You're not an Alcoholic!

[dogsaremybusiness]

I watched a documentary last night, and this woman was saying that alcoholism ran in their family (she was one), and she kind of blamed her Dad because he was an alcoholic too.

It transpired though, that her Dad enjoyed a drink between the ages of 21 and 29, and then he never touched another drop, for the following FIFTY years until his death.

However, he made money touring around and giving pep talks to alcoholics and recovering alcoholics.

AIBU to think that if you drank in your 20's (which most of us do) and then you are Tee total in your 30's, 40's, 50's 60's and 70's that you are NOT a fucking alcoholic, and maybe you just enjoyed making money by claiming that you were?

Really got my back up, as I am the DD of an alcoholic, and do really struggle to keep my own drinking under control.

No-one wins the game of "I have it worse than you". You don't know how much he's struggled against addiction in those years successfully not drinking, might be a torment to him that he's putting into helping others stay off it. Why criticise someone who seems to have successfully managed to live?

There are varying degrees of alcoholism but again, no point policing who has it worse or saying someone doesn't have it, no-one is the winner.

What the woman probably should have done is, instead of blaming her dad for her own alcoholism, she’d have been better off learning how to avoid going down the same path. My adult children know their dad’s alcoholism history so are vigilant over their own habits. Luckily no one appears to be even close to following his path (🙏🏼) and, thankfully, have very different natures to him.

I'm an ex smoker, and I consider myself a smoker who doesn't allow herself to smoke. I'd never call myself a 'non-smoker'.

Agree that it seems completely fine to give up drinking then go on to help others stop drinking

The same way that someone that leaves a dv relationship may go on to be an advocate, work for services for the rest of their life because they are passionate about it

But you called yourself an ex smoker there - not a smoker in recovery.

I stopped smoking years ago and I had a few puffs of my husbands vape - straight back to nicotine addiction with absolutely no in between. It just lies dormant waiting stealthily for its opportunity to snare you again

I think this is close to the bone for you because you are struggling with alcohol, to the extent that your aim isnt to stop but is to find a way to keep alcohol in your life somehow

Growing up with an alcoholic father would leave an impact. In the same way my relationship with food is linked to my mum constantly thinking about what she was eating. Alcohol still ends up playing a big role often in peoples lives after they are dry, because they are constantly having to maintain soberness often.

There is also evidence of potential genetic links to alcoholism.

It depends how much her dad was drinking in his twenties, and how hard it was for him to stop. I absolutely knew alcoholics in my twenties... there is a big difference between enjoying a drink while out with friends (which obviously happens very regularly when you're young) and - to give some examples of people I knew - drinking every single day whether you're seeing friends or not; nicking bottles from the corner shop because you can't afford to actually buy all the alcohol you drink; calling in sick to work on a weekday because you're still drunk from the night before (which you spent alone on the sofa in front of the telly); walking in the pouring rain to buy wine at 10am on a Saturday morning because you need wine that much. Those are the actions of an alcoholic, as opposed to someone who gets drunk 3-4 times a week because they enjoy drinking with friends, but if there's no social event then they just don't drink because they don't fancy it (as was my case). It doesn't matter if you're "only in your 20s". If you feel the need to be constantly drunk, you're an alcoholic. And alcoholics do tend to struggle with it for life, and staying sober requires constant effort.

Also, When people talk about alcoholism running in families, they are usually suggesting there's a genetic element to addiction that makes some people more susceptible. So in that case, it doesn't matter whether you experienced growing up with an alcoholic dad, or not, the simple fact he was an alcoholic might impact your own chances of becoming one, the same way as if your mum had breast cancer you need to be careful yourself.

Because I was quoting a post that referred to people like me as 'ex smokers'. I was saying, 'I'm one of them (an ex smoker as referred to in PP's post), and I consider myself a smoker that doesn't allow herself to smoke, rather than a non-smoker.

I absolutely am 'a smoker in recovery', although I wouldn't use that terminology.

I absolutely know I could never, and will never in my life time, be able to have a few social cigarettes without becoming a full blown, addicted smoker again.

he drank for 8 years FIFTY years ago - what a shame to identify as that for all that time later

It is precisely because he 'identified' as an alcoholic, or in other words realised he was an alcoholic who could never drink normally, that he was able to keep sober for fifty years.
Far from being a shame, that realisation was a blessing; it is what kept him alive.

I would love to cut my drinking down to twice a week. If I manage that for even a year, I think by then I would describe myself as an ex alcoholic who now drinks moderately

In my experience, that is very unlikely to happen. An alcoholic has no ability to moderate. One drink is one too many, because during the first, the button flips in their brain and then they cannot stop. It is this inability to drink moderately or 'normally' that makes them alcoholic.

Set yourself the goal of not drinking at all, not a drop, for a year.
If your mind recoils in horror at the thought of such a goal, that is the problem: you don't want to stop.

You want to drink 'normally': that may not be possible.
Your choices may be to go totally teetotal for life, or carry on drinking yourself into an early grave.

