To be really farking annoyed at DD's school marketing ploys?

[NoPresentsInVictorianSqualor]

I have talked before about the huge amount of money that the school asks from us but when it's for trips and experiences it doesn't bother me too much.

But every couple of weeks the PTA has some sort of fund-raising thingy going on (again I realise my DD&DS will benefit from this). The christmas term is the worst. We've had the xmas cards they made, the different carol concerts (which though much nicer with mulled wine and minced pies, is just another money-making event) we had mufti day last week, they have had three different costumes to find in the last month etc.

Today is the xmas fayre. If I want to I can purchase a calendar (which is basically a picture my DC's drew with one of those calendar thingys on) for £1.
I don't want to!
I've told them we will make our own calendars by creating month specific pictures and photographing them and doing it online much better IMO, but anyway I digress.

I turn up at the school with a very poorly 7 month old, who tbh, I didn't want to wake, nor take outside but I had no choice.
There is absolutely no way I am planning on going to this poxy fayre but that's ok, because it's in the Quad, so I can go round to get to DD's class, pick her up and come straight home.

I get to the school only to find parents waiting outside DD's classroom, which is empty.

A TA overhears us all talking about where our DCs are and says that they have gone to the fayre with their teacher. I mill about looking for DD for twenty fricking minutes, DS2 is crying and I am really fed up.

Then I see that there are children from her class coming out of the main hall. So I go in and she is stood right at the back with her teacher who is selling the calendars.

HOW DARE THEY GUILT ME INTO BUYING SOMETHING THAT WILL OTHERWISE GO IN THE BIN?????

Not only am I pissed off that I had to go right into the middle of the fayre (so the DC's can beg me for things) but they didn't tell us where they would be and they put my daughter in front of her work to try and make me buy it. I didn't buy it because it's crap and I don't want it but what about those who can;t afford it? How on earth would that make them feel? (I know it's only a pound, but there are a lot of people who have 3 children at that school, that's £3 for the calendars and £3 for the mufti in less than a week!)

The Christmas Fair is great for buying books. All those moaning about the cost of things should bear in mind that you can get 10 good quality books for £1 and I have picked up toys, puzzles and games very cheaply. Many of my books are second hand.

It's not a bargain if you don't have that pound, FFS!

Whether I spend a pound on brand new books or on skittles and coke, it's still a pound gone. And actually I can afford it, either way, but some people can't.

I have been utterly poor and I have been a bit better off. I will never, no matter what my situation, be bitter, resentful or angry about schools asking for contributions to enhance the experience of my child at school. I find it very sad that some people do.

If you want Christmas presents you won't get a new book, and you can get 10 books for a £1. I always give books as Christmas presents. The same with toys if money is tight it is a huge saving. My DCs never complained-I didn't get tatty second hand. They had hours of fun with a toy kitchen-it looked like new-same with bikes etc. The school Christmas Fair was a good place to buy it.

Sorry- i meant new book for £1

The flipside of all of this - and what pisses me off the most, more than the asking people who can't afford, more than the whinging/not whinging/not being involved - is the rather uncomfortable fact that because PTAs are now expected to pay for so much, that there is a two-tier school system in this country.

My friend's DD goes to a state school in leafy West London; the PTA has raised so much money that 'they don't know what to spend it on'. My dd's education, in a small, not very well off town, will not even be comparable to hers, simply because she will be at school with people whose parents don't earn £100k a year in the main. However much I join in/don't whinge/get on with it, that's not going to change.

FFS, if you can't afford to spend £1 on anything, then just don't go to the jumble sale! Nobody's making you go. Most people would think 10p for a book is pretty cheap and to carp about THAT is ridiculous. What do you expect, that the PTA members should come to your house and give you presents?
I assume if you can't afford a 10p book then you won't be buying any presents at Christmas? I have bought my dd a 50p pink toy dog from a charity shop which she is getting for Christmas. Should I moan to the charity shop that to some people 50p is a lot of money and so they should close the shop forwith as a result?
At our school the PTA funds books at school, which means people who cannot afford books benefit just as much as those who can. The shade provided is for the kids of the well off and the poor.

