To wonder if foster care is the best of the bad options if our children were to lose both DH and I?

[ohmaaaan]

Horrible subject but …

In the event of something happening to both DH and myself. I’m wondering if our children might be better in the care system. I know the usual response is no, absolutely not - but we don’t have anyone who could take them. The only person who could realistically take them in is SIL and BIL, who live a long way away and have their own children and a house full. They are nice people but the children don’t know them very well, largely because of the distance.

I would ideally want them to stay at the same school and in the same area but maybe that’s not realistic.

Obviously hope it doesn’t happen.

I will admit I am totally playing devils advocate here but in the event of us both dying I’m wondering how they’d find SIL and BIL if PIL had died by then.

I’m hijacking the thread slightly, to ask anybody with experience of this: we have relatives who would at first sight look very suitable to take in our kids if DH and I die. But actually they are not suitable at all and we would prefer the kids go to our close friends.

If we put a statement in our wills explaining why we don’t think the relatives are suitable is that something the social services would take into account? Or would we be better appointing a guardian and giving them all the info so they can advocate for our kids to not go to those relatives?

Well, all information should be in your wills etc, but, depending on how old your children are, they should know about any arrangements made. Our DS is 14 now, but has known for many years which family member would be in loco parentis if we both died.

No guarantees that foster carers would be local or even in the same county.
Your children might be separated.
The might experience multiple changes of foster home or older go to children's homes.

Foster care is a safety net but it won't be first choice.

Social services would first go to any friends or relatives who could possibly take them.
Only if there's absolutely no one suitable would they look at foster care.

why not ask them and see what they say.

There will be records showing who your relatives are.

It isn’t really about what they say, in this instance. It is more my misgivings which would be horribly rude to verbalise!

@maggisimpson would there? Genuine question, I am wondering what records and where would show this.

I couldn’t scroll past this thread without saying something. I am sure most foster care is delivered by well meaning, experienced people. We adopted our children and they had been I foster care for 18 months. There were other children in the foster home at the same time and despite very good foster carers my eldest was abused by an older child in their care. Foster care is a huge unknown. I wouldn’t even consider this, the damage is still present many years later.

Firstly, try to keep perspective because the chances of both you and your DH being removed from their lives simultaneously are very slim. If you are feeing anxious about this, I would encourage counselling or speaking to your HV who can talk these fear through and advise where to get support. However, it is still wise to have this conversation with your partner (and family) and to prepare your wills in anticipation.

Do you have close local friends (children’s godparents) who your children know, like and feel safe with? Depending on the age of your children, you should be exploring who you would prefer them to live with in an ideal situation and, no, the foster system should not be your back up, however remote the possibility if you and DH dying is.

We set our wills up so that our best friends (and godparents to the DC) were co executors along side DH’s sister and arranged for both to assume guardianship. The friends agreed that in the unlikely occurrence of a ‘wipe out’ event, they would raise our children in their homes with their children (with whom my DC were close and familiar) unless DC preferred to live with my unmarried SiL (who has no children).

It seemed macabre to discuss it, but putting it in place stopped me worrying about it as I had little resources within my own bio family. But try to keep in perspective that whilst 40k children a year lose a single parent - it is extraordinarily rare that children become ‘double orphans’. Your wills should really be focused on preferred outcomes in the event of one of you dying rather than catastrophising about the worst case scenario.

Birth certificates, school records, facebook even.

I think a number of people have said this. It is pot luck isn’t it? And it’s also been said a few times that they may not be together and they may not stay local.

So I am aware.

@AnonyMumAuDHD i promise I have perspective on this and I recognise it is unlikely. Just the same, it’s possible. Hence why we have car seats and smoke alarms and carbon monoxide detectors, etc.

Just to add that foster care is never an ideal solution for any child. The outcomes for looked after children as a cohort are significantly lower than for children cared for by family. There is something about being cared for by people who are paid to look after you that feels very different to being cared for by someone who is in some way connected to you. Also, there really aren’t enough foster carers for children who desperately need them and they aren’t really an “option”, more an absolute last resort of the state. Another thing people forget is that being in foster care also means being visited regularly by a social worker, carrying the stigma of being a looked after child, having review meetings and plans. This isn’t normal or ideal for any child.

If you think they would be terrible surrogate parents, could you appoint trusted friends as guardians and let them decide who is most appropriate?

