To not have sex unless I actually want to

[OverOverOverAgain]

Me and my husband been having issues for last couple of years. We have young kids amd full time jobs and we have grown apart. We don't have much in common

Tonight we had a "chat" after a month or so of barely saying two words to each other

I've slept in spare room for months. My choice. I find it hard to sleep next to a man I barely talk to for days.

He said our lack of sex life was a driver in our issues. I said its a symptom of the issues, not the cause. He disagreed and said we should schedule sex and commit to regular sex and the closeness and love will follow

I said "but I don't want to have sex when its so frosty between us" and he said "so?". And I said "i have to want it"

He replied "well I'd rather you want to have sex but even if you dont - I'd rather you just did it anyway - because I need ti have sex, and our relationship needs it. You refusing is causing huge distance" and so on.

Im just sat here by myself at 11pm on a Sunday unable to sleep mulling it over in my head

But it feels like a really shitty thing to have said. But maybe there is a grain of truth to it. I need some advice!

This. And now that he has actually admitted, out loud, that he sees her as a masturbation tool and would be happy for her to lie back and think of England, there is no way to fix this.

OK did you ever really want to? And if so, if he was as attentive, keen, pleasant and kind as back then, do you think you would?

Because he sounds like an utter cunt. And I don't think most people find that attractive.

Realistically, very few people are happy in a sexless marriage. You don’t talk, you don’t sleep in the same room, it seems like you don’t even like each other?

There is the obvious ‘you don’t have to have sex with anyone if you don’t want to’ but there is the follow up that your husband is very unhappy, you are unhappy, is there anything worth saving? Is it worth counselling? Or do you both want to move on without each other?

Your husband doesn’t seem like he is prepared to carry on in a sexless marriage. I’m a woman, I wouldn’t live like that either.

I think you might have to make the choice between working on your marriage with proper counselling and so on, or divorcing. I don’t see any other solution her tbh.

Men need sex to feel loved.
Women need to feel loved to want sex

If you want to stay together, you need couple Therapy

this marriage will end, unless you both try to work at fixing it.

“The truth is I never want to have sex with him”.

^ There’s nothing more to say.

If he’s not happy to go without and you can’t face sex with him, tell him and divorce. It’s not going to work, you’ve not said you love him so I’m presuming you don’t. If you do, then maybe counselling. Do you want sex generally? (putting his behaviour aside) could you be peri? Only you know if your marriage is worth saving…

Lol. No.

Your marriage is pretty much over if you both can't give in to each other. You need connection he needs sex. Both are valid. One of you is going to have to bridge the gap or give up. Not saying he or you are right just that you have to decide what you want. sometimes humility is a good way to start the conversation or remove an obstacle and find out what is really going on. If you gave him sex would he make an effort to connect or is it he wants what he wants and doesn't really care what you want. I think therapy might be a good first step

I've heard that a lot but it never made any sense to me when men are far more likely to have meaningless sex. If they need it to feel loved you'd think they'd fall in love after every ONS!

“yes I have suggested date nights and effort on his part in other ways. Has never happened.”

This is the bit that sticks out to me. I know not everyone reads beyond the OP but I wish they would as this is not the case of a man who is trying to save his marriage. He’s done zero, he’s willing to do zero. All he’s doing is making demands of OP and blaming her for not having sex with him.

I can totally understand your concern about his willingness to have sex with you knowing you don’t want to. Honestly his words go beyond a pragmatic understanding of some level of maintenance sex in a long-term relationship, which PPs are referencing.

I don’t think you should have sex with him. I think it will only push you two further apart as you will, justifiably, resent and hate him for being able to do that to you knowing you don’t want to.

'Men need sex to feel loved' is just more coercive shit. They don't feel loved by their parents? They aren't turning cold and cruel after one night stands? They can't see that someone sacrificing their own needs for them might be something other than a random act?

OP I'm so sorry. You must feel either very lonely and confused or just plain devastated. Please keep your dignity. Doing what he wants will only make things worse; you'll hate him and yourself. The only thing that can make this right now is a sincere apology and I doubt that he'll have had an overnight revelation. Can you try and have positive thoughts about a future without him?

I think it applies when men are in a relationship and have feelings for the woman.

It's a well-researched sex difference, actually.

Time to carefully end things between you.

Why is there so much pushback against this? It's a well-researched sex difference.

Ask him to imagine saying to a women he liked when he first met them 'have sex with me and the closeness and love will follow' versus 'shall we go on a date'. Which is more appropriate?