@dogsaremybusiness …„If I manage that for even a year, I think by then I would describe myself as an ex alcoholic who now drinks moderately“ …. I would suggest this is what is triggering you though ( in addition to all the trauma you have suffered yourself) , because you know inside that the definition of an alcoholic in the midst of their addiction is someone who can’t stop drinking or ever be a moderate drinker….hence why people class themselves as being in lifelong recovery, once they achieve sobriety , as they know they can’t drink again without risking triggering that addiction. If someone has made it their life’s work to help others ,this is a way to help themselves stay sober at the same time.

Keep an eye on the grandchildren. Sometimes it skips a generation, and can reappear, especially if there is an addiction tendency in the family your DC marry into (i.e. the grandchildren's other family).

Exactly this. Many people who binge drink socially in their 20s are able to transition quite seamlessly to having one or two glasses of wine with dinner on a Friday night later in life with no problem. The ones who go tee-total are the ones who can't even have a sniff of booze without relapsing - i.e., alcoholics.

Im also the child of an alcoholic, They are apprently sober now but Im yet to be convinced. I think alcohol decency becomes a bad habit long before it becomes an addiction, so yes some people in their early 20s can be on the road to alcohol dependency but get a hold of it and break the habit, others can’t.

An alcoholic is an alcoholic. No matter how long you have stayed clean for, if you once drank until your eyeballs could see your brain and drinking again would cause you to get to that place again then you will always be an alcoholic.

I don’t know what the documentary was, but it is also entirely possible that this was a scammer. Only they know what they know.

An alcoholic will always been an alcoholic, whether they are in active addiction or not.

I understand why some people wouldn’t want to label themselves as an alcoholic if they have been sober for 20 plus years, and that’s fair, but the underlying addiction will always be there.

As many have said, we can’t tell. It’s the nature of the drinking, the underlying behaviour and the relationship with alcohol that defines whether a person is an alcoholic - not the amount and length of time it goes on for or the giving it up.

If this guy was unable to function for those years because he could not get through the day without a drink, was unable to skip a day, unable to stop after one pint, unable to cope with socialising without a ‘loosener’ or six, then yes he would be within his rights to consider himself an alcoholic.

However, there are also periods of life, especially in the 80s/90’s when I was growing up, when people in their 20’s did drink a lot but would never today consider themselves not have been alcoholic. It was a lifestyle choice, a socially driven norm, where drinking was simply an unquestioned aspect of ‘clubbing’/going to the pub with mates. Many of us did it, then got bored - or ran out of money when we bought homes/had kids.

Only the individual concerned can know which camp of drinker they were/are in - but I do feel even in that second camp, we minimised and overlooked problem drinkers in our group, especially amongst men. One of our dear friends died of alcoholism leaving a wife and son behind. Many of my peers, myself included, still drink too much as older people/nearing retirement because ‘wine o’clock’ when the kids were in bed or a few pints after work was part of the social culture, and -compared to how we drank in the 80/90s - we drink much less, so we can’t have a problem, right?

Am heartened that my DC seem less enamoured by alcohol as a social lubricant because I do fear that there are many of us walking the line between socially accepted regular drinking and alcoholism but are deluding ourselves that we, personally, don’t have a problem.

Exactly. I don't think there's such a thing as a recovered alcoholic. It requires continual hardwork not to relapse.

You can only decide for yourself something like that.

I think with these things - we don't get to define other people or their experiences. Everybody does that for themselves. But I totally reject the premise that somebody who hasn't drunk for decades can't be an alcoholic. The point is that for everybody who is an alcoholic, drink is simply never allowed to be a casual non-issue. People who or or have been alcoholic can never just have one glass of fizz because it's a wedding or Christmas, they can't make that decision as a light 'oh go on then' thing. Ever. And so yes, they are still alcoholic, and can describe themselves as that if they wish.

Op if you really think your drinking has become an addiction rather than a bad habit then now is the time to do something about it. Let this triggering documentary be your lightbulb moment. It wont be easy

I’m also an ex-smoker but never think of myself as a smoker. I would hate that have a fag nowadays the idea is revolting. It’s almost 19 years since I had a drink & 17 years since I last had a cigarette.

'And so yes, they are still alcoholic, and can describe themselves as that if they wish'

Yes but the guy in the op was making money touring and speaking about his limited experience. A few years of heavy drinking in his 20s 50yrs ago hardly made him an expert by any stretch of the imagination.

If someone has been sober for a couple of weeks, they might find it encouraging to meet someone who hasn't drunk alcohol for 30 years.

Once an addict, always an addict.

That's why, at meetings, people introduce themselves as "My name is XX and I'm an alcoholic" to remind themselves that they are always an alcoholic, and they always need to be aware of that, so that they don't slip back onto it.

There is a difference between an untreated alcoholic and a recovered alcoholic, but you don't stop being one, ever.

I have several alcoholic family members. Some of them haven't had a drink for decades but are still very active in AA. They act as mentors for people who aren't as far along in their journeys, but they do still go for themselves, because they need to keep that awareness up.

I also know people that still go to alanon, even though their relatives haven't drunk for years. The effects don't go away overnight.

Your view is very simplistic, your anger is quite misplaced, and yes, YABU.