There is bound to be a two tier system, it would be unfair to tell parents that they were not allowed to raise too much in their school because the one at the other side of town can't afford it!
I want my DSs to have all the extras out of school. I want them to have a good library, computer suite, adventure playground, visiting authors, musicians, theatre groups, trips out and school residential trips etc etc. It is how I choose to spend my money, I scrimp on many things to provide it. I would resent being told that I can't have these things at school because some people can't afford it.

and as devout has pointed out, the actual point of the PTA and the fairs and the fundraising is to buy stuff to benefit ALL children.

I get annoyed with the people who chose to send their child to the smaller, less well funded school in my area and yet they whinge and refuse to help out/fundraise/contribute. There is a much bigger school in my area which is better funded, or maybe not better funded, but the voluntary contributions from so many more people mean that that school is better off.

The people who moan could have sent their child to that school, but they wanted a smaller school with all the benefits that that entails.

Can't have it both ways I'd LOVE to point out to them, but I bite my tongue. As I'm on the PTA and don't want to be mistaken for a bulldozer!

One quick point:-

It's v easy to confuse payments for things organised by School (Class photos, school trips, swimming lessons for eg)and payments for things organised by PTA (Tea towels, jumble sale, raffle)

VS - YANBU

Devoutsceptic, there you go again, telling me what I expect and what I have done. YOu know nothing about me.

The OP did not have a CHOICE over whether to attend the school fair, her daughter was taken there and placed behind something the school wanted the OP to hand money over for. The money raised by the PTA should NOT have to be used for books and other essentials. They should be for fripperies that are not necessary to education. The government should be funding books.

Unfortunately the government isn't funding sufficient books (I don't think they ever will).
You maybe haven't got to that stage yet, but by GCSE and 6th form you have to buy a lot of your DCs text books (at least you do in my area)-even on ebay they don't come cheap.

I have to say that it would cost me far less if the PTA fundraised to provide them!

Just wait until they start a course where they need a set book that costs £15.99 and you have to buy it-the school can't afford it and I don't think the government will provide it-however many times you tell them they should!
You will look back and appreciate the efforts of the PTA!!

piscesmoon I very much doubt I'll be joining the PTA since I have to work FT and it is more than likely that by that time I will have an additional 2 hours travel a day as well. The housework doesn't get done as it is.

The money the new governor wanted was in addition to the usual fundraising, not instead of

piscemoon, I so feel for you. I do not know if anyone else does that (a bit weird really), but when I have been on a thread for a longtime with someone, I feel like I can hear them while I am reading them. anyway, you have to be the most patient and determinate MNetter I have had the pleasure to read since I started, I would have given up long ago. I really admire people like you.

Yes, maybe it should pay for everything, but it doesn't. And I have never heard of anyone refusing to take advantage of stuff paid for by PTA fundraising out of principle. Most people have no idea where the money goes and so carp and whinge and take stuff for granted.
I am really amazed at how so many of you are held to ransom, not by the ordinary parents trying to raise money for the benefit of all the children, while providing cheap fun for parents and kids, but by your own kids who cannot seemingly be refused anything at all, or by your own guilt.

I don't call shade in the playground and a sensory room for children with SN and emotional difficulties 'fripperies' either.

If you keep on long enough Gorionine people get so bored with the subject they give up!

I have had years on PTAs and it is a thankless task with some people, you go to lots of committee meetings and ,believe it or not, you try to find ways of raising money that isn't constantly asking the parents and you take into account that many people have several DCs at the school and not much money and above all you put in hours of hard work. Despite this you will always get those who think you are have time on your hands and nothing better to do!

At a Christmas fair you are giving them the opportunity to buy second hand toys and books, of good quality, for Christmas presents and they will moan because there are calendars for sale.

The moaners never go to a committee meeting, never volunteer for any work and have no idea what the school would be like without the PTA raising money.

Secondary school will come as a shock-if you live in my area!

No, neither do I. So why have the governemt not paid for it already? Why have essentials having to be squeezed out of parents who have technically already paid for them? Why?

Unfortunately when your DC tells you they need a scientific calculator by Monday there isn't a lot of point in asking the government why they are not providing it-it is not going to get your DC a calculator by Monday! (or even next year).

