To not have sex unless I actually want to

[OverOverOverAgain]

Me and my husband been having issues for last couple of years. We have young kids amd full time jobs and we have grown apart. We don't have much in common

Tonight we had a "chat" after a month or so of barely saying two words to each other

I've slept in spare room for months. My choice. I find it hard to sleep next to a man I barely talk to for days.

He said our lack of sex life was a driver in our issues. I said its a symptom of the issues, not the cause. He disagreed and said we should schedule sex and commit to regular sex and the closeness and love will follow

I said "but I don't want to have sex when its so frosty between us" and he said "so?". And I said "i have to want it"

He replied "well I'd rather you want to have sex but even if you dont - I'd rather you just did it anyway - because I need ti have sex, and our relationship needs it. You refusing is causing huge distance" and so on.

Im just sat here by myself at 11pm on a Sunday unable to sleep mulling it over in my head

But it feels like a really shitty thing to have said. But maybe there is a grain of truth to it. I need some advice!

Your relationship is over by the sounds of it.

It's pretty normal to want sex in a relationship. You don't want to have sex with him or even sleep in the same room. That's your perogative but you need to at least be honest and call it a day.

Sounds like your marriage is over and the sooner you both realise that and separate the better.

Few answers

The "big chat" last night was instigated by me. In the back of my mind, I thought (and hoped honestly) we might conclude to call it a day. He turned it into sex conversation as he sees it as source of our problems. At end of the chat, he was kissing me all over saying "i love you i love. I fancy you so much". I was numb. I thought perhaps he would see how miserable we are and we could agree to discuss separation

That didnt happen. I know i dont need permission.

Why am I still here? The kids. Really struggle to impact kids like this. And some ridiculous sense of guilt and responsibility to H. Whenever I bring up unhappiness he has a way of making me feel I am failing at marriage. That nothing is more important that commitment, and sticking together no matter what and my "complaints" (and lack of sex drive) show lack of commitment on my side.

Does it help if I gently remind you that it takes two to have a successful marriage? Why does all the responsibility for the success or failure of yours lie with you?

I have an ex who cannot be at fault, and always always locates fault or blame in others. He never looks for his own part in the situation. Some people are like that.

That nothing is more important that commitment, and sticking together no matter what and my "complaints" (and lack of sex drive) show lack of commitment on my side.

No relationship is unconditional. It’s perfectly reasonable not to accept your partner demanding sex but doing nothing at all to mitigate the factors you have outlined. It should be a 2-way street, and the fact that he wants it all to be your fault/responsibility is a massive red flag.

Except we also see it all the time when couple are still having an active sex life, so what did women do wrong then? Not kinky enough? Not performing well enough? Not giving enough blow jobs without expecting anything in return? Dared to age?
Some people will always find a way to blame women when men cheat.

How old are the kids?

Of course he's not wrong to want intimacy with his wife, but it's a big jump from that to expecting her to have sex when she really doesn't want to, without doing anything that might make her want to. When you look at some of the insane lengths men will go to to get sex, it does seem weird that he won't do a few household chores so his wife isn't completely exhausted and put upon. If the only answer is "she should just do it because I want it and it doesn't matter if she doesn't want to, she'll come around later", well, that's not good enough. You've clearly communicated what it is you need but all he seems to be prepared to do is act out foreplay.

I do think it sounds like it might be too late though. Even if he did start pulling his weight a bit at home (and that sounds unlikely), he'll only be doing it for sex, so the pressure is on and it'll feel transactional, and I can definitely see him thinking that unloading the dishwasher entitles him to a marathon session.

He just wants to have his cake and eat it.

He wants sex, everything done for him at home, even not having to earn money (??)

OP doesn't feel happy? His solution is to tell her tough luck.

He's hitting her where it hurts by guilting her about "commitment" (aka put up and shut up)

I'm very sorry OP.

