More Councils to trial 4 day week for 5 days pay

[mrsm43s]

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/green-party-four-day-working-week-lambeth-council-lewisham-hackney-b1299448.html

So what do you think about this? Apparently in South Cambs, the trial was successful leading to cost savings snd improved staff satisfaction, and is now a permanent arrangement.

Personally, I'm all for it, but must admit it's because I work for a local authority, and the more councils that adopt this, then the more likely I am to benefit from it in the future. That said, as a Council tax payer, I can understand people being upset at ever rising CT bills when staff are being handed a free day off a week.

But trials have shown improved services, not less services. And there's nothing stopping thd private sector adopting a 4 day week if they like...

Maybe they just have something more important to deal with ?

I bet loads of people think I am useless when I take ages to reply but they don't see the huge amount of other work that I am doing. I average a 50 hour week I reckon. On a salary that was frozen for a decade and has never caught up . Working in teams that are half the size they used to be. With shitty IT.

Yes.

But the message they are sending is that people who are doing five days work can do it in four days.

So if you were a very efficient worker, there is actually a very good chance that your four days a week is someone else’s five days a week.

They’re effectively saying all those five days can be done in four days so how will they prove that the current four day crop haven’t been doing that all along?

That is a totally separate issue from proportionate scaling down of hours that are already part-time.

you know those places that have a flexible start time, e.g. between 8 and 10

I used to start at 10 am in one of those and leave at 6 pm. Every so often the boss would send people home early. She would let the 8 am and 9 am people go off…. And then about half an hour later, she’d let me go off.

Her argument was “ you achieve a lot more in less time than a lot of other people around here”.

Like I said, I just see lawsuit waiting to happen.

I mean, look at the discrimination cases behind all the Birmingham bin strike stuff…. Funnily enough, I’m not sure what I think of those. But I do think this one is staring them right in the face. I wonder if they haven’t got many four day people. If any

I’ve had a lot of people say to me “don’t go for four days a week because you’ll just be told you you’ve got to stuff in five days work”. I’ve never worked in the public sector by the way.

Come work in the public sector then if you think it's so cushy

It works both ways though. I definitely did 5 days of work when I was on a 4 day a week contract but it suited me because I wanted that day off and they needed someone to do a very full time role and it was a job I really wanted. It felt mutually beneficial to me

No need to question it. Don't worry about part timers. Let's just get it done. We need to get the working week down to 2-3 days max so this is a step in the right direction. The rest of business will follow suit eventually so be happy for council employees.

Why don't we drop it to one day a week then, surely the council workers will be superheroes at that rate?

Was that because they knew it was being trialled? So they had a vested interest in pulling their finger out their arse and working their butts off? Compared to their previous slacking?

once it’s made permanent and official they go back to their slack arse ways and do three days worth of work in four days.

So you were paid for 28 hours when you were actually doing 35 hours?

I'm really interested in how this works for part time workers. My union are currently pushing it with our employer but really strongly in favour of everyone taking a scaled reduction in hours. I'd much rather keep working 3 days for more money...I think it'll be great for current full time workers but plenty of current part time workers (so majority women) won't get any say in how their contracts are changed.

In my experience LA staff don't slack, they generally work very hard. Being able to fill vacant posts, less time spent recruiting and training, less time onboarding agency staff and working with new/agency staff that don't know the ropes, better continuity of service for clients and less transferring of caseloads with staff needing to familiarise themselves with cases previously msnaged by someone else will all be ways that services can be cheaper, more efficient and better for residents whilst also taking less time to deliver. Not to mention saving the costs of burnt out staff going off sick with all the associated management time and agency cover costs as well as sick pay and ill health retirfment costs.

You mean 4 longer days for the same pay? Like 5 over 4?

If you're public sector, I'd imagine the default would be reduced hours for cost saving. You'd no doubt be able to apply for more hours, just like you currently can. The scheme is a reduction in working hours scheme, not a 20% payrise scheme. If it's anything like South Cambs, you'll also be able to opt out if you want, and continue working your existing hours for your existing pay (but why would you?)

No, 4 days work (max 32 hours per week) for 5 days pay. AFAIK compressed hours (5 over 4 days, or 9 day fortnights) are already freely available at most LAs and have been for decades if you prefer that work pattern. This is something different.

My council doesn't respond to emails or answer the phone anyway, so I guess I won't notice any difference if they adopted this scheme.

It wont work in front line statutory services, unless either

a) there is a rota of staff meaning on your day off each week, someone covers for you and you cover for someone else for their day off

or

b) it is condensed hours, which given I frequently work over 60 hours for 37 hours pay, I wouldnt be keen on

or

c) it is accepted that statutory services run over 4 days, not 5 for the day teams and the out of hours teams run over 3 days instead of 2. That wont go down well

If schools run 5 days a week, who do they phone for statutory responses on day number 5 when the LA shuts down on a Friday (as an example)?

But you’d be working fewer hours for the same money

you could then increase your hours for increased money, I guess. And the actual value of your hour has gone up 20% under a scheme like this.

Do you happen to know how it would apply to employees who have to be present in a particular place to do their jobs? Refuse collectors for example.

And anyway, what will happen over time is that new starters wont receive 5 days money for 4 days work, the salary will be adjusted and lower

So services cut, wages cut.

Sorry to be / sound rude, but surely if they can do 5 days work in 4 it means they were dragging their work out over 5 days because they weren’t fully utlilised - so they’re overstaffed?

I think this is great, there's too much focus from many employees on being at work for a certain number of hours rather than output.
I work efficiently and have had several jobs where I could complete all work to a high standard in 4 days but had to be there for my contracted hours. It's boring and demotivating.
This change needs to happen across the board to give employees better work life balance

Presumably the front line teams will just stagger their days off so that all 5 days are covered. They won't all have say Mondays off, and shut the service for a day! Just as how they plan for annual leave etc.

People would be against it simply because many believe that work should be as hard as possible, or at least harder than their job is/was.

No sorry, all I know is what I read on the S.Cambs website, plus some discussions that have speculatively happened in my workplace. I do think if these three London Councils adopt this, my (also London) Council might follow suit (fingers crossed!)

@mrsm43s does that apply to teachers?

Secondary school teaching is about 10 hours a week per day you work, so full time is 50 hours a week which is tough. So I take a 20% pay cut to work 4 days a week so I can also fit in my kids activities!

Does that mean I can work 4 days a week for full pay instead???? 🙄