I now what you mean being on the PTA as well. In our school, there is a regular newsletter, and since last year, whenever the PTA buys something for the school it is mentionned in it. Previuosly, a lot of people thought we were just a bunch of bored ladies baking cakes, I think it is now gradually sinking that we do actually get things done for the school. Maybe your school should make the parents more aware of how your contribution to the school is important. but at the end of the day, we cannot force people to undertand that or to understand that they do nor have to buy if they do not want to or can't. I liked devoutseptic's post about who's holding who to ransom.

As a child my parents were piss pot poor (it was the '80's and 4 million unemployed) and, yes, it it deeply humiliating to have parents who couldn't afford photos, raffle tickets, trip money etc.

We used to have to go for long walks along the hedgerows looking for Barrs' bottles to claim the 10p back from the shop.

I have never had to do this with my DCs and I feel unbeleivably lucky.

If you have never lost sleep about school asking for £1.50 for a disco then you should thank your lucky stars.

We all know the PTA can do fab work but they need to pace themselves.

Also you might be one of the unlucky fuckers that loses their jobs in the upcoming recession. There is so much smuggery on this thread it it unbearable.

Just a bit about smug me : live with DH and 4 DCs in two bed semi, do not have any money for any luxury, do not buy a school picture every year, do not go to all PTA events or go to lend a hand and do not buy anything.

Helping the PTA does not have to involve money!

My children get refused plenty. My children get refused a lot of things that I would dearly love to give them and simply can't. Things that their peers take for granted. It causes a deep sick feeling in the pit of your stomach, knowing that your refusal will hurt, knowing that a refusal is all you can give. And then to have insult added to injury, you think I should refuse to use the school's facilities, and take even more from my long suffering kids? The idea that I never say no to my children, that I am being held to ransom by their expectations, is so far from the truth it is laughable.

It's great that the PTA pay for stuff, really it is. But the fact that it is great doesn't inflate my income. If I gave more to the PTA I would have less for my children, and they have LITTLE ENOUGH. Yet the pressure is already on them to contribute, even at aged 5 my son comes home with tales of "We hafta pay a pound to wear our own clothes" "We hafta bring a bottle in for the bottle table" "We hafta get sponsors for this thing, put money in it Mummy." By telling our children what they "have to" do, you force us to either cough up or explain to their teacher.

Blimey Colditz, who here is insisting or demanding you do anything at all - I'm certainly not! At my school I don't go to everything, I CERTAINLY don't buy everything (no calendars, no cards, not even school photos if they are crap and the kids look like serial killers, only one book club book ever but I like the tea-towels) and I don't know or care who goes to what or pays for what. And my kids don't notice or mind at all - or if they do, they haven't told me yet!
Of course I don't fecking think for one minute you SHOULD refuse to use school facilities, and never once said anything of the sort. And I also, as it happens, have never told anyone's kids what they should or shouldn't do and certainly not what they 'have to do'. My kids have never come home and told me I 'have' to donate anything either,and if they did I would be cross. Any appeals are given out in a newsletter for adults. If it's happening differently at your school, don't blame me! Go to a meeting or email the committe and try to change it. Talk to your kids about what you can't afford when they make demands on you. At my school's PTA meetings I have sat with people really agonizing over what people can afford, and several of our PTA stalwarts are in low single income families, which is why this year we have had no entrance fees at all for children at various events (and 50p for adults) and a lot of effort is made to try to offer events that are inexpensive but fun for those who want them and that will help build a community spirit. I do feel slightly hacked off when people are happy for their kids to enjoy all the things and events the stuff the PTA helps provide provide, take no interest at all in the work involved (also, fair enough) but at the same time whinge endlessly behind people's backs about the stuff that is done or about how it is done and say nasty things about the so-called type of person who might get involved with any PTA. I grew up poor in a council house and call me strange, but I never once noticed my parents not being able to afford raffle tickets though not being able to afford food half the month was a bit of a bummer It was because we were poor that we all bloody loved jumble sales. Half our clothes and nearly all our toys came from them. We never resented the sea scouts/brownies/church for running them! I doubt you could buy clothes, books or toys cheaper than you can at our school's jumble sale, not even in charity shops, and there are some lovely things (I got a great GAP fleece for 20p for ds) so I don't see why spending money there, for example, takes people's money away from their kids. Surely you have to buy some clothes and perhaps the odd toy or book from time to time? Surely better to pay 20p than ten times that amount or more?