So he's at the gym everyday, while you do everything?
He's not going to want to have those children much.
Start organising yourself for a divorce.
Your children need their one involved parent mentally well, not subjecting her mental health to coercive sex for a selfish lazy man who wants to use her body.

He knows well what the right thing is here, he just is too selfish and lazy to share the load.

At end of the chat, he was kissing me all over saying "i love you i love. I fancy you so much". I was numb

Again OP, this man doesn’t even like you let alone love you. Love is not just a feeling, it’s an action.

He’s happy for you to keep sleeping a room by yourself and for there to be no real connection or interaction between you as long as you come into “service” him, he’s also happy for you to be unsupported and do everything for the family. He’s happy for your need for affection and emotional connection to go unmet while you raise his children.

That is not love.

As myself and others have said if he really wants sex that bad, and he thinks doing his fair share would help pave the way for it - why would he not do it?

I mean even sex aside why didn’t he care enough to not want the burden of everything placed on you?

Look at his actions, not his words.

Marriage takes two to make it work. He’s not willing to put in any effort to help around the house when you’ve told him that’s a big issue - he’s not willing to make the marriage work.

He’s accusing you of a lack of commitment- where is his commitment to change and improve?

As for failing the kids - you’re failing them anyway by showing them a man can do nothing around the house while his wife is run ragged and unhappy but she’ll put up with it. They will notice. This is not a good example for them.

Me and my husband been having issues for last couple of years. We have young kids amd full time jobs and we have grown apart. We don't have much in common

Ok. It sounds like you've checked out of the marriage at all levels.

He may have checked out at all levels except the carnal, OR he might not have checked out and still love/care about you and the kids.

You don't explicitly say what his attitude is (apart from the sex aspect). So i can kinda see some situations in which a "let's make.an effort" please might make sense. Like you exhorting him to make an effort with the housework.

But regardless of his attitude about sex, you need to make a choice - continue and try to make changes, or part ways. If its the latter then he needs to know that.

If you are prepared to try then you need to discuss small steps... on all the issues that bug both of you. Of which physical contact is just one, albeit important, part.

So is hugging off the table, being in the same bed but just cuddling, etc?

Or is staying together to parent what you want, but in a sexless/affectionless marriage? In which case you have to come to some agreement on how either/both of you fulfils that specific need.

Thats a far more.important set of things to consider than whether what he has said is gross.

From what you say it seems that you have no intimate/private time together to remember who you are and why you liked each other. It's very hard to then feel like you're a pair trying to fix things, rather than two individuals each trying to win in a negotiation about their needs.

When you look at some of the insane lengths men will go to to get sex, it does seem weird that he won't do a few household chores so his wife isn't completely exhausted and put upon

Yeah, that’s why I’ve said I honestly feel it’s deliberate when men dig their heels in these kind of situations. Because even a selfish man would think if nothing else it is in their own interest to get on with doing the “little things” so they can have a wife more likely to have sex.

They are refusing to do anything because they have such contempt for their partner and actively don’t want to improve her life and they are misogynists who want to call the shots .

They have to accept it, what choice do they have

They can leave.

I wouldn't want a man to start doing more round the house, be a better dad or anything thing else so that I gave him more sex. That is a total desire killer because it makes the sex obligational.

That man should do those things anyway. Sex shouldn't be transactional in a marriage, otherwise he may as well just pay you as you're basically a prostitute. Many men think they are owed and deserve sex simply for being in a committed relationship.

Most cannot get their heads round women's desire not being impulsive and immediate like their own, nor do they understand that, particularly in a LTR, women need to feel loved, respected and cherished at the very least, in order to be able to want sex.

I cannot understand for the life of me how anyone, man or woman, could ever have sex with someone they know didn't want it. That's repulsive and rapey.

It's sexual coercion and your DH OP, needs to stop relying on your bodily orifices to regulate his mood and boost his ego. He needs to get himself help. There is nothing wrong with desiring your wife, there is everything wrong with coercing them into having unwanted sex with you and not dealing with why she doesn't desire him anymore.

