to feel uncomfortable being served by woman with tourettes that kept swearing at me?

[racmac]

I went to a well known high street store and was served by a lady who had tourettes. I have no problem with this or any of her ticks BUT she kept saying cunt and wanker - i dont use these words in front of my children so dont expect others to AIBU in expecting that she shouldnt be serving customers?

It was rather disconcerting to be told "thats £20.00 please, cunt, wanker"

Racmac

Absolutely. M&S isn't a charity. They employed this woman because she was the best for the job.

"To have a blanket ban on people with tourettes working in customer service would be as unreasonable as having a blanket ban on black people working in customer service."

Quite right. I wouldn't argue with that, and nor would anyone sane. However it's not answering my question!

Ultimately M&S took this decision, based on this individual salesperson, and decided that her vocal tics were not so severe as to compromise her effectiveness in her job - they'd certainly know best and I wouldn't argue with it.

I still do think that there are some conditons which you could have which would be less than ideal in a sales/customer services role. Very serious halitosis or excessive sweating or body odour wouldn't compromise your ability to do an excellent job, or be an excellent human being, but they are not irrelevant, and they shouldn't be. Nor is Tourette's, and nor should it be.

Of course YANBU!!

There are plenty of other more suitable jobs where this woman would be surrounded by colleagues who were aware of her condition and would not be surprised by it.

This like saying a deaf person should work in a call centre!

"This like saying a deaf person should work in a call centre! "

What is your definition of deaf? Do you know any deaf people?

Someone with unilateral deafness would have absolutely no problem working in a call centre. My son wore hearing aids for mild deafness until recently, (his hearing has now improved and he no longer uses them.) He used the telephone very effectively by turning his hearing aids to the T-setting. He also has excellent speech. My father in law is severely deaf and he uses a loop system to listen to the TV.

Even if someone is profoundly deaf in both ears they might manage a call centre job if they had a cochelar implant. You would be surprised how sucessful some deaf people's cochelar implants are. The technology is getting better all the time. I know some profoundly deaf people who see deafness as a difference rather than a disablity.

Again its a case of saying "how?" Rather than can't. The DDA is about making reasonable adjustments.

There are some conditions like profound autism that would make it hard to work in customer service/ call centre. However such a person would never in a million years apply for such a job. They aren't expected to look for work.

The DDA is about making employers give fair consideration to applicants. What is illegal is to not to consider someone just because of a label.

Really tired - glad to hear of the advances in technology. I was referring to profoundly deaf in both ears, no technology, could not hear what the caller was saying - ie not suitable for that particular post.

I am all for DDA but still feel that it was a bad decision on the employer's part to place a woman such as the OP described in a customer serving role. What about customers who were ignorant of tourettes? I feel it is unfair on the employee to place her in such a position. Knowing how some people react nowadays, she could suffer from verbal abuse.

Replying to the OP only- There are some people (particularly older people and religious people) who would find these words really, really offensive. Of course nobody will die from hearing bad language, but I do think it is commercial suicide if large numbers of people are being put off going to the store in case they have to be sworn at by this assistant.

I do think there is such a thing as aptness for the job. The example of the lady with Tourette's working in a kitchen is a good one, as she would not stand out at all working in Ramsay's kitchen!

I am intrigued by the rude word thing with Tourette's- why Cunt and Wanker rather than Penguin and Swissroll? I suppose it must be to do with taboos slipping through the safety net. So if a Tourette's person with a tendency to swear grows up in a household where swearing is completely acceptable, rather than one where it is unacceptable, maybe they never develop the compulsive swearing thing? Interesting paradox.

"I am all for DDA but still feel that it was a bad decision on the employer's part to place a woman such as the OP described in a customer serving role."

Yet, again you are making a judgment based on nothing more than a label. You have never met the woman and you know nothing about her. [exasabated emoticon]

MrsSeanBean, Its all well being pro DDA, but is attitudes like your which the DDA was brought in to combat.

what realytired said

"Knowing how some people react nowadays, she could suffer from verbal abuse."

But she probably knows that and can deal with it. Her choice to put herself in that position - why should someone else make that choice for her?

ReallyTired, I thought your point was that it should be up to the employer, no? Which was what I was saying anyway.

You don't know the woman either so why are we all getting so worked up about it? It's all subjective and hypothetical.

Did you mean exasperated btw? me too.

"am all for DDA but still feel that it was a bad decision on the employer's part to place a woman such as the OP described in a customer serving role. What about customers who were ignorant of tourettes? I feel it is unfair on the employee to place her in such a position. Knowing how some people react nowadays, she could suffer from verbal abuse."

Other people's ignorance should not be taken into account when considering suitability for a job. That's their problem.

I think the thread has demonstrated nice;y the need for the DDA.

I am not saying she should not have been employed. I for one would be unhappy (esp if had dc preesent) to hear language like that. And as the customer I am always right. If I were the OP I would have complained to the store. This is getting ridiculous. I am off to feed Sean. G'Night all. Don't get too far up your own backsides.

Do you understand the DDA MrsSeanBean? It's not PC nonsense, it's the law.

I think you'll find it is a public order offence to repeatedly use bad language in public too. So don't jump on the law bandwagon!

lol... I am sure there are plenty of people who are guilty of that offence who don't have complex verbal tics.

I am sure that the police and the courts have never apprehended or convicted someone with tourettes of public nuisance.

The DDA is enforced and it is law. As a democracy if you don't like it you have several options.

a) Don't shop at M&S.
b) Write to MP stating that you feel the DDA should be rescinded. If your MP agrees with you, then he might propose a private act of parlament to modify the DDA.
c) Move to a different country where disabled people are locked away and your children will not hear any swearing in English.

(d) call the offender a c*nt back (in solidarity)

MrsSeanBean you really are incredibly ignorant.

And a fine example of why the DDA exists I would guess.

I repeat what I said earlier. As a society we clearly have a long way to go with regards disablity reading some of the posts on this thread.

jimjamshaslefttheyurt,

I think I have been guilty of having mindless prejuices. It is partly life experiences and education that have helped to lift the prejuices that I used to have.

The problem is that you can not easily develop that kind of maturity and can do attitude that M & S obviously have.

Last year the school I worked at employed a profoudly deaf teacher. I am embrassed to say that at the time I thought it was daft. I thought that he would never be capable to cope with meetings and the whole thing was a bit of a PC joke.

Infact this teacher was extremely effective with both the deaf and the hearing kids. (Although he mainly taught the deaf kids) He was well liked and everyone was sad when he returned to Australia.

I now feel pretty ashamed of myself to think that over a year ago I thought the school was being daft.

It's my Human Rights innit?

You are so easily wound up btw.

Yes it's something to do with being surrounded by the utterly ignorant every time we go outside. To see the same spouting off on here, gives a chance to say what I I would like to say when I see them in public. It's really quite therapeutic.

Reallytired- I suppose that shows how effective something like the DDA will be in changing attitudes (not suggesting that the DDA was involved there).