It's not quite the same though, is it, because they're married, so the assumption is that the closeness and love is already there under the crap and can be unearthed. Their situation is very different from people who just met.

It won't be unearthed if he doesn't romance the OP though, which is the part he doesn't seem to get.

I've got that line from a Madonna song in my head. "He needs to start with your hand."

But it might help him understand...option 1 is a complete turn off....no on is having sex with the guy that says that.

He has put it horribly but there is an element of truth to what he is saying. Couples who work at showing affection even when they don't feel affectionate actually do become genuinely more intimate and affectionate over time.
A kind of "fake it 'till you make it" approach. You can read about it online or in one of the many marriage and relationship books you have no doubt bought to try and find a way to fix your marriage.....

And before I get jumped on you don't have to have sex with anyone if you don't want to, but someone has to make a first step which might just be to start being nice to each other.

Oh, I would say it. I would also divorce him.

Re. your first para, so basically a positive feedback loop is created.

But how would they get started, since they're both so entrenched in their positions?

OP, I do think that couples counselling could be really helpful. Even if you end up splitting. The counsellor might be able to get through to him how much you need romance and affection and how his long-term failure to provide those things has led to a negative feedback loop which is now basically a spiral to the bottom. They might be able to see make him see how differently men and women approach sex and connection, and that neither of you are to blame, and how to start treating each other in such a way as to kindle the flames in the way that each of you wants them to be kindled. He needs sex to kindle love. You need love to kindle sex.

Only you know if your husband is coercive or if he spoke clumsily from desperation when he said you could give him a hand job and that you have to. If you haven't had sex for a long time, and if he hasn't gone elsewhere, he will be in a pretty bad way, psychologically. I was in a marriage where my husband wouldn't sleep with me for months on end, and I can't tell you how trapped and depressed it made me feel. And I hadn't even been especially sexual before he took it away! The problem was that I couldn't have it with him......but at the same time, I couldn't have it with anyone else either. Not when you're married. He was my sole source of physical affection, romance, touch, and when he took it away, it was devastating because in doing so, he took all hope I had of ever having those things again. Maybe your husband meant "You have to" in the sense of "You HAVE to otherwise I am going to psychologically shrivel up and die from being cut off from physical affection, touch, and romance!" To many men, sex with their wives IS romance - or, a huge part of it.

A positive is that he is talking to you about it, instead of going elsewhere.

Your marriage is basically over OP. You have different needs and neither is willing to meet the others' needs. You're stuck and it's not going to change.

You're not suddenly going to want to have sex with him if your emotional needs aren't met. It sounds like you don't have time/ can't be bothered to pursue times when your emotional needs may be better met. Equally, he shouldn't have to go without sex for long periods if it's really important to him (incidentally, how long OP?).

So I suggest you either get counselling or split up.

I speak from considerable experience. And whilst I never had sex which I wasn't committed to having, I didn't 'want' it in the sense of desiring it. It was difficult and awkward to start with. But things got a lot better for both of us - empirically and physically.

You have to push yourself in areas you're not comfortable with for change to happen. And being married long term does take some self sacrifice. If neither of you are willing to do that, or if it's always one of you doing that, then it's over.

I think a lot of men feel entitled to their wives' bodies, much more so after marriage than before. It's a reason I wouldn't marry again - one of the many reasons!

Men need sex to feel close. Women need to feel close to want sex.

You want him to do what you want, he wants you to do what he wants.... How are you going to compromise? If you don't want to have sex with him, you can't expect him to stay in this marriage. He doesn't want a sexless marriage.

I'm married. Haven't had sex in 13 years because I don't want to. Told husband I'm not going to force myself into having sex with you and that's it. Take it or leave it. My libido is nonexistant due to antidepressants so it's not like I want to have sex with anyone else. He either accepts it or he doesn't.

@OverOverOverAgain The fact that you have given him an insight as to what might be behind your lack of libido (needing to feel loved and cared for) and his lack of investment and entitlement to your body tells me he's a selfish knob tbh. How can he possibly think that you want to have sex when you don't even want to sleep together? With dh we always cuddle at night which I think is important- there is an emotional connection even if the sexual is gone. If he had pestered me for sex while knowing fully well that I don't want to I would have withdrawn completely and slept in another room as well.

Why are you still together? It sounds like it’s over. No I wouldn’t have sex with him when you don’t and its quite grim that he is happy to do that knowing you don’t want to.