@OverOverOverAgain ,

I am not sure this is as much about sex and housework as either of you think!

You both know that you have drifted apart, and neither of you are happy. As you said, this has been going on for years.

You think the old feelings can be brought back by him doing more chores. He thinks that getting back to regular sex will give you both back that feeling. Neither are realistic.

It sounds like he is desperate to stay with you or, at least, isn’t mature enough to admit it is over. You sound like you know it is over, but are procrastinating about getting the process going. You said as much on your second but last post.

You just need to bite the bullet, and sooner rather than later. Nearly half of all marriages end in divorce and, if handled well, the children come out of it fine.

You said in a previous post that you still want sex, but not with him. He clearly wants sex, or at least thinks that he does. Where will that dynamic lead unless you split up properly?

I also love how men say they need to have sex to feel bonded and connected to their wives, yet many will shag anything with a pulse if it bends over in front of them.

YANBU. I would not have sex with this man ever again. Look up Abbey Eckel who posts a lot about women doing all the work inside and outside the home, and having a husband living his best life, who allows his wife to run herself into the ground looking after the family without helping her at all. And then expects her to actually want sex with him !
A lot of her stuff will resonate with you I think

Its truly incredible to me that so many women(?) have posted responses about saving the relationship whilst only focusing on his demands for sex, and absolutely zero about his lack of contribution to housework, childcare and finances, never mind his inability to even spend time with his wife. Its like they think a man's "needs" are more important than anything else.

Well he’s already said the romance won’t be happening and l really don’t think sex in return for help with the housework is a great tool for reconciliation.

So you do everything for the children, do everything in the house and you are the main breadwinner and you pay all the bills while he does fuck all to help and whines that you don't want sex?

Honestly, he is a horrible husband and I'm not surprised that you don't want sex with him. You must be dog tired and sheer exhaustion and resentment are hardly aphrodisiacs.

Does he bring anything positive to the relationship?

It’s not going to be fixed IMO because clearly there is no love or respect on his side.

I don’t think he even likes her and will become increasingly resentful that his “wife appliance” that does everything else isn’t performing her “sex function”.

Yeah he definitely should be doing his fair share for their family/home whether she has sex with him or not.

He’s awful.

however, if he wasn’t so awful, then what I would recommend is -

committing to the date night/intimacy time that o allow sexual attraction to arise , but not promising the sex itself

If I were you I would say that either we get a divorce or we go to marriage counselling. Then if he is willing, give him one last chance to hear you and respond by actually acting in loving ways to you. But I strongly suspect he will refuse to go and you’ll get a divorce. But I think it will give you peace to know for sure he just won’t put in the effort.

I am actually baffled at the modern twist on misogyny that’s going on nowadays in marriages.

We went from the old fashioned “trad” men doing absolutely nothing at home, but at least being the breadwinners, to this present day where some of them expect to bring absolutely nothing but their penis to the marriage/home while the wife runs themselves ragged at home and at work.

It’s like the worst of both worlds.

And they wonder why some women are opting out altogether.

Why am I still here? The kids. Really struggle to impact kids like this

Throughout this whole depressing thread I was screaming inside "why on earth don't you just leave this man you can't stand and don't want to go near, and who doesn't seem to respect you" and I knew what the answer would be and there it fucking is like clockwork.

OP if you need to hear these facts to give yourself permission to leave then here they are: the impact on your kids of growing up amidst this shitshow of a relationship will be much much greater than whatever it will be if you split now, early enough that you can still make coparenting work amicably.

Parents splitting up when kids are young may indeed result in sadness and tears for a few weeks, which is nothing compared to the lifelong psychological effects of growing up in a hostile household and having a loveless marriage modelled to them.

Also, you obviously shouldn't have sex that you don't want to, but I think your husband might be right about one thing: I don't think that, even if he started pulling his weight and more with the chores, it would make you any more attracted to him. The ship has sailed.