once a fortnight (sometimes twice in one day if there's evening service) and can see it's doing him no damage as he's still a very happy little chappy the rest of the time.

lenny101 · 21/12/2008 22:37

Yes, and now the implication is that the child is somehow, what? Neglected? You lot really are something else... just as I remember you!

loobeylou · 21/12/2008 22:39

I agree with NorthernLurker 21:41, 21:55 and R2G 22:01.

OP, you KNOW YABU, see last line of OP and remember -
"for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these"

Better a child being brought to church and knowing from a very young age what christmas is all about (goodwill to all, OP!)than being brought up to be a greedy little thing who worships a god called Santa!

Also I wonder whether OP has reason to dislike children/envy the mother? I just say this because i know someone who is childless who finds it very hard to come to church and see lots of youngsters in, especially at Christmastime,mothers day etc, as it heightens her sense of loss (lots of MCs, failed IVFs etc). she is lovely but can come across as very bitter, a case of needing to know BOTH sides of the story.

maltloafeater · 21/12/2008 22:41

The op stated her gripe is with the parents of the child not with the child.

I also experienced exactly the same senario this evening. Surely it is never too early to start reinforcing appropriate behavour, which means running up and down the aisle is just not on.
The three year old in front of me behaved perfectly amusing herself drawing on a sheet of paper, sadly the same could not be said for the people at the back who just didn't get it that they are expected to control their child. the vicar even pointed out the facilities available in the vestry for children.

paolosgirl · 21/12/2008 22:41

Your implication Lenny, not mine.

A cry for help as in "get me out of here, I do not wish to be here"

peacelily · 21/12/2008 22:44

YABVU and hurtful re the child, churches are for everyone, all of the family, it's unchristian to think otherwise.

if you want quiet adult contemplation go during the daytime or to a library, not a carol service on the busiest church evening of the year .

goldFAQinsenceandmyrrh · 21/12/2008 22:45

maltloaf - no it's never too young, but speaking as someone who's 3 childrn have all attended chuch almost since birth the age and rate at which children learn that "approriate" behaviour (my vicar and the congregation are quite happy for DS3 to run/walk up and down the aisle) varies greatly.

fishie · 21/12/2008 22:45

maybe it was the once a year visit for that poor mother and baby visitor, carol service is probably a crowd puller.

unless your church is unusually crowded then you are on a losing wicket disasterarea, there won't be anybody in it but you in 30 years.

lenny101 · 21/12/2008 22:45

Yes and istherefore being neglected by the selfish mother. Oh and maltloafeater, go and .... eat maltloaf

paolosgirl · 21/12/2008 22:46

Umm...libraries don't hold religious services