That’s my tentative plan at the moment. Thank you

If you have a large estate from the sale of your house and life insurance, you could pay boarding school fees and the children could visit their aunt and uncle for holidays.

I think that would be preferable to taking your chances with foster care.

Sounds like you’re putting a plan together @ohmaaaan, cool.

what @IndigoSkye says is really pertinent. Yes, your children may not have a traumatic upbringing (though would no doubt be traumatised by the death of both parents), but other children in placement more than likely would have. Those are the children your children would be likely to be placed with.

on how the LA finds family, I have been ordered by a court on more than one occasion to use a private investigator, and courts will also order checks on dwp etc to find family members. You have to understand the family courts will go to quite serious lengths to avoid children being in long-term foster care.

i think if you have a really unsuitable family connection, it’s important to find and note an alternative in your wills. Relying on the state to step in isn’t really ideal.

Maybe, could you arrange to meet with the BIL's family a bit more often? One or two extra meets a year...

Do they have closer relatives in their area?

Focusing on having a solo bedroom in foster care sounds a bit odd, compared to the downsides of potentially being separated, placed together with children with bigger issues and out of area anyway...

My priorities would be 1) together 2) with a biggest chance of stability/permanent placement.

Your son and daughter could share and would probably want to if recently orphaned. Like I said, putting them in foster care is risking them being sexually abused.

My eldest foster son is at university OP. He comes home most weekends and holidays. There are many wonderful foster parents who would move heaven and earth for their foster child but there are some who only do it for the money and don't go out of there way to try to make the foster child feel part of their family. It's hit and miss. If you have a friend who could take them or a grandparent with an insurance policy that might be best for them. In foster care whilst SS do try to keep so longs together they are limited by which foster carers have a space. If siblings are different sex they won't be allowed to share a room.

Most likely they would go to a foster carer not local to friends, school and other activities. They can also have to change foster family during the years as it's a job not an adoption. They can even be splitted between foster families.

It's not pick and choose these days.
Their family if they can handle two children more is a much better choice for the children.

When my DCs were young, I made a massive effort to improve and sustain relations with family members, who like your relatives lived a long way away, so that 1) the children would be able to have a relationship with wider family, 2) they would hopefully be able to live with those relatives if they were left orphaned. I put down one of my siblings as guardian in my will. I'd suggest that you do the same - work on the relationship with your relatives. Make the effort (even if it's inconvenient and involves some expense and use of holiday time and you don't find it easy).

I admit I haven't rtft but here is my opinion as someone who works in foster care.

There is a huge push to keep families together. This has led to more children staying with family members who provide "good enough" care and the bar is low in what is expected of family members / their standard of living as it is deemed more important to keep children within the family. They also wouldn't consider the area as beeing as important as family ties, that would trump keeping them in the same school.

I haven't read why your bil and sil are ruled out by you but they not be ruled out by social services and a judge. If they themselves say no, absolutely not are we looking after the children they will look at anyone within your family or network. This could be cousins, aunts, uncles and living grandparents, friends of the family etc.

I would think it would be quite difficult to put children in care who had been orphaned but there were other family/ friends available.

However, im our area they do everything they can to keep siblings together. Thats a real priority. Plus as it would be long term, given the circumstances, that would hopefully mean there would be no (or very few) moves for the children.

Hopefully, this is never, ever needed but if family dynamics are difficult, its really worth looking into who is in your circle and if theres anyone at all who could look after the children that you would trust.

Foster carers are also occasionally bad people. Paedophiles /abusers/ just horrible people. Sometimes it's better the devil you know

I don't think this would work.

Parental responsibility cannot be passed along like a hand-off in a relay race. A will cannot say, "I appoint my friends, and they get to decide who actually takes my kids."

What you can do is appoint your friends as guardians and they can allow family members/others to do day to day care - but those friends would then have parental responsibility and need to take on responsibility for all sorts of things - education, health, looking after their money.

We are actually in almost exactly the same position and we have named BIL and SIL as guardians. Yes the kids would need to move. They don't know their uncle and aunt all that well but I wouldn't for a minute have considered leaving them in state care. Just spend a few mins looking at the outcomes for children in care. Sharing a bedroom is a picnic in comparison!

But all this would happen if they went to foster care? Whatever dream you have of people in the next street taking them in, it’s totally delusional.